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61. Mr. McLean.] You said something about America in your evidence : what is the difference in the practice in America and Great Britain on this point ?—ln Great Britain the law affecting auxiliary-powered vessels is that they must come under the same regulations as steam-vessels, with such modifications as may from time to time be deemed necessary as diffiulties crop up. 62. Practically in the same way as the department proposes here ? —Exactly the same way, as circumstances arise. Mr. Glasgow : As a matter of fact only passenger-boats carrying twelve persons are surveyed : all the others are outside the law. Witness : That is the law in Great Britain and New South Wales. 63. The Chairman.] What about America? —They have altered the law materially from time to time, and I believe the Marine Board or Board of Trade people were very sorry they did not interfere with this class of trade before they did. The law now is that if a man can show his qualification by examination he is allowed to go through. 64. Mr. McLean.] In what sense qualified ?—By examination. 65. What sort of examination?—l do not know. I have not seen the regulations. I have seen a copy of the Act. I believe it was amended last year. 66. What is the nature of the examination a man would have to go through before he would be considered competent to take charge of a vessel?—l have not got that. 67. The Chairman.] You might give the Committee an idea of what you think it should be?—l would rather not. 68. Why?—lt is not my province at present. 69. But a general idea ?—Well, the oil-engine and machinery, and the manipulation of parts requiring repairs. 70. And the shop-experience ?—Yes, three years' shop-experience. 71. Mr. McLean.] What is the danger connected with oil-engines?— You have a high initial pressure to start with, perhaps ranging from 180 and over; you have pumps to look after, an electrical batter}' and dynamo, valves of emission and exhaust, and other points to look after. There is danger by explosion, and if on a lee shore the vessel would go ashore if there was a breakdown in the machinery. 72. Of course, with an auxiliary sailing-vessel it is rather an advantage than otherwise?— Well, the " Mavis" went ashore and could not get off again, and the " Oban " broke down on a lee shore and went ashore at Waitara. But there is as much danger in that respect with a vessel run by steam. You have the same difficulty in both eases, I admit. 73. The Chairman.] Of course, you know the auxiliary engine will only be used in fine weather? —If they can find oil in Taranaki or Orepuki, and the price is reduced to Id. a gallon, they will use these engines all the time. It is only a matter of expense so far. Mr. Glasgoiv.] I have here an extract from the laws governing steamboat inspection in the United States of America. Section 4426 (1898) : " The hull and boilers of every ferry-boat, canalboat, yacht, or other small craft of like character propelled by steam shall be inspected under the provisions of this title. Such other provisions of law for the better security of life as may be applicable to such vessels shall, by the regulations of the Board of Supervising Inspectors, also be required to be complied with before a certificate of inspection shall be granted ; and no such vessel shall be navigated without a licensed engineer and a licensed pilot. Provided, that in open steam-launches of ten tons burden and under, one person, if duly qualified, may serve in the double capacity of pilot and engineer. All vessels of above fifteen tons burden carrying freight or passengers for hire, propelled by gas, fluid, naphtha, or electric motors, shall be and are hereby made subject co all the provisions of section forty-four hundred and twenty-six of the revised statutes of the United States, relating to the inspection of hulls and boilers and requiring engineers and pilots." 74. The Chairman (to Mr. Glasgow).] You exclude vessels under 15 tons?— Not under the present law, but it is contemplated to do that. Not from survey. 75. Mr. Groivther (to Mr. Glasgow).] That is on the presumption that they are propelled solely by these engines. That is different. Our struggle is for auxiliary power, not for the sole power. Your provision is for sole power ? —That is so. Thomas Majob Lane, examined. 76. The Chairman.] You are senior partner of the firm of Lane and Brown, shipbuilders at Whangaroa?—Yes. 77. You reside in Auckland ?—No, at Whangaroa. 78. You are a shipbuilder ? —Yes. ; _; 79. Carrying on business how many years?— Since 1870. 80. What is the total number of vessels you have built ?—Sixty-five, nearly all sailingvessels. 81. With register tonnage ranging from ? —From 12 tons to 320. 82. How m.any of the sixty-five have auxiliary power?—l should think about eight or ten. 83. And the engines in these eight or ten, were they constructed in Auckland, America, or England?— Two of them are Priestman's engines, constructed in England—the " Aotea " and " Moana." The " Medora," " Thistle," and " Greyhound " have Union engines from San Francisco. The " Hercules," the "Toroa," and the "Brothers" have Hercules engines, also constructed in San Francisco, and we have built small launches with Sintz and Wolverine engines from New York. The launch engines are of a different type altogether. 84. Have you any engines in vessels that you have built here that were constructed in New Zealand or any of the colonies ?—No; we could not get them big enough in New Zealand. They are now making them up to twenty-five-horse power in Auckland, but only recently.