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19. Then, the old chiefs who first started prohibition are dead ?—Yes. 20. Mr. Colvin.] You are in favour of prohibition in the King-country ?—Yes ; lam in favour of prohibition. 21. You think it would not be safe to open the country and put it under proper control. Do you think it would be better to have liquor not prohibited, and the sly-grog selling at present done away with, and the liquor, which would be under proper control, sold in the hotels under police supervision?— Judging from what I have seen, I think it would not be better than the present unsatisfactory state of affairs : I have seen such a terrible amount of drunkenness among the Maoris at Kihikihi. Of course, lam speaking of ordinary licensed houses. 22. Then the sly-grog selling is as bad as it is made out to be, by the outrages that have happened there ?—I think, not at all. The King-country Natives as a whole are not a drunken lot. The Europeans more often cause the drunken scenes. 23. You think that the Prohibitionists' party have made the matter out bigger than it is ?— Yes. In the past they have had an object in showing that the police were not trying to enforce prohibition. I appeared before the Police Commission, and said so. 24. You think that a great deal of it is due to Europeans in the district—to the Europeans and the navvies engaged on the public works ?—There is no doubt about that. 25. Have you written a letter to the Auckland Neivs ? —Yes ; I wrote to the Herald. 26. In it you say that, if liquor was allowed into the country, it should be under the Gothenburg system ? —No ; a modified system of the Gothenburg. The local bodies might control it, or a private company, if it was thought objectionable to have direct Government control. 27. Is it true that the Natives go about with bottles ? —There have been cases of that sort. 28. Mr. Lethbridge.] Are you aware if it is bad liquor that is sold in the King-country ?—I have heard so. 29. Mr. Bhodes.] You say that all the old chiefs are dead ; when living, had they much control over the Natives? —Undoubtedly. 30. There is no one they listen to now ?—Practically, no one. 31. A younger generation has taken their place: there are chiefs?— Yes; but some of the greatest chiefs are the greatest topers as well. 32. Are there many policemen in the King-country?— Yes ; three. We had only one before. 33. Is it a large district?— Yes; a very large district. 34. Are three policemen enough for the purpose of preventing sly-grog selling ?—They seem unable to prevent it; but Ido not know that thirty would be much more useful. 35. Is it your opinion that no number of policemen could prevent it?—l do not think the police could suppress it without good legislation to assist them—legislation prohibiting liquor from coming into the country. You can get ten cases of liquor up there, and unload it before a policeman, and he cannot prevent you from doing so. I think the buyer of sly-grog should be just as liable to a penalty as the seller. 36. Mr. Laivry.~] 1 suppose there is no man in the Eohe-Potae more familiar with the Kingcountry than you are : I suppose you know as much as anybody ? Did I understand you to say that the population was a floating population ?—No ; I said there was a very large floating population. 37. You think, apart from the Natives, that the European population of the King-country does not deserve some consideration of the rights of citizenship?—We vote on the matter as it is. 38. Would you be willing to leave the matter to a plebiscite of the Waikato—that is, taking the whole district represented by Mr. Lang?—Yes. 39. You would be quite satisfied to allow the people to decide this question ? —Yes. 40. What—by the bare majority; No; in licensing matters, I am in favour of the threefifths majority. 41. Why not the bare majority?—l suppose you mean a special vote taken for that one special purpose ? 42. Yes ?—I should fight very hard against ordinary licenses going into the King-country. If you had that you might just as well have a bare-majority vote for the whole colony. 43. I want a straight answer to my question : you are in favour of a three-fifths-majority vote V—Yes. 44. You referred just now to a disgraceful scene you saw in Kihikihi ?—Yes. 45. Were there any King-country. Natives present on that occasion ?—Yes, there were King Natives. 46. Supposing you had an absolute-majority vote that prohibited the consumption of liquor in the King-country, what is to hinder the people of the King-country going to Alexandra, Te Awamutu, and Kihikihi to get drunk?— Nothing at all. 47. How far is Whatiwhatihoe from Pirongia?—Two or three miles. 48. Do they go there and get drunk?—lt is quite possible. 49. Is there a Native settlement about three miles from the railway-bridge, along the river? Yes. 50. If they want to drink there is nothing to hinder them going over the railway-bridge to Te Awamutu ?—Certainly not. 51. You say there was no hotel within the boundary of the King-country; is there one at Tokaanu? —Yes ; I forgot Tokaanu. 52. Any drunkenness there ?—I do not know much of Tokaanu. • 53. Is there a hotel at Mangaweka?—Yes. 54. Do you think the gentleman referred to knew anything about the effects of liquor? Mr. Batley ? yes. 55. Do you know under what conditions the so-called compact was made ?—No, I do not know ; but I suppose a great deal of it was private.