31

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He knew of one member who would attend the Hospital and Charitable Aid Board, then the Education Board, then the Harbour Board, and from each he would go home and draw his mileage; in addition to this, the gentleman in question served on the Read Board of his own immediate locality, for which he got nothing. A great saving would result to the community at large if these local bodies could amalgamate. Good, sound common-sense was what was required for nearly all those local bodies, and his experience was that a person who could acquit himself creditably on a County Council had always shown his adaptability and fitness to sit on the Charitable Aid Board. It was a mistake to confine Hospital and Charitable Board representation to one end of the county where the population was thickest, thereby leaving two-thirds of the county unrepresented. His experience in his district was that the Road Board worked harmoniously with the Council. They did the work for nothing, and they attended to their by-laws, and if they merged into the Council it would necessitate another Inspector, with a salary of £200 or £300 a year. If they wanted better roads it was their business, and they could improve them if they thought proper. Regarding the control of the main roads, of course, that was in the hands of the Council. They found under the Bill a very excellent provision made— viz., that some person had the power of stepping in and controlling their actions if they were not what they should be. County Councils were no better than Road Boards, and Road Boards were no better than County Councils —one was as bad or as good as the other, each having its good and its bad qualities. The money was spent where most votes come from. It was not unreasonable on the part of the Government to protect the general public. One could go from county to county and find good roads in the central parts, but when the confines were reached bad roads were discovered, and people who had to travel through the length and breadth of the land found great difficulty in so doing. Then, again, there were the boroughs, and they heard that in the case of Auckland there was a desire to make their city respectable; and if report spoke true, Auckland would require a good deal of money to make it respectable. Those who wished to travel expected to find good roads through the towns and through the counties. The Dominion roads passed through sections of boroughs, and these should be kept in good order. If there was an overruling authority even-handed justice would be dealt out to different portions of the country, and no part would be neglected. The towns were too apt to forget that there w r as community of interest between town and country, and in order that that interest might be conserved, there should be some power constituted that would levy equality of sacrifice where there was equality of advantage. Unless the Government was prepared to increase the subsidies to country bodies, some means should be found whereby the wealthier cities should be called upon to pay a fair proportion of the charges. Mr. D. McLaren (Mayor of Wellington) thought he ought to immediately follow the last speaker, if only to protect the City of Auckland. It was perhaps a new venture for a Wellington man to protect the City of Auckland; but lie felt certain that in this instance the position of the cities had not been properly considered by the gentleman who had just spoken. If he considered that in the City of Wellington they had from £30,000 to £35,000 spent per annum upon the streets alone, he would not fail to realize that the large cities had a fair burden upon them at the present time. The matter he wished to refer to was the Local Government Board. The President, in his address that morning, had said that it was a question of taking the new body or remaining under the Governor in Council. Well, in his judgment, it was the same thing, only probably more so. Under the provisions of the Bill the signs might be different over the shop, but it was the same business that would be going on inside. It was quite true that in Great Britain they had a system of Local Government Boards in operation, and there was also a system of Ministerial Boards of various kinds; but it was equally true that there had been numerous protests against the acts of the departmental Boards, and cases had been carried to the Court of Appeal in England, where decisions had been given against the Central Boards that had been established, and he was not sure they wanted to take the same line that had been taken in this respect in the Old Country, for there was a very very large body of opinion in Great Britain at the present time that there was too great centralization of power in the hands of the Cabinet under the names of Boards of one kind or another. This, he considered, was not desirable so far as local-government affairs were concerned. In what was proposed under the Local Government Board they were face to face, with a body which would have the settling of-disputes as to the allocation of liabilities as between various bodies. That meant that the Board would practically act for the time being as part of the Judiciary. This was a very great power to create. Then, under the Bill, the Board would sit in private, and it would not be required to take evidence or to act judicially. A body vested with such tremendous power as was given under the Bill was not a desirable body to settle disputes as between various portions of people. He believed matters of this kind should more properly be referred to the Courts of the country, and the Judiciary of the country had power to settle such matters as the allocation of liabilities. The Board in one aspect was like a bench of Judges, and in another was an administrative body. The Pebsident said he did not propose to proceed with Part X of the Bill, which was the part referred to. Mr. McLaren said, coming to the boroughs, he thought it must be recognized from the figures presented that the position of the large boroughs was different from the position of the small ones. For instance, the percentage of the cost of management of boroughs over three thousand was 612, whereas the cost of management of boroughs under three thousand was 14*51. From this it was apparent that the boroughs in the cities were in an entirely different position from the small boroughs. He entirely agreed with the view expressed by Mr. Pan- that while it was desirable that small boroughs contiguous to cities should from time to time come in, so as to create larger municipalities, they should at the same time watch that this was done by an evolutionary process, and not be forced. As a simple matter of fact, as the law now stood, the door to amalgamation was