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587. Then, on 20th October, 1877, you paid the Muaupoko another sum of £100 ? —Yes. 588. By the direction of whom ? —Of Kemp. 589. Where was this paid ?—At Horowhenua. 590. I was not present ?—No. 591. Nor at any subsequent occasion when money was paid?— No. 592. That payment, made on the 20th October, left a balance of the year's rent of £100?— Yes. 593. To whom was that balance paid?—To the tribe. 594. Your father died in 1878 ?—Yes. 595. Your next entry is a payment to me of £30, and Kemp £5, on the 6th August, 1879?— Quite so. 596. I have here an order which I will show you : Is this the £30 you refer to ? —Yes; the real amount, shown by the bill, appears to be £31 10s. 597. Then, on the 30th September, 1880, you have in your list, " Paid Ihaia and the tribe, £364 " : Is that the present Ihaia Taueki ?—Yes, the present one. 598. Where was this paid? —At Horowhenua. 599. By direction of whom ?—By order of Kemp and myself. 600. That left you, say, a balance of £100 to be paid to Muaupoko on their return from Turakina? —Yes. 601. The balance was paid on the 25th April, 1891? —Yes. 602. The next payment was the payment to Kemp at Eanana, on 30th June, 1881, of £200. Who took the money up to Eanana?—l took it. I had a letter from Kemp to go to a meeting and to take a couple of the chiefs, and also the rent. 603. Which chiefs did you take with you ? —Noa te Whata and, I think, Ihaia. A few of the Muaupoko accompanied them. 604. You handed the money over to Kemp ?—I did. 605. Do you know what Kemp did with it ?—I could not say. 606. The next payment was one of £300 on the 29th December, 1882, which was paid to Ihaia and the tribe. Where was that paid ? —At the Native pa at Horowhenua. 608. Kemp not being present ?—Yes. 609. This was paid by direction of Kemp ?—Yes. 610. The next payment was one of £150 on the 16th August, 1884, at Upokongaru ?—-Yes. 611. What was going on there?—l think a Land Court. 612. Were some of the Muaupoko there ?—I think so. 613. Then on the 25th April, 1885, was a payment of £300 made to Kemp at Palmerston ? —■ Yes. 615. What was going on when you took it up there ?—I will not be certain ; there was a meeting of some sort. 616. Were the Muaupoko there ?—I think some of them were there. 617. The last payment you made was in October, 1886, to Mr. Baker of £400: by whose direction was that? —Kemp's. 618. Was that for law-costs? —I could not tell you. 619.-So that, out of a sum of £2,249 paid by you, Kemp received directly only £655?— Yes. 620. From that date your brother, John McDonald, took up the running, and he has made payments since?— Yes. 621. Do you know about a payment of £1,300 made by your brother in one payment to the tribe ?—I know of it by hearsay ; I did not see it. 622. You told us that, in June, 1881, you paid Kemp £200. Here is a letter dated 4th September, 1880, which I will read. [Letter produced, marked Gα.] You acted on the orders from Kemp?— Yes. 623. How much did you pay in pursuance of this ? You have paid the rents either to Kemp direct or to the tribe by his direction ?—Yes. 624. From the date shown in the statement now put in all the payments have since been made by your brother, who succeeded to the tenancy?— Yes. 625. Mr. Baldwin.] You were living on Horowhenua, and about the lake for a very long time prior to the Court of 1873 ?—Yes. 626. Your father commenced his observations somewhere in 1857 or 1858 ? —Yes; more or less. 627. Do you say he originally leased the land from Te Whatanui alone ?—Yes. 628. That lease went on without interruption until the year 1869. Do you remember when Whatanui Tutaki died ? —I believe it was in January, 1869. 630. Immediately after his death, your father had some trouble with certain persons in connection with this land he is not leasing?— Yes. 631. Do you remember who caused the trouble? —Caroline Nicholson and her family. 632. Do you remember Tauteka Makere?—No. 633. At the time when this disturbance arose, who was Mrs. Nicholson married to ?—She was the wife of Nicholson, who lived near the Manawatu. 634. Did she live with him principally ?—-Yes. 635. From the time of the last Whatanui, was she still living with him ?—Yes. 636. Do you remember this woman Tauteka Makere, and who she was married to ?—Matene te Whiwhi, of the Ngatiraukawa. He was attempting to push his way north from Waiwiri, and the Ngatiraukawa were attempting to encroach on the Waiwiri side. Tauteka was the principal one that was encroaching from the south ; she was a sister of Caroline Nicholson. 637. Can you remember when the first disturbance took place? There was a certain amount of violence, was there not ? —ln about sixty-nine or seventy.