G.—s.

16

r REV. MR. MCWILLIAM.

2. Can you give us any information as to financial transactions of the trust between 1874 and 1893 ? —No, I cannot, except the small working-expenses of the school, such as buying books, and school fees. 3. Can you give any account of expenditure upon or connected with the school during any of the years I have mentioned ?—For 1872 the receipts were £17, chiefly school fees ; these accounts seem to be from October, 1872, to February, 1874. The expenses in that period were £11 Bs. 6d. 4. In the blue-book the fees for 1872 are given as £11 12s. 10d.?—I have only two entries belonging to 1872, which amount to £3. 5. The totals for 1872 and 1873 ?—About £8. 6. Mr. Quick.] In whose handwriting are the entries ? —ln mine ; but they are very far back ; I had nothing to do with the rents, it was only school fees. 7. Mr. Wardell.] Do you know of any payments by the Porirua trustees to the Otaki school ? — Simply by hearsay. I believe a portion of my salary was paid for a time out of the Porirua fund— £12 per annum, I think. But I believe objection was taken to it, and it was refunded. 8. According to the accounts furnished, £800 was paid by the trustees to the Otaki school, a great deal in salaries to Mr. Me William and others ?—I never heard of that. I have heard Bishop Hadfield say that payments were made on account of the number of Porirua boys who attended the school. I heard that £12 of my salary was paid for a few years out of the Porirua fund on account of Porirua boys being here. Objection was taken to it when they were withdrawn, and the money was refunded. I never heard of any other payments. 9. Mr. Quick.'] You say some boys from Porirua were sent up to the school, and these were payments for those boys ?—The Bishop considered it only fair to take part of my salary from that fund on account of those boys being at the school. They were not boarding at the school, but living with relatives. On the roll for 1867 I find some few names from Porirua—two girls and three boys ; in 1868, 5 ; sin 1869, 4in 1871, lin 1872, 2in 1873, 2in 1874. In 1875 there are none that I recognise, but I was not teacher then. 10. How long have you been here ?—From 1868 to the present time ; from 1868 I was four years teacher. Since then I have been incumbent. 11. The grants are to the Church Missionary Society : that is a voluntary association for missionary purposes in England, is it not ? —Yes. 12. It is not connected with the Church in New Zealand in any way ?—The Church of New Zealand has control over it to a certain extent; they have grants from the society and have control over the expenditure. 13. Was there any control by the Church over the Missionary Society's money ?—I think so ; they got a certain grant year by year, and the Church of New Zealand, by a Board or the Bishops, had control. My salary was paid by the secretary to the Church Missionary Society for years. 14. It did not come from the Church of England in New Zealand ?—No. 15. The society is represented out here by a Board ?—lt is at present. 16. The Porirua grant to Bishop Selwyn is on a different basis to the grants to the missionary society ? —I believe so. 17. You have been, as incumbent here, for many years in close connection with the school ?— Yes. 18. Can you give us a kind of running account of the prosperity or otherwise of the school, from the time you first remember it onwards ? —lt has been a fluctuating thing, as most Maori'things are. ■Sometimes the attendance of children has fallen off. It has never been stagnant; there has always been a teacher. If the attendance has at any time fallen off it has not been for want of room or for want of a teacher, but because the Maoris cannot stick to anything. 19. It was at one time very flourishing ? —Before my time there were, I believe, 170 boarders. It has always been a boarding-school up to now. Mrs. Jennings has two boarders now. 20. Mr. Wardell.] Do the boarders pay anything ? —No, except for their clothes. 21. Mr. Quick.] You allude to the fluctuation in attendance owing to the peculiarities of Maori character : do you find that affects a day-school more than a boarding-school ? —Much more. 22. In order to give a boarding-school fair play, would it be advisable to place it in a centre of Maori population or at some distance from it, say, at Waikanae : would it be advisable to place it there, or to keep it amongst the Maoris at Otaki ?—I never heard of boys being taken away from a boardingschool, even if close to a Moari place ; it is only when they come day by day. All boarders, so far as I remember, have always been most regular. 23. But did they come from the immediate vicinity or from a distance ? —Sometimes from the village itself ; \hey never thought of trying to absent themselves even if there parents were here. 24. In your spiritual capacity you mix a good deal with adult Maoris ?—Yes. 25. A scheme has been put before us purporting to voice the ideas of the Ngatiraukawa, in which they want a school or college without any religious education at all : is that your experience of what their sentiments are ?—I never heard them express anything of the sort. 26. Is it the sentiment of the Maoris that there should be a school endowed from these funds without any religion being taught at all in it I—l1 —I should think the very opposite. It was for a Church of England school the land was given, and they all understand that. I never heard any one express a wish to have that altered. 27. I suppose children of other denominations have been admitted to the school ?—Yes ; we have had a few Boman Catholics, when they had no school, admitted with the Archdeacon's consent, who was a trustee. They cost the school nothing, being day-scholars. 28. When children of other denominations are admitted, are they forced|to submit to the services of the Church, or are they allowed to absent themselves ?—The question has never arisen. The Roman