17

I.—2a

484. But did you not know that, when you became trustee with Mr. Sheehan, you were guardians of money belonging to the children of Wi Apo ? —I understood that. 485. Did you know what your powers were as trustee ? Did you know that nobody else could dispose of this money except Mr. Sheehan jointly with yourself ? —According to the law I understood that. 486. Did you keep any account, any record at all, of the money that you received as trustee ?—I never got any money. 487. You have no recollection of receiving any money except what was counted out to you in the old Club in Official Bay ?—That was all I know. 488. That was the only money that you ever received as trustee ? —Those are the only moneys I ever received in my possession as trustee, with the exception of what I got for the survey. 489. Did you get that money for the survey before you were trustee at all ? —lt was after I became a trustee. 490. It was in compensation, was it not ? —I paid £100 for the survey, and what I got in return was £75. 491. After this money had been paid to you in the old Club by Mr. Nelson, did you go and put it into the bank ? —Yes, I took the money to the bank. 492. Did you understand that you were putting it into the bank for safe keeping as trustee ?— Yes—on behalf of the children. 493. Was it £300 that you paid in?—No ; £400. 494. You are quite sure it was £400 ? —Yes, I know it was £400. 495. Do you not think you may be making a mistake by including the survey money with other money, when you say it was £400? —No; I would not make a mistake, because there were £450 put on one side for Panapa and £450 for the children in the division of the money. 496. And then £25 was given to you, and £25 given to Te Hemara, leaving £400 that went into the bank: is that it ? —Te Hemara got £25 of the survey money, and I got £75. 497. Well, then you seem to make a mistake about this money, because you tell me that you paid £400 into the bank, and yet you say that at the hotel at Wairiri the money was divided into two parts —£450 for Panapa and £450 for yourself —and yet you Bay there was only £400. Where was the other £50? —In the first place the money was divided into two parts, £450 for Panapa and £450 for myself. It was then said that the survey had to be paid for; and on account of the survey £50 was paid, leaving £400. That £50, added to the £25 I had received from Nelson at his house, and the £25 received by Te Hemara, made up the £100. 498. Was this money all in notes ?—All in notes. 499. What sort of notes were they ? £1, £50, or £100 notes ?—There were £50, £30, £20, and £10 notes. 500. Now, when you went to the bank to pay this money in you retired from the counter, leaving Mj. Nelson standing at the counter: is that so ? —Yes. 501. Did you see the bank clerk fill in a receipt for the money after he had counted it out ? — Yes. 502. What sort of paper was it? —It was a white piece of paper. 503. Are you quite sure it was a white piece of paper? —1 know it was a white piece of paper. Mr. Nelson gave me the paper. I could not read what was in it, but lam sure it was a white piece of paper. 504. You are quite sure you did not sign it ? —I did not. I waited for the man to call me over to sign it, but he did not do so; and Mr. Nelson brought the piece of paper over to me. 505. Do you think there were not two papers filled in at the bank that day ? —The only one I know of is the one Mr. Nelson gave to me. 506. You did not see another one written ? —No ; I was some distance from the counter, and did not see. 507. Was Mr. Sheehan with you ? —When I got the paper from Nelson Mr. Sheehan appeared. 508. But, before you got the paper at all, do you not think there was another paper that was filled in by one of your party and given to the banker ?-*I do not know. 509. You are quite sure that you did not sign though ?—No, I did not. 510. This paper was given to the banker that day, and has been kept by the banker ever since ?— I did not see the paper in that shape. 511. It is a record for the banker of money that has been paid in and given into his care?— Yes. 512. It is signed with your name, "Arama Karaka Au Tutu " ?—Yes. I never saw that paper. I did not sign that paper. 513. Yet you say that it is like your signature? —No. 514. Did you ever sign your name, "Au Tutu Arama Karaka " ? —No; I do not write that way. 515. Do you ever recollect signing your name, "Arama Karaka," with "Au Tutu " over the top of it?— No. When I sign my name I sign "Arama Karaka," and finish with "Au Tutu." I never place it on the top. 516. Autuiu is your Native name ? —Yes. 517. Arama Karaka is what we call your Christian name ?—Yes. 518. And it is never customary with a Maori to put his Maori name before his Christian name, or over the top of it ? —ln these days, when we know how to write, we never place the Maori name before the Christian name, but always the other way. 519. Do you think that you ever in your life signed your name "Aututu Arama Karaka " ?—No. 520. Suppose any one were to show you a document signed "Aututu Arama Karaka," would you say at once that was not your signature because the names were so placed ? —lt would not appear that way; it would appear "Arama Karaka Aututu." 521. Would the other be sufficient to make you think that you had not signed it ?—I should say that it was not my signature. 3—l. 2a.

Arama Raraka. Aug. 4,1880.