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selves—that is to say, when you are prepared to go and prove your title to the land. Wahanui has referred to the railway passing through certain bush country, and I will explain this matter to you. Some of the owners object to the bush being cut down and the railway taken through that country. They say the line should go round the bush, not through it. I have consulted the engineer upon the point, and he tells me it would be a very much worse line if it were taken round the bush, and, as the railroad is made for ever, he thinks, and I think, too, that it should be taken by the best route ; but, if it injures the bush, so much the better, for the owners will get the value of the timber cut down. In other parts of the country, where Europeans own timber land, they are very anxious that roads and railways should be taken through their land, in order to develop the value of the timber ; so I should strongly recommend the owners of the bush to insist upon the line going through it, for their own benefit. However, subject to what I have said as to the payment, the engineer must take the railway by the best line. If it were European land, of course it would not do to allow every man to be an engineer for the railway, for it would have as many turns in it as a serpent. However, the Native interest cannot suffer, because the land will be paid for. If it is very valuable, they will get a higher price for it, as we shall make no distinction between them and Europeans in this matter. One of the speakers said he did not intend to let his land go. Of course he did not refer to the land for the railway. He referred to his land generally I suppose. We do not wish him to let his land go. Such a matter will be left to the owners to say what they will do with their own land. All the Government asks is for the land for the railway and for roads, and that they shall pay a fair price for it. I think now I have touched all the points, and will merely repeat, with regard to discussion, by all means discuss this matter among yourselves. lam very glad to hear that my statement with regard to the Bating Act is satisfactory. I have expressed my sentiments very fully, and need not return to it. The engineers are at work in reference to the railway, the Government has gone to considerable expense, Parliament has authorized the line, and I wish you to agree among yourselves as soon as you possibly can, I may say, further, that, with regard to Ngatai, to whom reference is to be made in this matter, I expected to meet him on the Whanganui Eiver. I was told he could not come down because of a slip in the river, and then it was said he would meet me here; but I was informed that he was Very favourable to the railway ; but he is not here, and lam not responsible for that. With regard to the road from Kawhia being formed so as to touch Alexandra, the engineers have laid it out so as, when continued, to join the railway-line. I should also like to see a road made to Alexandra as well, but I was told that road would be very difficult and very expensive, and of little use in winter. I will see about that road, and, if I can induce the Public Works Department to make it, I shall do so, because I recognize that the more roads the Native people have the better for themselves. I think now I have referred to all the questions raised by the various speakers. Hopa te Bangianini said the question had arrived now at the talk about the railway-line and the bushes it would go through. He owned a swamp, over which the railway would pass, and he obtained eels, which were his principal food in summer, from this swamp. He said he had heard that in England railways were taken over viaducts, and he asked that this might be done in this case, instead of filling up the swamp. Aporo Taratutu said that the forests were of very large extent. They commenced from Mangawhare and extended as far as Te Kumi. The owners were Ngatiapa. He was clear about the statement that those bushes should be preserved. Payment should be made for trees that were cut down, because the matai would be used for sleepers. He said that he was going to keep his kahikatea trees," because in summer he used the berries of that tree for food. John Ormsby : I want to say a few words with regard to what Eangianini and others have said with regard to what our views are concerning these timbers—kahikatea, &c. I understood Mr. Ballance to say that he had been informed that it would be very expensive to make a road from Alexandria to Kawhia to tap the railway-line. That is wrong. It would not take much money to make it. During the present time the Government is economical. It is fair to say, now that the road from Kawhia to Kopua is already finished, that it would be, perhaps, about twelve miles from Kopua to the railway-line. There is the large Waipa Eiver between, and the Mangawhare, which would require to be bridged. If the road were made from Kopua to Alexandria it would be only about four miles in extent; it is all level land ; there are no hills to go over, and no creeks to bridge; and this small length of road would open some very valuable land; and it would only take a very small vote to make it. That is why we think that, for the present time, the road should go there. Kingi Hori : I belong to one of the four tribes who have ownership in this land—Ngatimaniapoto, Ngatiraukawa, Ngatituwharetoa, and Whanganui. My first word to you is this: I have much greeting to give you, because you are a stranger; but I shall leave all that on one side. My word to you is, to be very clear in managing matters that pertain to the Natives, that is, those Natives within this provincial district that I have mentioned—the four tribes. They are making friends with you; therefore I say to you that your management should be proper. We wish you to do away with everything that they object to. You must consider that this is a trial effort of theirs to deal with the things according to European custom. I have lots of things to talk to you about, but Ngatimaniapoto yesterday ruled some of them out of order. One thing I want to speak to you about is this: If any applications for surveys of land in the Taupo District are sent in, they are not to be allowed. I believe this matter was mentioned by Ngatimaniapoto yesterday; but, as this is the first time I have seen you, I want to deliver my speech regarding this question. I support Wahanui's request regarding the railway-line—that you should not be in a hurry to proceed with the formation of the line. Give us time to discuss this matter with the whole of the four tribes that own the land within the boundary. Salutations to you. Hopa te Bangianini: I consider the line has gone through. The whole thing is settled; we are only talking now subsequent to the settlement of it. This is merely a Committee of Management. With regard to that Kawhia road over Pirongia, Ido not care what they do with it.