17

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we are deprived of our mana. I say that these evils arose from the Treaty of Waitangi. First came the treaty, then the Native Land Courts. AVas it the Queen who set up these Courts, or was it the Government ? I say it was the Government. Ido not think that it is the fault of the Government that these Courts are not good. The Maoris are responsible for part of the fault. Listen, all the people in this house. I say that the fault of the Maoris is, that where there are a number of claims to a block of land, they get some of them thrown out. Paul Tuhaere: That was according to the first Native Lands Act. Under that Act only a certain number of claims were allowed to be inserted as owners in the Crown grants. The number was limited to ten, but now the whole of the names are inserted in the Act. Eruena: AVhen claimants get up in Court who have no claims to the land, and make statements, the Judges take those statements down in writing, and say these men are speaking the truth. These are the wrongs committed by the Natives that I have seen. Te Hemara: I support what the Chairman said; and I also endorse a portion of what the last speaker said. But Ido not agree with the other portions. With reference to the Treaty of Waitangi. I was present when it was signed. All my fathers were there also. Also Pomare, Tako, Kiwi, and Kawiti were there. I saw the making of that treaty, in the days of Busby. When Governor Hobson came there was a great deal of talking. This was the word of Ngapuhi from the Bay of Islands to Ngapuhi and the North Cape, " Welcome, pakehas." The Ngapuhi were the first friends of the pakeha, from the time that tho chief Hongi went to England. Therefore the Ngapuhis decided to enter into that treaty at AVaitangi. The chiefs of the North went there, but the chiefs from the south part of the Island did not assemble at AVaitangi. The Ngapuhis gave their sovereignty to the Queen. They placed all their thoughts before the Queen, and left them for her to consider, and to devise measures for their benefit. The words of the Queen were that the mana of the chiefs would be left in their possession, that they were to retain the mana of their lands, fisheries, pipi-grounds, forests. These were the stipulations of the Queen in reply to the terms agreed to by Ngapuhi. Another promise of the Queen was that she would protect these Islands, lest foreign nations should come and fight against the people of these Islands. These were the only words of the Queen that I heard. I will speak now as to the disadvantages arising from the treaty. The disadvantages began with the Gospel; they came from the ministers. I will explain that to you. The word of that old lady the Queen was clear. The word of the ministers was, " Worship God." The whole Island then turned to worship God. The people turned their eyes up towards heaven. None of them looked down. Let the faults of the Maoris and the pakehas be made known. The pakeha ministers said, "Be strong in worship for eight years." The Maoris then all turned to the faith of the ministers. But the ministers did not bear in mind the words of the Queen. They said to the Maoris, " AVhat is the price of these lands ?" The Maoris had their eyes turned towards heaven ; but they just looked down and saw the iron pots, the fish-hooks, the packets, needles, blankets, aud white shirts. These were the articles that were paid for this Island. That is the cause of our grievances to-day. The Maoris accepted these articles as payment for their lands. They did not know what use to put their lands to at that time. That is the cause of our misfortune. The whole of the Bay of Islands was purchased with those worthless articles. The sight of money was not seen. The Divine Law was taught, but the law in regard to man was not taught. Then the Government was established here. Then, when the land had gone from us, they saw our misfortune, and they produced the words of the Queen from their breasts. Then the Ngapuhis trembled under the feet of the stipulations they had made with the Queen. Then came the misfortunes which were produced by the fighting of Ngapuhi against the pakehas. When these misfortunes were perceived the Conference of Kohimarama was held. It was held after war had commenced, when guns had beeu fired. But the Treaty of AVaitangi was made when the sun was shining. Even if this Treaty of Kohimarama was made during war, still some good arose from it. The people sent there were chosen like the people who are sent to Parliament; they were elected to vote. All the chiefs of the Island were present at Kohimarama. Tho Conference at Kohimarama was held for the purpose of suppressing tho King movement and the war. After all these things the Native Land Court was established. Then we perceived our misfortunes when it was decided that pakehas should be Judges of the Court. AVhat did the pakehas know of Maori customs that they should be appointed Judges ? Sometimes in these Courts a chief would get up and claim the land ; but a man of inferior birth would also claim. The land was awarded to the chief, and the man of inferior birth got nothing. These are the subjects which ought to be discussed here together. But, listen. The pakehas are not to blame ; all the Natives in this Island committed part of the fault. The only fault of the pakehas is that they have taken the mana of the whole Island. They do not leave any mana over the land or the sea to the chiefs. There was no reason for depriving the chiefs of their mana. Therefore the people should be strong in talking these matters over here to-day. Te Eetimana Waiho (Hikuraugi) : This is my time. I will speak of this Treaty of Kohimarama. I will not speak of the old treaty, because the words I heard were spoken here. If our fathers are gone, their words still remain. I will cease to speak of the old people who have departed. I will apeak of the words of the Queen that were sent to this Island. She said to Potatau, " I will send pakehas into your midst : whether they be chiefs, men of inferior birth, slaves, or destitute persons, I will send them to you." Potatau replied to that and welcomed the Europeans. The Queen said that his words showed great affection for her. Then the Governors were sent here. Governor Hobson came ; then Governor Fitzroy. The words of that man were, that the Maoris should retain their own mana. This was his firm promise, that the Maoris should not be deprived of their mana. No, lam wrong ; these were the words of Governor Browne: there have been so many Governors that I forget. But not long after these promises wrong was done to us. AVrong was done to me. I will not speak of tho wrong that was done to others, but only of the wrong that was done to me. On that day when wrong was done to me, Tawhiao said, " Come, all the wise people; come into my presence." When they did not come, Tawhiao said, " AVell, I will build my own house." The posts were mahoe and matai, and the ridge-pole was made of hinau (of inferior timbers). Tawhiao also said that he 3—G. 8.