3

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although there are few holdings comparatively as yet made freehold, Government has had in several instances to give large compensation to buy back lands for outlets and tailing-sites. If you once begin to alienate the land in large blocks you will soon have evidence enough from the miners that all along the spurs of the mountains there are most valuable auriferous deposits. They are only, as it were, just discovering them now: and the further they are worked the richer they seem to be. There is a very large amount of capital sunk there in the gold-mining industry. There is one gentleman—Mr. Ewen—who has been there for over twenty years. His operations are on a very large scale : he has as much capital employed as many runholders. That is one case. There are many others. I think that, for a much longer time than any of us will be here, hydraulic mining will be a very important source of wealth in the interior of Otago. The annual output of gold amounts in value to some £400,000 or £500,000. Ido not suppose that it will come to be very much less than that. There are also a great many auriferous reefs in these ranges which they are finding out gradually: these, having regard to the improvement in the treatment of ores, will afford a very considerable addition. 22. Suppose the same safeguards that were found to be effective in the case of the Midland Bailway were embodied in this Bill, would that, in your opinion, meet this case ?—lt might meet it practically to some extent; but Ido not think that it would meet it so completely as in the case of the Midland Bailway. In the case of the Midland-Bailway there were 750,000 acres of reserve. Gold is so distributed along these Otago valleys that it would be difficult to select any one large block that w xould not trench on the deposits. 23. In fact, it would be impossible to get a block of five thousand acres where that would not be the case ? —lt would require indeed a great deal of care in selecting even to get a block of five thousand acres where that would not happen. 24. Mr. O'Callaghan.] Would that extension to seventy-eight miles you spoke of just now be likely to interfere with the mining industry ?—lf you give land in consideration of it of course it would. 25. Taking it for granted as far as the seventy-eight miles it would not?— Yes, it would; because up to that point much of the land is freehold, so that you would require to go in advance of that point in selecting the blocks. 26. The sum, of which 33 per cent, was to be given in land, was £580,000 —it is now reckoned at £850,000 —does that include the cost to Middlemarch ?—I think the schedule to the Bill makes it out that way. Mr. Pyke : That is so : it was so stated last year. 27. Mr. O'Callaghan.] There is another clause which requires all the land to be laid off in rectangular blocks. Except for the mutual advantage of the company and the Crown, it is not for the advantage of the company to have the gold-mining interest protected. The recommendation of rectangular blocks would not therefore apply to the gold-mining interest. Is it not the case that the goldfields being spread in scattered blocks a departure from rectangular blooks would not protect that industry ?—There would be a difficulty in laying off large rectangular blocks for the reason that the auriferous deposits would run across them half-way, as a general rule, between the railway-line and the fifteen-mile limit, thereby dividing the blocks into two portions : one of these, the hill portion, would be comparatively useless without the lower portion. Further, all the watercourses from these workings require to be reserved, also a very considerable area to allow taiMngs to spread over. The Government has already had to compensate freeholders in order to allow room for the spread of tailings. Any extensive alienation of the country would so aggravate this evil as either to close the gold-workings or else to bring upon the State or miners an expenditure in giving compensation for these conveniences. 28. The company, it is premised, should have the first choice of blocks: from your knowledge of the country can you say whether this would not be of considerable advantage to the company; their first choice would be so valuable in its character, that the second choice would be considerably affected in consequence of that first choice given to the company ?—They would undoubtedly select the best blocks, but with the provisions contained in this Bill as to obtaining land suitable it would not depreciate the remaining portion. It is stated that I should have something to do with the selection. I would take care that the selection would be such that it should not depreciate the remaining blocks. The runs in this region are let from Id. to Is. an acre; their choice of the latter would not make the penny-an-acre run one whit less valuable. But this might happen : the company might select the land in such a way as to have nearly all the agricultural land, so that there could be little or no expansion of settlement on Crown lands. 29. That was the point I wished to draw out; they have that power ?—Yes. 30. You have stated that your valuation of the rent is in round numbers about £48,000? —Yes ; my former evidence had reference to the distance from Lake Taieri to the Clyde. 31. Mr. J. McEenzie : Mr. O'Callaghan asked the witness whether he thought this estimate was to cover that of Middlemarch; whether that money was to buy that portion. 32. The Chairman.] Did you draw up the portion of this Bill that would deal with Crown lands?— No. 33. Can you see any clause in this Bill which deals with settlement ?—There are no such clauses. 34. Do you think they ought to be introduced into it ? Yes ; I think so. 35. Do you think the Bill ought to contain any provision as to townships?— Yes; much the same as in the Manawatu Bailway Bill; only, I may say, that the townships have already been pretty well selected in this country. 36. Should there be any provision under which Government would have the right to make reserves for public purposes, such as schools, &c. ? —Yes; that ought to be. 37. Do you think there ought to be some power given to go outside the limits of deviation where necessary for the purpose of making roads to railway-stations ?—I do not know that I quite under-