WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 23.

Hawke's Bay Herald, Volume 12, Issue 984, 3 October 1868, Page 3

WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 23.

Debate Resumed. Mr. Tbavebs, after a few prefatory remarks, reviewed the conduct and despatches of Colonel M'Donnell. So long ago as last October, when the minds of people were becoming uneasy, he used the following astounding language. He said " that if the natives behaved with any more of their ' insolence' he would pay them a visit when they least expected it, and pack them off to the Chatham Islands." So far from his beinsj rebuked, it appeared that such language was approved of by the Native Minister. Where there were disputed rights they were subjects for reference to the civil authority. Such threats naturally provoked the other threat that the natives tvould revenge any violence by killing Europeans. It was stated in a foot note that the constabulaiy was not a civil but a military foree — The Hon. Mr. Stafford said the foot note referred to was put there by the Governor. ',". Mr. Tbavebs : There had not been a single explanation offered, and it was laid

i on the table. At all events it was notorii ous that it was a military force, for the re--1 pressioa of violence by violence, and not a force for the preservation of peace by pea- . ceable means as far as possible. Mr. r Parris' conduct was discreet and proper, for he said the force was simply to protect the settlers from insolence or violence, and the initiative of disturbance was to be left to the natives. But there were no instructions to make night marches or attacks. Did Mr. Paaris express his concurrence of what was done after the 28th of April, what was done on the 16th May, as shewn in Colonel McDonnell's despatch, where he describes his march toJNgutuoternanu to arrest persons for alleged horse stealing. That was done under virtue of a warrant issued by Mr. Booth, whose conduct had also been discreet. It should be said for Inspector Hunter that he appeared to .have carried out his instructions with proper discretion. Colonel M'Donnell seized persons who turned out to be perfectly innocent. That seizure was made by an officer who said he would come upon the natives when they least expected him, and who asked that themanageruentof the district should be placed in his hands. The prestige of that gentleman's name to which he referred was a prestige arising out of bloodshed. [The hon. member read numerous passages from the despatches of Colonel M'Donnell, who said he was not disposed to be controlled by any Resident Magistrate, &c] Colonel M'Donnell said if his demand were not complied with, some other officer should be , appointed. It was a lainentablething that some other officer had not been appointed. The impression meant to be conveyed by the commissioners was that Colonel M'Donnell was to be absolved. Mr. C. Wilson, C.8. : What is the date of the letter ? Mr. Tkavehs : The report of the Commission was delayed, and somewhat'unduly delayed. The impression conveyed was, that Mr. Parris' was responsible for what had taken place, and apparently the object was to implicate him with the natives. During the whole period from the close of the last year, the Government were conscious that they were standing on a volcano. Did they take any steps to avert the disasters that they knew were impending. Did they tell one word to the House that would place them in possession of the feeling of the House. They scorned all advice. The hon. member (Mr. .Richmond) sneered at the political consistency of his opponents. He (Mr. Travers) had never told a Minister that he should bo impeached, and then took oiiice with him. (Hear, hear.) He (Mr. Travers) never called a Minister an anthropomorphous ape, nud then went with him into the same Cabinet. (Laughter audcluers.) Was all the political virtue with the hon. gentleman. (Laughter.) People who lived in glass houses should not at least throw stones. (Cheers.) It had been hinted to him (Mr. Travers) that he might have a seat on those benches, but he was still on the other side of the House. (Cheers.) The Hon. the Premier said that never more than 250 natives could be brought to bear upon one point. Was that the case now. He did not look at recent events as indicating a war of extermination. In the recent disaster at Ngutuotemanu there were three natives and two children known to be killed, and those not belonging to TitolCuwharo's people, but to hapus compelled to be with him by the action of the Ministry. He believed that nothing had been done to take advantage of native qualities for assisting in the great purposes of colonisation and preserving the peace between the races. The Government had been silent. Had they asked the House what was wanted, and shown that what they wanted was practicable, the House would have given them the most liberal support. (Cheers.) But they continued to be reticent. He would be prepared to hear from the Government a proposal for a large force ; but they would have had the means of obtaining a large force if they had sought the confidence of the House. There was no reason why the Armed Constabulary force should not do the whole police duties of the colony, if it had been organised in the manner it should have been organised. The present force regarded war as their chief business. Then, as to the sagacity of the commander. The first attack on To Ngutu-o-te-manu had been a defeat, and not a victory, and should not have been undertaken unless Colonel M'Donnell felt himself prepared to hold it. He retired, but he was closely pursued by the enemy. Throughout there had been a hurry and scurry in the retreat. It had been a rout — a complete rout — being pursued until the men crossed the Waingongoro river. Would hon. gentlemen say the last affair in the same place was a victory. The men were exhausted before they met the enemy. When Von Tempsky asked leave to charge the enemy, Colonel M'Donnell hesitated. While awaiting the reply Von Tempsky was shot. Other officers were shot iv trying to recover his body, and at that moment Colonel M'Donnell had commenced to retreat. It was his business to have covered the retreat — to be the last on the ground. It became a question of sauve gui peut. It was not courage alone that was requisite in a commander. The despatch of Colonel M'Donnell was a piece of egotism from beginning to end. Badly as the colony was supplied with commanders, a leader might be found who would have covered a retreat under such circumstances. There was an uneasy feeling oven at the Hutt, which might be explained by the fact, that tl>e Governor had sent an officer to enquire into an alleged menacing attitude of the natives in the Wairarapa. There could be no denying the fact that there was a feeling of dread amongst the settlers. There was no evidence that Ministers had attempted to grasp, or could grasp, the native question. He (Mr. Travers) had no hesitation in saying that, if the}' were removed, a clear well-defined policy could be brought down by other members of the House. An exhibition of power might be necessary, but it should be accompanied with prudence, and a manifestation of a desire not to promote war, but to preserve peace. (Cheers.) The Hon. Mr. Hall said the charge made against the Government by the hon. member for Napier was that Government failed to see the gravity of the present crisis. The Government should be the best judges of their own opinions and feelings. Never had been a more injudicious speech heard in that House than the one just delivered. The Government would have no part in creating a panic through the country. The difficulty was to be met by energetic action. As to the removal of the men from Hawke's Bay, it was a duty of the Government to send a force from one part of the colony to aid another part, whatever the opposition, or whatever danger it brought to Ministers on the floor of that House. The object was to bring well trained men, well officered, to inspire fresh courage in men hard pressed in the presence of an enemy. The hon. member (Mr. Ormond) had attacked Colonel Whitmore — Mr. Oemond : I did not attack Colonel Whitmore. I spoke of the complaints of those he commanded, on account of the language used towards them. The Hon., Mr. Hall : Colonel Whit- ] more had gone to the front under elrcum- j Stances that were most creditable to bum

If he had been less regardful of expenditure he would not have to encounter so much complaint. He had resisted large demands, which were not creditable to those who made them. The only charge made against the Government was that it was not successful. He thought Colonel M'Donneir could afford to treat with contempt any imputations on his courage. He (Mr. Hall) objected to the House being turned into a council of war. It was not only inconvenient but dangerous to the success of operations in the field. He thought he might refer to the native policy of the hon. member for Rangitikei. Mr. Fox : It is not before the House. The question is the resolution of the hon. member for Napier. There was no policy before the House. The Hon. Mr. Ham : Was the hon. gentleman prepared to drop his policy like a hot potato. (The hon. gentleman reviewed at great length the proposals made by the hon. member for Baugitikei some time since.) Party was the means to an ,end. If the result of the division should be to remove Ministers from their seats, they would show how they could discuss great principles, and yet loyally help the Government in carrying on the business of the country. (Cheers.) The House adjourned at 12 o'clock.