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370. Well, say wrongful dismissal?—l should not like to say that. 371 Clause 5, car report-book I think you said you have the loose leaf in your system, and file the leaves, and have a separate book for each oar Is that your present system?— Yes. 372 What is the difference between having a separate book for each car and keeping this book?—The difference is a very important one. In the first place, the cars move from depot to depot, and the book would have to be moved about from depot to depot. In wet weather, with the motormen coming in with their wet clothes on to write on it, and also the shedmen, the book would be soiled and the writing become undecipherable. With our system it is just a leaf for the day 373. Could you not provide some receptacle on the car where the book could be kept?—l find it a most unsafe practice to keep things on the car Very frequently they disappear Is there anything to prevent you sending the book out with the car in the morning and getting it back at night?—The book is often wanted as a record in the depot for any tran-scribing-work that has to be done. The book serves three purposes. In the first place, it is a character sheet of the car for the day, and the man driving it has to put down anything that is the matter with it. Then it is a sheet of instructions for the shedman, showing what he has to do with the car In the third place it is a source of information to the foreman. 375. If the book went out in the morning the shedman could not deal with it until the car came in at night, so he would be at no disadvantage?—He would. 376. Then, what is your objection?—The car-shed staff have to take into consideration what has been done to the car by the night staff during the night, and what was the matter with the car, which may have to go out at 9or 10 o'clock, before they have time to examine the book. It is serving a triple purpose. 377 Your system is a near approach to what we have in the Bill? —It is a vast improvement on it, because we get from the men first-hand what has happened to the car 378. Have the sheets ever been known to go astray?— Not that 1 am aware of 379 There were none missed at any inquiry?— Not that I am aware of 380. Mr M Myers ] The cars are inspected under your system every night?— Yes. 381 Each car?— Yes. 382 As to clause 2of the Bill: If training is a condition precedent to the issue of a certificate, do you see that that certificate is necessary at all?—I said before that it was not necessary, but I saw no objection to it. 383. In any case, would you accept and place on a car as a motorman a certificated man from any place unless he had gone under the same training in Auckland as well?— No. As a matter of fact, if a motorman fully accredited from another centre comes to Auckland for employment, he has to go through the routine as a conductor, such as I have described previously, in order to arrive at the stage of a motorman. 384. The Hon Mr McKenzie asked you something about the first Commission, consisting of Mr. Holmes and Mr Richardson : as a matter of fact, did that Commission have any evidence before it, from either the men or the company, as to what was the best brake for the Auckland system?— None whatever. 385. The second Commission did?— That is not exactly correct. The first Commission did have some evidence from motormen who had used the air brake. 386. But the question was not fully considered? —No. 387 Then, if a special tramway engineer were appointed to advise the Government, do you think, even with such an officer as that, he should have power to say what are the reasonable requirements of the traffic?— No. As I said clearly in my evidence, not witliout some form of appeal. 388. I suppose the point arises sometimes when you think you can only study the convenience of the public by increasing the fares?—l take it it would, but we cannot increase them. 389. They are fixed by Order in Council? —Yes. 390. I suppose the public themselves object sometimes to having their fares increased?—l have never tried it. 391. Hon. Mr R McKenzie.'] Paragraph (c) of clause 5 provides for the use of "proper appliances and furnishings on carriages to insure the safety and convenience of passengers, of the tramway employees, and of the general public " : if the two words " and convenience" were deleted, would you then have any objection to the clause? —Those are the objectionable words. 392. That would satisfy you, to delete the words " and convenience"?— Yes. 393. You said in reply to Mr M. Myers that if a motorman came from Christchurch or Dunedin with a Government certificate you would not put him on unless you were satisfied with his training?—l said that if a motorman fully accredited came from one of the other centres to Auckland to get employment in our service, he would have to go through the ordinary routine of a conductor before he could become a motorman. 394. Did you not say, if he had a Government certificate? —I did not mention it. 395. Supposing he had a Government certificate, is there anything in this Bill to compel you to employ him?— Not so far as I can see. 396. As far as that is concerned you would be in the same position as you are now?— Yes. 397 Mr M Myers ] Having regard to the safety and convenience of the public, do you consider that the Auckland tramway system compares favourably with the other tramway systems existing throughout New Zealand ?—I think it compares quite well. I would not like to say it is better than any of the others.