HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Press, Volume LI, Issue 8898, 14 September 1894, Page 5

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Thttbsday, September 13. ; AJ?TERtfOQN SITTING. The House met at 2.30. QUESTIONS. ; Replying to Mr McGowan'e question whether the Government would consider the necessity of having cyanide eolation used in gold savings Mr SttDDUN said Mr Cadman had giveu this matter his attention, and the Govern* nient thought that by improving the process in use at the Thames there, would he no necessity for taking the action asked for. However, the Government would do their beat in the interests of tbe industry. Replying to Captain Russell. Mr BKDDON said the Public Works Statement would be brought down as soon as the Government knew what money woold be available. It was proposed to take the second reading of the: Cheap Money BUI tomorrow, and to proceed with the Native Land Purchase add Reading proposal*, ac as soon as the House had disposed of those measures tbe Government would be in a position to efcate what euma could tw pot cm the Public Works Estimate* to give rifceft to those proposals. Eeplying to Mr E. M. Smith, Mr i. McKWIIS said there were fifteen applteatious fotf bonus No. 1, and nine Jot bonus No, 2 for the encouragement and'Uttprovament of the fUx indoetry; feat he thought it better to-wait till the judges bad seat in their report, as to the merits or demerit* of the machines and processes before taking farther feotioa. Replying to Mr Thompson, Mr REEVES said it ww true tfcaft e> number pi men had been sent from Ohrisfcchuroh to Hokiaoga to work on the railway. Hfr wa» not aware that a large aumber of men in tbe Hiknrangl were nsemployed ftad io. distressed ciroumst«noe». He «aw no reason why men in oities should be deprive 4of work on railways as if that were the ease, they should no 6be called on to pay taxes. cane amalgamation; Mr WARD Btetea that the Governmeafe had received propcosala from the representatives of the Bank of $Jew Zealand aod the Coloniftl Bank, These gentlemen bftdMorwarded for the amalgaxaation; of the two Banka, The Grovernmeutt woold considar the propojMoß,,aud lay them before the House on 'Tuesday. Xxt the meantime nothing would be dope till affcet the Gtovern* inent) had deoided what course, they weald take on the proposal*, waleh were o! t> rery

important nature, and would require careful consideration. He understood that certain statements had been sent through' the colony respecting the intentions of the Government on this matter, but the proposals wet c of a distinctly confidential character, and no information whatever had been given, by the Government on them. The House should accept with caution the statements sent out, as they were not authorised by the Government.

Captain RUSSELL a*ked whether the propositions to be made bjr the Government would be laid before the House.

Mr WARD said ho did not say there would be any propositions from the Government. The iioiurc would be advised of the intentions of the Government in the matter. Captain RUSSELL said he wanted the Treasures: to inform the House that they would not be asked to discuss those proposals without having sufficient time to consider them. Mr WARD replied that sufficient time would be given. In reply to Mr Bell, Mr WARD said the proposals would be printed for the information of the House. THB LABOUR DEPARTMENT. Mr THOMPSON moved tl«8 adjournment of the House to enable him to protest against tlie reply given by ilr Reeves to his question. He took strong objection to men being sent trom Christchurch to his district, when there were so many men out of employment there. He strongly attacked the ' administration of the Minister for Labour and his department, and said that working men when they; asked for work were frequently insulted by the Labour officials. If the bone and sinew of the coantry were to be treated as paupers by the Labour Department the sooner that department was abolished the better. Mr REEVES was at a loss to understand why the member for Marsuen should on every occasion go ont of his way to make personal attacks upon him and condemn his Department; Hβ defended h\s action in eending a score of men to Hikurangi, and said they, being taxpayers, were just as much entitled to be sent there as anyone else. It the dictum were adopted that only local men should be employed on public works, all hopes of dealing with the nuemployA difficulty would be at an end. He denied absolutely that working men were insulted by the Department, or that they were afraid to approach the officials. If the member for Marsden was so opposed to the administration of the Government, how was he had supported them all the time they had been in office? His proper place, if he really entertained such opinions aa he bad given utterance to, was with the Opposition. After a lengthy discussion, the motion for adjournment lapsed. * NEW ZEALAND CONSOLS. The New Zealand Consols Bill was introduced by message from the Governor and read a first time. BILLS PASSED. The New Zealand Land. Company's Claimants Act Amendment Bill and the Westland and Nelson Coalfields Administra- . tion Ace Amendment Bill passed through Committee withont amendment, were read <4he third time and passed. GOVEHNMENT RAILWAYS. Mr SEDDON moved the re-committal of the' Government Railways Act Amendment} Bill for the consideration of certain clauses. Carried. .-.<■• The House rose at 5.30. EVENING SITTING. The House resumed at 7.30 p.m. GOVEENMEST. KAILWAYS. In Committee on the Government Railways Bill, several technical amendments were made in various clauses. Clause 3 was altered so as to give the Railway Commissioners twelve months' engagement from the date of their appoint-< tnent instead of nine months. Mr SBDDON, in proposing a new clause, which gave power to the Government -to make regulations for classification and to regulate admissions into the railway service, said he had consulted' with the Railway Commissioners, and-they agreed that it would be impossible at present to put in a concrete form their classification scheme in this Bill. The matter would be gone into thoroughly, and if it were found that a classification scheme, such as that in operation in the Post and Telegraph Department, were feasible, the Legislature , would be asked next year to consider. such an Act. He explained that he intended to ask the House to assent to the Bill coming into operation on the let of January next.

Mr U. W. RUSSET L moved, in addition to the Premier's clause—" That a return be laid on the table at the commencement of each session, showing the number of men in the service, with the salaries they receive." Agreed to. Mr BUICK moved a farther addition to the clause, to provide that no person should be appointed to the-general management: close of the railways, save as officers are appointed in other Departments of the Civil Service; that no person should be appointed to the traffic or locomotive classes- save as experts are appointed in other departments of the service, that cadets should be nominated by members of the House in alphabetical order, no member to have a eecoud nomination till every other member had had his ; that no person should be appointed to the traffio or locomotive classes unless he had passed the sixth Standard or its equivalent.

Lost by 43 to 16, and the Premier's | clause, with the additions proposed by Mr ■ Kußsell, was agreed go. Mr SEDDON moved a farther new clause providing: fch&fc- the .Act shonltl" come into foroe oa the lac January next* Agreed to. \ • It was also agreed that clause 7, validating proclamations, should come into force at! once. I Dr.' NEWMAN moved in the schedule that, in addition to proclamations validating the North Island main trunk line, should be added " and all other Govern- ; toent lines. ,, "■ Mr SEDDON opposed the amendment, '• and'asked the Committee to negative it. ' ' After some discussion, Mr ruled j thai the amendment could not be pub from ! the Chair. The Bill was reported with amendments, which were ordered to be considered next day; HASTINGS LOAX. Mr WARD moved the second reading of the Hastings Borough Loan Validation and Empowering BilL Agreed to. UCEXBING BILL. MrSEDDON moved the second readins of the Licensing Bill, to consolidate and amend, the -laws regulating the -sale of intoxicating liquors, fie ventured to.assert that the Bill would be found co be a pretty good measure in the interests of all parties. It would be impossible, he held, to please extreme temperance reformers, who had by their intemperance on this question prevented reform. The Bill at any rate ■would, he hoped, meet with the approval of those who really wished reform in the liquor traffic The first question to be . asked was whether there was necessity for this BilL He held there was. The Act of last year had proved defective in some respects. The public mind was now ripe for. remedying those defects, and. his opinion was that it would be better for the members and the country that this question should be settled definitely this session. Next session other questions would engage the attention of the House, and the Government desired to pass the Bill this session. The defects of last year were apparent in that the issues submitted to the people were not simple enough. Another defect was that by the poll of one-half many people did not vote at all, and that required remedying. There was another serious defect . in last yew's Bill, . namely, that no provision was made for national prohibition, as the BUI was confined to localities. There was only one locality that declared for total prohibition. Some of the temperance advocates declared that if facilities were afforded for taking a poll for total prohibition 7 the result would have been in favour of that course; but that was open toquestion. Beheld, therefore, it was as weU to afford an opportunity for such a poll being taken, and the Government had been requested to afford that opportunity both by the liquor traie and by the temperance Mction of tiie community. Hβ had every confidence that the BUI would meet the approval of th« majority of the

I people. There were three issues in the I Bill,- namely, reduction of licenses, national prohibition, and local prohibition. He believed that the majority would be in favonr of -a reduction. He also believed th&c the majority would be found iin some districts for total prohibition, i whilst in others the majority would be against it. By adding tiie two together, however, it would be seeu, for the first time, what the opinion of the men and women of the colony was on this important question. It had been objected that, by uvkiug a poll on the same day aa a general election, they would be mixing the question up with general politics j but he held that, whether the poll were taken on an election day or any other day, it most be mixed up with general politics. They should also strive to get in the largest possible number of votes either for or against the great reform ia liquor traffic, and -they could never get sticb a large vote taken on any other day as on a general election day. There was then the question of expense, which should be considered. By this Bill the wholeot the expense was thrown on the taxpayers, and it would not cost Laif aa much to take the poll on the general election day as it would cost if the licencing elections were held on a special day. The Government did not hold strong opinions with respect to tbe election of Committees, and local knowledge in affairs of this kind was an important factor. If the House wished to reduce the cumber on Committees it could be simply done. The Government insisted that the Stipendiary Magistrate should be retained in Committee as Chairman, but he did not desire to take any local representatives from the Committee. There were several other amendments in this Bill which were not of such vital importance. He held that bottle licenses had been a curse, aud the sooner power to abolish those licenses was taken -the better for all concerned, lo was also proposed in tbe Bill that the majority of a Committee should grant conditional licensee, instead of two members as formerly. He should also be willing to allow.four gallons to be sold instead of five. The Government proposed to do away with wine licenses, because in districts where prohibition might be carried large numbers of those wine sliops might spring up which would probably sell something stronger than wine in their shops. Those who were satisfied with the Bill need do nothing to impede its progress, whilst those who were opposed to it would do well to meet the defects that existed boldly and deal with them. He referred to several other alterations made in the Bill, one of which was that no new Native licensing districts should be constituted. The Government had also been asked to exercise some control over small steamers, where a large amount of liquor was sold, and that would be dealt with in Committee. Referring to the position of Clubs, he did not see why there I should be one Jaw for hotelkeepere and another law for Clubs. Any ! Club would not object to the provisions of this Bill, and lie felt sure that, although some of the Working Men's Clubs objected to this provision, the wives of working, men would not do so. The Government had been twitted with not being sincere in their desire to pass this Bill; but that was a charge that should nob be lightly made. They were convinced that the time "was ripe r for this great'question to be dealt with, and they had bronght the Bill down as soon as possible. He hoped when the Bill got into Committee, members would respect the convictions of those opposed to them, and would do their beet to make the Bill a workable measure..

Mr McNAB agreed with Mr Seddon that the Bill shoald not be discusaed at any great length on its second reading if they desired to see it get into Committee. He regretted that the Bill had been brought down as a consolidating measure instead of an amending Bill, as some of the greatest defects in the Bill of last year could be remedied by an amending Bill this year. Another, objection to a consolidating Bill wae also that Bills of that kind were iuvariably sent to the Statutes Revision Committee, and as thac Committee had already three of the largest consolidating measures that were ever before the House, there was very little chance of the Bill becoming law this session if it went to that Committee. He should not express an opinion on the Bill at that stage, as he was anxious to see it set into Committee without delay. Mr COLLINS was as anxious "as any: man in the House to discuss the details of the Bill in Committee, but this was ,a very important matter. It was* .quite a question whether the Bill was demanded by the country. It had been demanded by so clamorous a section that Parliament had determined to take the matter up and deal with it. Referring to the Club question, he hoped other Clubs than those of working men should be regulated by this Bill. He spoke as a lifelong total abstainer, bat he feared that they might still pass intemperate legislation, which would do the cause more harm than good. He believed in a majority.rule as soundly as the Premier, but there were some, instances in .which the rule of the majority was not. a just rule. This Bill was brought in to satisfy the temperance people, but they would never be satisfied till they got total prohibition. There were many points in the Bill which he should desire to see amended, but as he was anxious to see the Bill get into Committee, he should not refer to them at present. . Mr HONE HERE said he should like to see Native districts made prohibitive, and he should move in Committee to that effect.

Mr SAUNDERS was very much pleased with the Premier a speech. Hβ recognised that the Premier had met them very fairly indeed. He objected, however, to the constitution of the iiiceasing Committee which he thought was a seriour blot on the Bill. He believed, however, in having the poll, taken on the same day as the general election, but he saw no reason why the Committee should not also be elected on that day ; »«d be hoped the Premier would see his way to alter the Bill ia that direction in Committee. Mr SEDDON was pleased to see that the House had received the Bill as it had done. With respect to Mr McNab's contention, he aaserled an amending Bill would take much longer to discuss than a consolidating measure. There was a difficulty respecting the Committee, as pointed out by Mr Saunders, "but he could not agree, to the proposal to elect the Committee on the same day as the general election. ■ The Bill was neither a publicans and brewers' Bill, nor was it brought in in the interests of the extreme Temperance party. The Bill was, he felt sure, a workable measure, which would aeitle this important question for a long time to come. The second reading was then agreed to on the voices, the committal of the BUF being set down for next day. MINING COMPANIES BILL. I Mr SEDDON moved the second reading of the Mining Companies Bill. Agreed to. BANKBUPTCY. Mr SEDDON moved the second reading of the Bankruptcy Act Amendment Bill, which he desired to send to the Statutes Revision Committee. Agreed to. CRIMINAL CODE. The Criminal Code Act Amendment Bill was committed. - Clause 2, age of consent;. Mr SEDDON moved to strike out the word " fifteen " and substitute " sixteen. ,. Agreed to. . > Mr MILLS moved a new clause allowing any criminal trial for murder held since lan January, 1889, to be reviewed. This, he explained, was designed to allow the case of Louis Chemis co be taken to a Court of Criminal Appeal. Considerable debate ensued, and was not I finished when the Telegraph Office closed.