Fair Play INTERVIEWS.

Fair Play, Volume I, Issue 13, 27 January 1894, Page 6

Fair Play INTERVIEWS.

Mr. E. Tregear, Secretary of the Department of Labour and Chief Inspector'of Factories, is one of the deservedly prominent men in the civil service of New Zealand. As a speaker, as a literary man, and as a scientist, his name is well known throughout the colony, and - as a practical philanthropist, endowed with a tact that disguises true charity under the mantle of mere temporary aid to a brother in distress, he is without an equal. Mr. Tregear has been in New Zealand now for 30 years, and has been a recognised factor in the evolution of the colony, from semi-civilisation to its present prosperour state. He served as a soldier in the majority of the difficulties with the natives, and did good service for the state as surveyos and civil engineer in the days when a man risked his life daily in that kind of Government work. He has been connected with the Government on and off ever since he came to New Zealand, but about thirteen years ago entered the service permanently, and three years ago when the Labour Bureau was formed was placed in control. Notwithstanding his labours as pioneer, engineer, and soldier, Mr. Tregear has found time to devote his attention to science and literature. Having made a thorough study of the Maori language from a philological point' of view, he brought out in 1891 a Maori comparative Dictionary that has been generally recognised as the best authority on the subject. He has also produced a work entitled “ Fairy Tales of New Zealand and the South Seas,” which is particularly interesting as much for the fund of information it contains, as for its literary merit. Mr. Tregear is a Fellow of the Royal Geographical Society, the Royal Historical Society, the Imperiallnstitute, the Anthropological Institute, member

of the Philological Society, London, &c., and is also a Governor of the New Zealand Institute. It goes without saying that the subject of our sketch is a busy man, but in his few leisure moments it would be difficult to find a more courteous host or agreeable conversationalist. With a view of sharing with ou r readers the pleasure of a few minutes chat with Mr. Tregear a representative of Fair Play called upon him at his offices in the Government Buildings, one day this week. The reporter was directed to Mr. Tregear’s private office, and on making known the object of his visit was most courteously received. “ I don’t quite approve of the'American system of interviewing, Mr. Fair Play,” was his first remark, “ but since you have been kind enough to pitch upon me as a subject, any information that I can give you is at your disposal.” “Well, Mr. Tregear, I have no series of categorical questions to put,” was the reply, “except, perhaps, one or two indispensible ones, such as 1 What is your native place ? When did you come to New Zealand ?’ &c., but what I really want is for you to tell me something of yourself and your experience in the colony ?”

“ Your programme, Mr. Fair Play, is certainly comprehensive,” said the subject of our sketch with a smile, “and if I were to fill it conscientiously, would probably provide you with more matter than you would have space for, still I will do what I can for you. To commence at the beginning, lam a Cornishman by birth, my people being numbered amongst one of the oldest families in Cornwall.”

“ When did you come to New Zealand, Mr. Tregear ?”

“ In 1863, I was educated in England and received a good training as a Civil Engineer, but I had a natural tendency to travel, and took advantage of the opportunity offered me to come to the colonies.”

“ I suppose things were somewhat different then from what they are now, Mr. Tregear ?” “ Yes, very different. Auckland in 1863 and Auckland to-day are two very different places,” “ You came direct to Auckland then, Mr. Tregear ?” “ Yes, and remained in the northern part of the island for some time, in fact it is only comparatively recently that I came to Wellington.” “ When you first came out, Mr. Tregear, you did not at once go into the Government service, I suppose; may I ask what you went in for ?” “ Certainly; from the time I landed I turned my attention to surveying, and I found plenty of work ready to my hands. My first work was in the broken country north of Auckland, then after that surveyors were wanted by the Government in the country closely bordering on the King Country. The pay was very good, as the work was particularly dangerous, for I need hardly tell you that matters between the Maoris and ourselves were hardly on the footing that"* 3 hey are at the present time.’

“ No, I suppose not, but when you first arrived the friction was not as strong as it became afterwards was it ?” “No, still a man working on the borderland carried his life in his hands, for one never knew when trouble might break out. The life was one of a pioneer, and the duties connected with it were arduous in the extreme.”

“It was then, I suppose, that you laid the groundwork of of the Maori tongue and customs

“ Yes, for months and months I didn’t know what it was to see a European and naturally became very familiar with their ways. Although looked upon as apakeha ati first, they soon got to know me and as a bushman to a certain extent I adopted their habits and became assimilated to their ways,”

You"! were working for the Government then, Mr. Tregear ?” “ Yes, at that time there was considerable talk about the confiscated land, and I was acting as surveyor for the Native Lands Court, my work often taking me far beyond the confiscation line into the King Country.” “ Did you ever have any trouble with the Natives ?” “ With the Hau Hau, yes, they seemed to be in a perpetual pickle with the whites, and as you probably know the numerous petty skirmishes, finally grew into a racial war.” “You were mixed up in most of the differences between the natives and the Government, were you not, Mr. Tregear ?” “ Yes, as one of the early pioneei's and a servant of the Government I did not escape the experience similar to others in those days, and having had considerable experience with the natives and come out of one or two engagements with some credit to myself, I was placed in command of the Waikato Native Contingent. There was very little fighting done however, after the regiment had been raised, as most of our work consisted in picketing or policing the district where we had been stationed.”

“ Were you working for the Government continuously in the early day, Mr. Tregear ?” “No, not right along, I might say my work was to a certain extent intermittant. When the goldfields were discovered on the Thames I, with many others, went there, and for some time acted as goldfield surveyor on my own account in the district; as a matter of fact I also worked as an ordinary miner.”

“But you were doing work for the Government on the Coromandel Peninsula, were you not ?” “ Yes, I did considerable surveying work there, especially in the neighbourhood of Mercury Bay, as a matter of fact I was always off and on with the Government during the first 15 years of my stay in New Zealand, and many of my present friends were comrades in the old days. Mr. Ernest Bell and Mr. Harry Hadfield, a son of the bishop, were working with me when I was acting as draughtsman in the Government office.” “But weren’t you connected with the Boyal Commission which decided on the question of the confiscated native lands, Mr. Tregear ?” “ Yes, I was the official surveyor for the Government at the time and most of the work, if not all of it, passed through my hands.”

“ When did you join the Government service permanently ?” “ About 13 years ago, and then to a certain extent through the influence of Sir William Fox and Sir Francis Dillon Bell. The work that I had done was approved of, and my experience with the Maoris and topographical knowledge of the country made me (if I may say so for myself) a desirable addition to the Government staff.” “ And since then, Mr. Tregear ?”

“ Since then I have done various Government work until the Labour Bureau was started about three years ago. Mr. Ballance and Mr. Beeves, both personal friends of mine, thought that I was the best suited man in the service to fill the position of chief, and I was consequently transferred to Wellington and given control of the department.” “ Ah! that brings us to the subject that I want to talk to you about particularly, Mr. Tregear. Is the unemployed question in New Zealand, one which you find it difficult to deal with ?”

“Well, it takes a great deal of consideration to deal with it equitably and properly, but things are not quite as bad as the newspapers would make the public believe. There are certainly a number of unemployed in New Zealand, but when we compare the population of the colony with New South Wales and Victoria, the proportion is all in our favour. If a man is willing to work there is generally an opening for him here.” “But to classify the subject. Mr. Tregear, don’t you think that in contrasting New Zealand with the other colonies there is less chance for a man. to make his living by his brains here than on the other side ?”

“ Well, perhaps your are right in that particular. There is not much of an opening fqr professional men in the colony, in fact I may go further and say that there is not as good a chance here for skilled labour as there is on the other side, but for the man who is healthy and strong and willing to work there is

generally a pretty good opportunity, if not in the town protty surely in the country.” “ I suppose in the course of a month or so you have a great many apply to you for work ? “ Yes, we have applications from people of all grades and conditions, but the great fault is that thoy dofor their applications until the very last minute, and then expect us to give them work at once, this, of course, is impossible, as in justice to ourselves and the applicant, it is necessary to mako inquiries, and in addition it is necessary to know if wo can sond an applicant direct either to Government or private employment. When I first took charge of the department I used to ondoavour to find work at once for every applicant, and if 10 or 12 came I shipped them to somo town or district whoro I had been informed labour was wanted, but I soon found that that would not do. Complaints come to the bureau from the different towns and districts, that we wero flooding them with loafers and. mon who would not work, since then wo have boon more caroful and the results have been more satisfactory." “ What is the systom, if I may ask, that you pursue in dealing with the ordinary applicant T' “In the first place wo always give married mon, whorovor they come from, the preference. In doaling with singlo men we generally give New Zealanders, who aro on our books, a chanoo for employment in advance of strangers from other colonios. We never send a man into the country on the chanco of his getting work when he arrives, our system is to send a man to somo definite place where the work is ready for him, and ho can commence at it at once. To carry out this plan you can easily see that time for inquiries is required and it is naturally impossible to find work for every applicant at once.” “ In sending men up the country to work, does the Government pay their fares '?"

“ Well they do and theydont; if we have a billot for a man a hundred miles or bo out of town wo pay his faro to his destination, but it is on,the understanding that it is only a loan, and that as soon as he can he will pay it back. Wo find that this system works much better than any other. For the salco of illustration, a man comes to me wanting employment I am perhaps able to find him a place. He has not enough money to carry him there, under those circumstances, I say ‘ you represent supply, I represent demand, your work is wanted at a certain place, I will forward you there, and you will pay me as soon as you can out of your earnings, the expense I have been put to in placing you in a position whereby you can get a return for your labour.’ The beauty of this system is that the applicant need in no way feel that he is accepting charity, he merely comes to the Government as an intermediary for work, and we, as agents, endeavour to find it for him, the expense incurred in forwarding him to the market where his labour will sell to advantage is a loan which is almost invariably repaid.’’ “But don’t you often have applicants, who forget to repay ?”

“At first we did, but there are very few now who neglect to remunerate us for our outlay out of their first earnings. You see we have some 200 agencies throughout the colony, and if we keep a man and he deliberately attempts to defruud the Government by neglecting to pay, he is soon known and loses his employment; furthermore, ne stands a very poor chance of getting other work either from private individuals or from the the Government.’’

“ I suppose you have sent a great many people up country during the last 12 months ?” “ Yes a great many have passed through the Bureau and been sent away. Our idea is to relieve the congestion in the cities as much as possible." “ Notwithstanding the fact that in proportion we have less unemployed than the other colonies, don’t you think that New Zealand is overrated ?*| “To a certain extent, perhaps yes. For professional men New Zealand is hardly the “ Promised Land,” but for manual labourers, farmers, &c., it is in all probability the best colony in the group. The country is even a better one for ordinary than skilled labour at present. There is not thei roomforbriMn workers or artisans that there is elsewhere, but who is able and willing to work with his hands New Zealand offers a field." ’ '' ‘ * . . & ,