37

L—B.

A. SOSSEE.

167. Now, you have spoken of the car-defect sheets. Is it not a fact that a different system is now in vogue—namely, the system of separate sheets being given to each individual motorman? —Yes, but that started after that cart case. 168. How long ago?— When Lowe was prosecuted. 169. What Mr. Walklate tells me is that the system has been altered quite lately—that newsheets are given to each man?—Yes. What I mean by "Lowe's case" is that at that time the sheets were taken out of the book and then collected at the end of each day, and then put into the book again. 170. In Lowe's case would you be prepared to say that that car did not get away through the wheels skidding? You have already told us that he was working both brakes hard?—Yes. 1 was in the Court wdien the evidence was given, and I do not think the wheels did skid. 171. That is a mere matter of opinion?— Yes, but you are asking for my opinion. 172. But upon the same evidence another man may have come to the conclusion that the accident happened through the wheels skidding?—Yes; but then if the wheels skid, the motorman releases the brakes and applies them again, but in this case he could not get any difference at all —he was completely hung up. We have the Magistrate's decision to the effect that he did his utmost with the means at his command. 173. It is a fact, is it not, that during Fleet Week over a million people were carried? — Yes, that is so. 174. And that without accident?—Yes, that the people knew of. 175. You do not suggest any?—No, but we know there are many narrow escapes.

Wednesday, 22nd December. 1909. John Charles Hamilton Mom examined. (No. 8.) 1. The Chairman] What are you I —A motorman in the employ of the Wellington Corporation Tramways. 2. And a member of the union?—l am president of the Tramways Union and president of the Federated Tramways Union. 3. And you wish to give evidence on behalf of the Wellington Union?—Yes, and the federation. 4. .Can you tell me how many members there are in the union?—Three hundred and seventyfive, I think, but lam not sure. You can put it down at 350. 5. And the number of employees?—Somewhere about, four hundred. 6. How many are there in the federation?—About a thousand. 7. You have considered this Bill?— Yes, we have considered it. 8. And will you kindly make a statement with regard to it?—We approve of this Bill, and think it is absolutely necessary it should become law so as to enforce the clauses in it in order to bring all the tramways in New Zealand up to a proper standard of efficiency so as to give the motormen a chance of doing their work in a proper manner and also to safeguard the interests of the public. There are one or two other clauses we should like to have seen added to this Bill which were in the old Bill of 1907. Clause 2of that Bill we should like to see added to this Bill. It provides for the Government examination of motormen. At the present time that power is held by the Councils and municipal bodies of New Zealand; and the Auckland Tramways Company has, 1 think, the power to employ their own motormen, power to train them and pass them for examinations, and also to issue certificates to them to drive, and we do not think it is a fair and proper thing that they should have that privilege. In giving a privilege of that kind to them it leaves it open to abuse; they could send any man along as a competent motorman although probably he had only had one or two weeks' training. They could say he was competent and send him up to get a certificate, which would not be the case if he had to pass an examination under a Government Department. 9. Do you suggest the Government should have examiners in each centre?— Yes, so as to examine the motormen, who would then have certificates, and then in the case of accidents arising from brake-failures or other causes, instead of the blame being always thrown on the motormen, the fault would be attached to where it should lie, either to the equipment or to the men, because the Government would be able to step in and hold an inquiry themselves. 10. I suppose there are new motormen almost every week, are there not?—No, not as often as that. 11. How frequent?—Well, occasionally there may be two or three one week and two or three the next, and then it may be three or four months before there would be any more. 12. What is the system now? Do the conductors usually become motormen?—Yes. 13. Who trains them?—The Motor Instructor. 14. And do they then pass an examination?—They then pass an examination either before the Chief Engineer or the Assistant Electrical Engineer. 15. And if it is to his satisfaction?—They are passed through and get a certificate. 16. Is that certificate recognised-in any other city in the Dominion?—No, not outside. 17. So that a man passing in Dunedin ?—Would not become a motorman here : he would have to pass another examination here just the same. There are one or two other matters we should like altered. One is so far as the repair-book is concerned at the present time: They now have a loose-leaf repair-book. You go in, say, at night, and book your car up, and the leaf is