I.—4a.

30

[ALFRED HOWORTH.

285. Do you consider that you are an expert as to the working-conditions in a mine in face of the fact that you have never worked at the face in a coal-mine yourself ?—-Yes, I think I know as much as most miners as far as our particular district is concerned, but I would not say of anywhere else. 286. How did they change shifts at the Walton Park Mine ?—The time was reckoned from the face. 287. How long did it take you to get the men down the shaft?—At the Walton Park Mine, although there was a shaft and drive, the men, by going from the first opening that was made, did not need to be lowered down the shaft—they could walk. 288. How did they get the coal from the faces ? Did they stop the haulage from the faces while the shift was being changed?—There was no underground haulage. 289. How did they manage, then, with the haulage ?—The miners ran the trucks to the bottom of the shaft. There were no men appointed for that purpose. 290. Mr. Herries.] Are you working under an award of the Arbitration Court ?—Yes. 291. When did the award come into operation ?—Two years ago this July ; but I may mention that we have another reference placed in our hands now. 292. The award has run out? —Yes, it ran out in November last year. 293. You are shortly to come before the Arbitration Court?—Yes. 294. Do you not think that this question of changing at the face or at the bank, and the question of hours, would be better decided by the Arbitration Court than by the Legislature ?—Possibly they might have the best knowledge of it. 295. Mr. Guinness.] A better knowledge than members of Parliament?—Yes. They would be able to inquire more thoroughly into the matter. But I think that if the question is to be decided by the Legislature there is one thing that ought certainly to be fixed, and that is the time allowed for the meal at midday. It is supposed to be half an hour, but I know that in ours and nearly all the other mines it is extended to nearly three-quarters of an hour. And then there are two " smokos," so that actually there is only about seven hours and a half. The matter ought to be fixed, because, if it is not, the tendency will be for it to grow and grow, and quite likely before long the meal-time will be an hour instead of half an hour. 296. Mr. Herries.] Do you think that the Arbitration Court, sitting to hear each individual case, and knowing the circumstances of each mine, would be better able to judge with regard to making an award than the Legislature legislating for the whole colony? —-I think so, because it could inquire into each individual case. 297. The Chairman.] What is the difference between the temperature at the face in your mine and at the surface?—l could not tell you just now. 298. You cannot tell whether the change of temperature is likely to injure the miners ?—lt is not great enough. lam quite sure of that, but I could not give you the figures. 299. Do you work on Saturday afternoon at your mine ? —Very rarely. We try to give the men Saturday afternoon as much as we can. 300. Is mining a dangerous occupation, in your opinion ?—No, Ido not think it is. I may say that betwixt the time—thirty years—that I was at Walton Park and the time that I have been at the smaller mine we never had any more accidents during the whole of that period than two men who each had a leg broken. Those were the only ones worth taking notice of. There was a death at Walton Park after I left, but it was an engine-driver, not a miner. 301. Mr. Guinness.] You work your mine, I understand, by tunnel ? —Yes, entirely. 302. What distance have the men to walk along that tunnel to get to the face ?—About 4 chains only. About five minutes takes them to their work in our case. 303. How long do the men actually work at the face?—l do not think they work much more than seven hours and a half, actual working-time. 304. And they have smoking-time in your mine?—Yes. 305. Where do they go to smoke—outside ?—No; they usually gather at a certain suitable place. 306. Near the face ? —Yes ; not a great distance from the face. They smoke in the forenoon and the afternoon. 307. Do you know what time they take up in that little luxury?—Fully ten minutes each time. 308. Do they have crib in the mine ?—ln the mine. 309. And they take, you think, about forty minutes?—Something like forty minutes; it is supposed to be half an hour. 310. And you think that should be regulated ? Would you think that not exceeding thirty minutes would be sufficient ?—Half an hour would serve. 311. Do you think it sufficient?—lt would do. 312. What amount of time per day have you been working underground yourself?—l never did much work underground at all. 313. Have you ever worked eight hours a day underground continuously for any length of time ?—No. Alfeed Howoeth examined. (No. 8.) 314. The Chairman.] What is your name? —Alfred Howorth. 315. Where do you live?—At Dunedin. 316. What is your occupation?—l arn the managing partner of the Walton Park Company. 317. It is a coal company ?—Yes. 318. Have you a mine-manager's certificate ?—No ; lam only business manager. 319. Have you yourself worked in a coal-mine ?—I worked in a mine for about two years. 320. At what ?—Doing all classes of general work.