Minds Over Matter

Rip It Up, Issue 111, 1 October 1986, Page 16

Minds Over Matter

Scotland Calling

Somebody once said that like the seasons, rock and roll is a cyclical phenomenon regenerating from reaction and counter-reaction, stasis then action, galvanised by the likes of Presley, the Beatles and the Sex Pistols. Within this convenient little theory, Simple Minds, over the last couple of years, have been cast as leaders in a return to a stadium rock mentality typified in the 70s by bands like Pink Floyd and Genesis: “Our album’s been in the chart for nearly a year and we did two shows at Milton Keynes and so it’s easy for us to be pigeon-holed J alongside those massive stadium rock bands of the 70s. I think we have it in control and I see it as a challenge to play those places. We’re not afraid to play them and I don’t see why we should pay for mistakes made by bands in the 70s. “People say to me that they preferred us when we played in small clubs. I think that’s complete nonsense because it may have felt intimate, but the band at that stage couldn’t communicate with anyone. Whereas we can get to the back of those places because the music’ is big enough.” C

band of that phase and provided the transition into bigger but not necessarily better things: “We loved New Gold Dream" continued Jim

Kerr from the band’s rehearsal house just outside London, “and we saw it as being complete and so there was no point in trying to hold on to it. I remember mixing it and thinking that we’d arrived as a band in that we finally had the balance right between our influences and our own vision. We then went and played live and at that time we were doing a lot of open air festivals and stadiums and when we went into the studio the first thing we wrote was ‘Waterfront’ which had the dynamics to fill any stadium. We never tried to do that, it just happened.” With the release of ‘Waterfront’ the good press that Simple Minds had enjoyed came to an end: “Yeah it was panned by a lot of people and the bad press we’ve been getting is the result of sheer laziness and elitism. Our music has changed and if we didn’t change we’d get panned but I think the heart and soul of the music hasn’t changed. I think it’s the technicalities of the band that are getting rubbished rather than the band itself. In the last few months people who’d written us off have said how good it was live but I haven’t seen it in print much.”

Before Simple Minds recorded the follow-up to New Gold Dream, they played a few dates with U2, whose influence was to become apparent on Sparkle in the Rain:

“We were very impressed by their courage and we did have a lot in common apart from the Celtic blood, we did share a vision. Although they came out and named their gods and Simple Minds have never done that, and they’re much more outwardly political. When we met I think we did influence each other”

From Soul to Dynamics New Gold Dream was an album made by innocents; its dewey-eyed beauty and romantic optimism were perhaps too precious to be anything other than temporary.. ‘Waterfront’ purged the

“I was with Bono and Edge very recently and Edge kept saying that when they were making The Unforgettable Fire they wanted to have their own New Gold Dream. That hasn’t been picked up as being obvious. They were a huge influence on us but mainly through their sense of destiny. They weren’t afraid to take on what was on their plate and at the time Simple Minds needed to see that, as we’d never felt part of a movement.” When Sparkle in the Rain came out its up-front big sound smack gave you the impression that here indeed was a gigantic record. But the sound only disguised the fact that the songs, for the most part, weren’t up to scratch: “I kick myself when I hear it because when it first came out I didn’t want to hear it at all, I was very disappointed. I thought we’d sold our soul to dynamics instead of writing good songs. When I hear it now I hear great'ideas that we should’ve taken further down the road.”

Critics who wasted “Waterfront’ went on to well and truly rumble Sparkle in the Rain and failed to notice that there were a couple of really gorgeous songs in ‘Moon, Cry Like a Baby’ and ‘White Hot Day’: “Yeah, ‘Cry Like a Baby’ was the dark horse of the album. I was travelling in the car the other day and ‘Waterfront’ came on and I could see what we were trying to do there — we just wanted to do a song that cut through, and it didn’t half cut through when it came on the radio. It sounded like the engine of a huge boat. So I’m really proud of that one. ‘Easter, Easter’ is a great song and ‘White Hot Day’ is good. But I guess that’s it. “But we had to do the album that way. We worked with Steve Lillywhite and that added to the U2 thing. He was a great guy to work with but he was more the ‘you’re a great band, you’ve got a great vibe, so go and put it down’ sort of producer. So what we put down was the vibe of the band as opposed to the songs.”

At about this time bassist Derek Forbes left the band:

“I guess the truth has to come out now, he didn’t leave, he was asked to leave, which was a big crisis for the band as you don’t dismiss people just like that. We’d been having problems with Derek for about two years but because we were such mates we’d put it off hoping things would get better. But we drifted apart and his heart wasn’t in it and everything began to go, his politics went weird as well and he got involved with a lady and that turned his head. And we were sitting there with songs and no bass lines. Anyway we were sitting in the place we’re in now, which is owned by our current bass player, John Giblin, and we were waiting on Derek and John was in the back room with his bass but without a job. It’s funny how situations somehow suggest themselves. We had known John for years when he played for Gabriel plus he’s a Scotsman so he understands the sense of humour.

“It was tough, but a year’s gone by and we’re so much more of a band with John as he can make the band move in so many different ways, whereas Derek had only one way.” When Simple Minds first played here in 1982 they did two nights at Mainstreet. Virgin Records put on a reception for the band at their pad in Parnell. Derek Forbes was late for the reception as he’d got the better of a bottle of bourbon after the show the night before: “(Laughs) He’s a bastard, he really is. The saddest thing is he’s such a brilliant laugh, what a comedian, totally embarrassing as well. We needed someone like that especially in the early days when we were more precious. Derek was always good for breaking that. He’s playing for Propaganda now so he’s in good shape.”

Once Upon a Time in the West From a bank manager’s point of view, last year was Simple Minds’ most profitable: ‘Don’t You (Forget About Me)’ and the unjustly maligned

Once Upon a Time and its string of hits broke the band into the lucrative American market. Keith Forsey, the producer behind the horrendous Billy Idol, had plans for a song he’d written called ‘Don’t You (Forget About Me)’: “That’s the weirdest thing that has happened to the band. When we came off the Sparkle in the Rain tour we were in limbo as we just needed a bloody rest after six years work. So we stopped for a few months and it was great. But during the tour we’d been in LA and this guy Keith Forsey came up to us with this tape of a song for a movie theme.

“Mick and Charlie didn’t like his approach as he was only two minutes in the door and he was talking about publishing rights and we don’t work that way. So we never even listened to the tape for months. Finally we got these calls from America asking us to listen to it, and when we did it sounded like somebody doing Simple Minds by numbers. A few weeks later this Forsey turns up on our doorstep in Scotland. “He’s got this amazing energy and he talks and talks and we got to like him, but we thought that this movie could be a dodgy teenage thing for America, and that there’s probably one coming out every week. We saw it and we felt as far as those teenage movies go it had some class and we felt if we did the song it might give us a foot in the door to do the music for some amazing movie.

“At this stage we were only doing one song and it wasn’t going to be the single, so we thought ‘what the hell?’ It took us one day to do the song and we re-did the ending, and what do you know they release it as a single and it goes to Number One in America. I felt guilty about it because we did it so effortlessly and I just saw it as a strong piece of confectionary. “We’re very serious but sometimes you’ve got to drop it, and I get a kick out of doing it live as it breaks up the tension. I wish we had a couple more that had that effect.”

With critical tastes veering towards a twitching independent scene last year, it was no surprise that Simple Minds’ worthy Once Upon a Time was indolently dismissed as another stadium filler. Thay had shaken off the U2 brashness that plagued the feel of Sparkle in the Rain to come up with an album, although not the equal of New Gold Dream, that recaptured the band’s soul and songwriting ability in songs like ‘I Wish You Were Here,’ All the Things She Said’ and ‘Come a Long Way’:

“It was clear cut, for Once Upon a Time we wanted a focussed, modern class rock record. We wanted it to feature songs that had intros, codas, middle eights and choruses. We wanted it to have great dynamics and a great sound that only Bob Clearmountain could get. “For years we’d wanted to work with him but we were told he was out of our league. He’d done things from Chic to Bowie, Springsteen and Roxy Music. Everything he touches, even something like Bryan Adams, has this amazing energy and clarity. We wanted to work with someone who’d

worked with writers, so we went for Jimmy lovine as well, as he’d worked with Patti Smith, Lennon, Seger, Tom Petty — honest songwriters. If Clearmountain could get us the sound and lovine the focus, it would be great. “I went to see them and they hadn’t heard anyone from Scotland before and they hadn’t a clue as to what hit them. I just went in and said I want to make this fuckin’ brilliant album. I think they thought I was nuts, for they sent me away saying come back when you’ve got a few songs. And we did.

“Clearmountain was great but the real force turned out to be Jimmy lovine. He’s a Brooklyn Italian, it was like working with somebody from the Gorbals, a very earthy person. People we’d worked with before, no disrespect, were like public schoolboys. lovine was great at playing dumber than dumb and judging you and your best.’ And the songs? “ All the Things She Said’ was the last song we did for the album and when we got that one out I really did jump up and down because it was a beautiful song, one that we’d no chance of writing a couple of years ago. And the courage well get from a song like that will be great. Quite a lot of bands have come up to us to talk about it. I love the clarity of ‘Wish You Were Here’ and ‘Come a Long Way’ works well live.” This is Scotland Calling ...

At the time of this phoner Simple Minds were rehearsing their stuff for a live album that’s to be recorded during their present world tour in which New Zealand is their last port of call:

“People have been on at us for ages to do a live album but up till now it felt too predictable. Now we feel the band has a great sound and we’re very proud of the show as there’s new versions of songs that are absolutely stunning, if I do say so myself. And I think it is the definite end of a period and this album could be the full-stop in one chapter.” And the live show?

“In the first part of the tour the emphasis was on the last album but when we went out in the summer we started doing more of New Gold Dream. So it’s from the last three albums, and we also include stuff in the encores we’ve never done before. We’ve a really great singer with us called Robin Clark and now with new bass player John Giblin we’ve even tried Sly and the Family Stone songs. It appeals to us, not the cliched blackness, but the acidiness that Sly had.” After the tour?

“We’re gonna go back and live in Scotland and I think well be influenced there so our new songs could have a more ethnic softer sound. We’ve been playing with accordions and pipes here and we’ve got a couple of songs in us that could work with traditional arrangements, but not Big Country style. But to be honest I don’t know where we go from here."

At the moment the new Scottish bands like Jesus and the Mary Chain, Primal Scream, the Soup Dragons and the Shop Assistants are leading the way. Opinion? “I think they’re better than English bands (laughs). But I haven't had a chance to hearthem as we’ve been away for so long and when we

came back we played with Lloyd Cole. He doesn’t have the dynamics that I like, but I think it’s quality. Live, they’re very one dimensional. “With the Waterboys it’s completely up to Mike Scott as to what happens and he really has it in him to do great stuff, but he has trouble working with people as he’s a temperamental character. I like him a lot even though we’ve had clashes on tour.

“I still love the Cocteau Twins and I quite like Hipsway, but their good songs leave their bad songs a million miles behind and there's nothing in between. I told them not to put out their next album until they’ve got 10 songs as good as ‘The Honeythief’. ”

All in the Family And how’s the family? “Great. We’ve been feeling the pressures in the last 18 months. We met, got married and had kids at the busiest period of our lives. It’s helped me grow up a lot.” In case you’ve been living in limbo for the last couple of years, Jim Kerr of Simple Minds married Chrissie Hynde of the Pretenders. They say opposites attract and in this case that reads like an understatement. Kerr — romantic, idealistic enough to believe in the power and magic of rock’n'roll as an agent of change ... for the better; Hynde — cynical, pouting ex-NME writer whose acidic wit and songs dissolves the meek: “She’s amazingly tough on the exterior, but she’s a big softie. She’s calls a spade a spade. You’d look at her records and you’d think she’s very bitter but there’s a lot of love in her music.” What does she think of Simple Minds’ music? “She’s a huge fan. She hadn’t heard the band until we played with them. I met her in Australia in a lift and the first thing she said was ‘You’re the singer with that new romantic band,’ and I was shattered. And I said, ‘My name’s Jim Kerr and you’re Chrissie Hynde in’t ye? You used to be a good songwriter 1 And she was like , ‘Wow, how dare you.’ “But we got on well. That night in Sydney we really played well, one of our more psychedelic nights and it was just the kind of thing she was waiting to see as the British bands she’d seen had let her down. She was an instant fan.” Has she been accompanying you on the tour? “No, she’s got an album coming out and she’s been working on it the past year. And even then she’s her own woman, and she wouldn’t want to follow me around. While we’re in New Zealand she’ll have just started her own tour which is pissing her off because she loves New Zealand and it means something to us as we fell in love there." No Kerr-Hynde joint albums planned? “No, I’ve never felt like it. I’d never say no we wouldn’t, because the things that have happened in my life in the past few years I could never have predicted. I’m scared of saying things will never happen. But if she’s doing songs she should do them with Bob Dylan or somebody, and I’m more than a bit content working with Charlie Burchill and Michael Mac Neill.”

George Kay