5

I.—7a

6. You have been speaking about the " personality " of the board of directors : what about the enormous commission paid to the chief engineer in New Zealand ? Can you tell us anything about that ? I think, perhaps, you would like to explain that ? —I think you have a statement before you as to that matter, in which the total amount paid to Mr. Wilson is shown. In order to get, that sum he was obliged to expend considerable sums in maintaining the engineering staff. The whole of the engineering staff he undertook to provide. Ido not think it would be right to state exactly what it cost him. It is a private matter. To find a capable engineering staff for such a work would be a very expensive matter; but the total amount received by him did not come to anything like what is usually paid to engineers in charge of works of this magnitude, which meant an expenditure of a million of money. It did not come up to what the Government would have to pay —5 per cent. 7. I think it might be necessary to learn what the engineering staff cost Mr. Wilson. Will you state it, or shall I try to discover it in the course of evidence ?—lt is not a matter, I think, that should be stated, for it is absolutely private matter. If it affects the question in the minds of the Committee I will confer with Mr. Dalston, who is Mr. Wilson's attorney in New Zealand. From the company's point of view we have not the slightest objection to its being stated or given in evidence. 8. There are certain people concerned with the cost of this railway, therefore we should have before us all the collateral circumstances to guide us as to whether it has cost too high a figure, or whether the cost has been moderate, and, to arrive at a true estimate of the cost, I think that will be necessary ?—On behalf of the Midland Eailway Company, I do not object. 9. I am only mentioning this matter from the point of view of your clients, who might wish to explain this if considered necessary ?—I admit that in the interest of the company it should be stated. But it is a private matter; it is a part of Mr. Wilson's private affairs, and the information can only be obtained from his private books. I should have to ask Mr. Dalston, as Mr. Wilson's attorney, whether he is prepared to divulge. 10. Mr. Button.] I would like to ask whether the company is prepared to find the necessary capital, and reconstruct the line, in the event of the Government accepting these proposals. There is no other line?—lt is our wish to satisfy the Committee on this point. 11. Mr. Guinness.] Would you be prepared, on behalf of the company, to call any expert evidence to show what is likely to be the earning-power of the section of railway between Patterson's Creek and Jackson's, which, according to these present proposals, the company intends to construct ?—I am prepared to do so ; but I had not thought of bringing with me any evidence of that sort. I have referred the Committee to all the parliamentary papers which have reference to the Midland Eailway, and they include statements of that kind. Dr. Newman: We had the whole of this before us some three years ago. Hon. the Chairman: More recent and more reliable evidence was given by expert authorities before the Arbitration Court, all of which is available. Mr. Button: I thought Mr. Harris would give us some sketch of the comparative cost of the railway, or set out in some short way the relative position of parties concerned : How far the Government would be affected by what he proposes; if the land is to be released; what is to be given to the debenture-holders ; we ought to have it before us how we will stand; what the Government position would be on obtaining the land and giving the debentures; what is the Government to receive ; will the railway still belong to the company, and what will be the cost of completing it. 12. Hon. the Chairman.] I think we have the cost of completing the line. Then, the relative nosition of the parties would perhaps admit of further explanation? —If this comes about the Government would have the land that would be released, and the company would have the railway. If necessary, lam quite prepared to speak for several days, and to go through the whole case. But I have purposely confined my remarks to a narrow limit, as I thought such a course would better suit the convenience of the Committee. 13. Mr. Button.] I do not want it in such full detail, but it appeared to me to be an advantage to get over certain legal difficulties, some of which have been enumerated. First, as regards the land-grant : Suppose the Committee recommended that we should take back the railway, more particularly as to the value to Government of retaining these lands instead of the debenture-holders? —There are 5,000,000 acres locked up. 13a. At what value? —About 10s. an acre all round. I did not wish to weary the members of the Committee with my address. I had reason to think that all these facts and arguments were as well known to all the members of the Committee as they are to me. I am so full of the case, having gone through the whole of the particulars, that I might not see what other people could perceive to be weak points. I can only say that any information the Committee desire shall be furnished. 14. Dr. Newman.] This proposal, I understand, is practically the same proposal that the House rejected. What is it that has led to the renewal of the offer?— Yes, it is practically the same ; but I think the conditions have considerably altered since then. The debenture-holders and shareholders working together have made the offer. This is practically a suggestion or a proposal by both, for if you accept our present proposal we get rid of the debenture-holders for you. 15. Mr. Millar.] The land-grant is to be released at 12s. 6d. to complete the construction?— We are simply asking the colony to give us in cash what they would be obliged to give us in land. The area is very large that will be locked up if these proposals are not accepted. We propose to unlock the land. The colony will have the benefit of the money expended in completing the line. 16. Mr. Bloiv.] You say that if these proposals are accepted you will get rid of the debentureholders for us. Do you mean that the company, if they get £618,000, will pay to the debentureholders £745,000? That is a matter of arrangement between the debenture-holders and the company. We undertake to pay out the debenture-holders.