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MINUTES OF EVIDENCE. Friday, 18th August, 1911. William Ferguson Masset, M.P., in attendance. (No. 1.) The Chairman: The Committee are prepared to hear you now, Mr. Massey, in regard to what line you take up. Mr. Massey: Well, Mr. Chairman, 1 understand, of course, that the object in referring this matter to the Committee was that the fullest possible inquiry might be made into the whole transaction. It is quite true that by including my speech and making it a parliamentary paper 1 have been made a party to the inquiry. To that I have no objection—l approve of it rather than otherwise; and it seems to me that all I have got to do now —I do not want to narrow the inquiry in any way; very much the reverse —is to give you a list of men whom I propose to call, and to suggest, if it is not irrelevant, that the inquiry should be open to the Press The Chairman: That has already been decided upon. Mr, Massei/: —and that the witnesses be examined on oath. The Chairman: That too has been decided on. Mr. Massey: I am glad to hear it. I would also suggest that in the usual way the evidence be taken down and printed. These are the persons whom I should like called as witnesses Hon. Sir J. Carroll: Before giving the names of witnesses I think Mr. Massey might give us some lead as to the course he is going to pursue, and intimate to the Committee the several points upon which he requires evidence to be taken. We understood the other day that he would make ii statement opening up his side, and then indicate to the Committee the points upon which he wanted evidence. Mr. Mattey: Yes, if necessary I shall be prepared to make a statement when the Committee propose to go on with the inquiry. I understand that you do not intend to go on this morning. Hon. Sir J. Carroll: We were under the impression that you would, in a preliminary way make a statement. ' " Mr. Massey: If the Committee think it necessary I shall be quite willing to do so; but I do not want to narrow the inquiry in any way—l do not want to pin it down to certain points. Hon. Sir J. Carroll: Let me draw your attention to the last part of my statement: " There is no reason why every detail of the transaction should not have the fullest publicity, and the Government will be very glad to assist so far as it can in this direction.'" Mr. Massey: Yes. What I thought of doing was to call Mr. Joshua Jones first. I know, of course, that Mr. Jones's examination may possibly be lengthy. Hon. Sir J. Carroll: You can call any witnesses you like, only give us an idea in consecutive order of the points upon which you want information elicited. Mr. Massey: I do not think there is any one who knows so much about the whole position as Mr. Joshua Jones, and Ido not think we can do without his evidence. I take Mr. Jones first, and then I ask the Committee to call the Chairman of the Maniapoto Maori Land Board, with minutes and correspondence; I want Mr. Herrman Lewis; Mr. H. D. Bell; Mr. Tuiti Macdonald, of Otaki; and Mr. E. H. Hardy, surveyor, Te Kuiti. Hon. Mr. Ngata: Perhaps Mr. Massey may, when the Committee are ready to take the inquiry, make a preliminary statement before examining witnesses. Mr. Massey: Yes; though, as a matter of fact, I have very little more to say than has been stated by myself in the House and on the platform. Hon. Sir J. Carroll: Well, your statement has been met by a statement of mine, and I should like to keep within bounds, and, possibly, ask you to point out in any of the answers I have given where there is any discrepancy, and what the discrepancies are between my answers and your allegations. ' Mr. Massey: Well, I submit that it should be the other way. I made certain statements, and I ask Sir James Carroll, if he is able to do so, to contradict those statements. Hon. Sir J. Carroll: I have answered them Mr. Massey: No, I think not. I submit that my statements have not been contradicted. The Chairman: That being so, would it not be well for you to indicate to the Committee as to where your statements have not been answered? Mr. Massey: I will do that with pleasure, and perhaps add one or two other points that require to be cleared up. Mr. Herries: When we meet again Mr. Massey may make a sort of opening statement. Hon. Sir J. Carroll: That is what I want. Mr. Massey: I am quite willing. Mr. Herries: It does not follow that the Committee will be bound at all. Hon. Sir J. Carroll: No; the Committee acts "on its own"; but it must have some kind of basis to go on. The Chairman: Are you preparsd now, Mr. Massey, to indicate to the Committee the points that have not been answered ? Mr. Massey: No. 1 shall be prepared at the next meeting of the Committee, if that will suit you. JTon. Mr. Ngata: What date would you like witnesses summoned for?

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