G.-2

30

152. After this difference with McDonald, what were the relations between you ?—McDonald ■stayed in- Court taking note of the proceedings, and did not say anything till the block came up with Warena in it—No. 11. 153. Who acted after McDonald sat down ?—The interpreter in the Court—l cannot recollect his name-—went on to interpret for us, and to show how the other blocks were disposed of. 154. And the Court gave effect to all your voluntary arrangements out of Court ? —Yes; until we came to No. 11. 155. What happened then ?—Daniel got up and said, " Why have you not had any considera"tion for me in regard to No. 11." I then produced a paper. Then McDonald handed me the name of Warena—the name, " Warena Hunia," was written on a piece of paper. He was not in the ■Court; he was away at Eangitikei. Tekiri-got up and said, "I object to this," and there was trouble over it. I then suggested we should retire, and go to a room adjoining. I suggested it because I saw there was trouble, and I did not want to have any trouble before the Court. Then we went to a room. 156. Who went to that room?—Wirihana Hunia, Tekiri, Eaniera, Makere, Ngatahi, McDonald, and others. I then said, " I will tell you what lam going to do. lam going to give this land to Taueki, to be in his name. I will stand out." Ngatahi and others objected, and said, " No; you keep in. We want you to have it." T said, " What objection is there to Taueki's name instead of ■mine"? They said, "We are not going to have it. Give it to Kemp." I then said, "We will let Warena's name be put in with mine, as he is a pious young man." They were very angry with me, and left the room. That was the only error I made; the tribe was quite right. Then we went back into Court, and Warena's name was put in along with my own name. I did not understand then, but McDonald did, that some law had been passed; and then it was found out that this land really belonged to us two. After that, Fraser came to me, and asked me for money to pay Wirihana's debts, and I came down to Palmerston to pay them. I gave him £100, and when we wentrto Wellington I gave him another £100; and when I went to Wanganui he came to me to ask for money for taking land through in Hawke's Bay, and I gave him another £100. 157. Why did you give all this money to Wirihana ?—For the debts owing, and for other expenses in the Court. 158. What claim had they on you?—He was a youngster, and responsible for them in some way, and I gave him the money. Warena asked me to give him money to pay his debts. I then sent him some money by telegram—£7o. After that I went to Wellington, and then he asked me to give him the land that you have, to lease it. I said, " Well, it is very good ; but we will let it stop a bit." After that he came to me for more money, and I gave him £100 ; and I went back to Wanganui. Then Warena and Donald Fraser came to Wanganui to ask me to give them more money. I then thought it was best for me to go to Mr. Woon, because I thought they had a knife to stab me secretly. I went to Woon, and I came back and said, " You had better go to Woon about this. We then all went to Woon. I did this so that Woon might hear what their request to me was. They said they had come to ask Kemp for some money. I asked, " What reason have you to come and ask me for money ? I suppose you are thinking of stabbing me with a knife." He hung his head down, and said, " Yes." Then I said, " I have found you out." Then he took me up to the Supreme Court. 159. What was the nature of the action in the Supreme Court ?—He took me to the Court about the land, but he could not do anything because it had not passed the Native Land Court; but a writ was served on me. 160. What was the summons for ?—I do not know ;it was all in European. I was ill, and threw it on the top of a box. 161. Wa3 it a summons for back rents ? —Perhaps it was ;I do not know. I had no solicitor at the time. My medical man was contantly in attendance on me. After that a lawyer's clerk came to me, and he said, "You have got to sign this document." I said, " Why do you not bring an interpreter with you, so that I could understand what the document is"? They gave me the paper to sign, and after they had gone I pitched it outside. 162. Then you went to the Native Land Court again ? —Yes. 163. Who was the Judge ?—Judge Trimble. 164. Whose claim was it ?—Donald Fraser and Warena were the claimants. 165. What took place in that Court ? —I went there to see to whom the land belonged. The Court said, " We do not come here to decide any claim, as the land has already been awarded to you two, but to see what arrangement can be made about it. The Court stated that the land did not belong to any but those two." They made the creek the division between the two. 166. Did you sit down quietly under that, or what action did you take ?—I objected to that, because I said, "This man has no eel-fisheries on this stream, and has no right to it." I then applied for a rehearing and it was granted. Both Warena and McDonald said, "Itis no good ; the thing has been already decided." McDonald said to me, "You have been in too great a hurry about this thing." I went out of the Court with my solicitor, and he suggested we should come to some arrangement about the land. I said, " Very well, I agree 'to a portion of this land being given to the tribe. If you will sign a paper to that effect, we will take it back and lay it before the Court." I then wrote out an agreement, and it was considered best by the other side that Karena Mana c Tawhaki should see what was in it first. I said, " Are you a third Warena to come into this matter ?" This agreement was cast adrift, and we went back to the Court. Some time after this the Court was adjourned, and I went to Wellington. 167. Was any arrangement come to or not?—No ; after I went to Wellington, Donald Fraser came there and Mr. Baker, who was my solicitor. Fraser said, "If we could come to some arrangement here the thing would be finished." We then went back before Mr. Baker. Hoani Taipua was there also. He asked,." What arrangement we should make ?" I replied, " I will give 3,500 acres to Warena Hunia."