THE HON. W. P. REEVES IN AUCKLAND.

New Zealand Herald, Volume XXIX, Issue 9023, 31 October 1892, Page 6

THE HON. W. P. REEVES IN AUCKLAND.

ADDRESS IN THE CITY HALL. The Minister for Education and Labour, the Hon. W. P. Reeves, addressed a meeting of Auckland citizens in the City Hall on Saturday night. There were probably 500 people present, and among them were many ladies. The platform was crowded by gentlemen well known in connection with public affairs, and one or two of the gentler sex were also seated thereon. The Mayor (Mr. W. Crowther) presided, and the following were among those who supported him on the stage: The Hon. P. Dignan, M.L.C.; the Hon. W. Swanson, M.L.C.; the Hon. W. McCullough, M.L.C.; the Hon. W. Jennings, M.L.C.; Messrs. T. Thompson, W. Kelly, and E. M. Smith, M.H.R.'s; Miss Morrison, Messrs. J. A. Tole, R. McDonald Scott, T. W. Leys, D. A. Tole, C. S. S. Wright, A. Kelly, W. Beehan, fl. T. Garratt, John King,W. Duncan, G. Peacocke, W. J. Napier, O. Mays, J. C. Firth, Luks, and Dr. Beale. The Mayor, in opening the meeting, read a number of letters of apology for non-attendance, and proceeded to say that owing to the necessity of holding the meeting on a Saturday night—Mr. Reeves having to leave the city on the following Monday—he had been afraid that part of his duty would have been to apologise to that gentleman for the smallness of the meeting. Everything considered, however, he thought the meeting a good one, and he was confident that Mr. Reeves would be accorded a most patient hearing. At anyrato he knew that even if j the inclinations of the audience were i otherwise, which he did not for a moment suppose, whenever Mr. Reeves began his address he would command attention. It had been said that Mr. Reeves was one of our coming men, and so far as could be judged from what the public had read and heard of him, there was every reason to believe that the statement was true. (Applause.) It had been said in what was termed in Wellington "anotherplace," that he was too young and inexperienced to be trusted with a position of great responsibility, but the people had had so much of the old wranglers and scramblers that they were anxious to try the younger members. (Applause.) The last time a public meeting had been held in that hall ib had been to hear the Premier, and all who attended had heard a very good speech, and, he was sure, had learned something from what Mr. Ballance said. He was certain that they would also have an excellent speech from Mr. Reeves, and he had arranged with that gentleman not to keep them too long. At the conclusion of his address Mr. Reeves would answer any questions on matters connected with his department. In the first place, however, he believed that an address was to be presented to the honourable gentleman. Mr. F. Walker then read the following address To the Hon. W. P. Reeves. Sir,We, the undersigned authorised committee of the shop assistants of Auckland, desire, on their behalf and by their request, to present our sincere thanks to you lor your earnest and successful effort in passing the Shop Assistants Bill, and through yourself to the Government of which you are a Minister, lor this necessary and beneficial law. We recognise with pleasure and satisfaction that the policy of the Government is on the lines of humanity, that its administration is for the protection of labour as well as capital. Had this not been the case, we should have still been left to fight our own hopeless battle against the tyranny of those few who refuse to recognise the justice of our claim for our afternoon's rest and leisure ; and while such is its policy you may rest assured that it will receive the earnest and practical support of the shop assistants of Auckland. Whilst fully aware that the Act passed is in a certain degree imperfect (and are sorry it did not become law as passed by the House of Representatives), we are, nevertheless, thankful that the principle for which we have so long striven is now established. Should it become necessary to amend the Act— we fear it may—we shall ask you to use your influence in the direction ana to the extent of making Saturday afternoon a compulsory half-holiday, believing that such would meet the wishes of fully eighty-five (85) per cent, of the employers of Auckland, and if the assistants themselves are considered, as they should be, then fully ninetynine (99) per cent, of these are vitally interested in this question. Should compulsion, however, be considered inadvisable, and a local option or a permissive measure be submitted instead, we think we, as citizens ot a democratic country, are fully entitled to claim the right of a voice and a vote in the settlement of a question which so vitally affects the health, happiness, and comfort of ourselves and families. We are pleased to note in the public press that it is your intention to amend this measure at the next session of Parliament, and we trust that with the new appointments to the Legislative Council better results will be attained, and that your efforts will not again be thwarted, but that you will be enabled to pass an efficient and workable measure. Again thanking you for your constant and consistent advocacy of our cause,—We remain, dear sir, F. Walker, C. G. Morgan, John Self, S. Stanton, J. A. Pike, Thos. Jones, H. Gowek, Theo. G. Qceree, Alfred H. Chappell, J. S. Dickson (Hon. Sec). Mr. Reeves said that in reply to the address he could only express the great pleasure which a public man must always feel when he found that his efforts on behalf of any section of the community were recognised in such a way. Recognition of that kind was the only and the best reward that a representative- of the people could obtain for his efforts on their behalf, and if he got that it was all he could expect. He had been in a somewhat peculiar position with regard to the Shop Hours Bill, and it had come back from the Council in such a mangled condition that he had hesitated whether to accept it or hold it over till next session. He eventually decided to take ib, as it was on the principle that even a crust was better than no bread, and he thought that the action of the shop assistants that night was proof that he had been right. (Applause). In beginning to make a speech he did not usually feel nervous —unfortunately he had too much practice for that—but on that occasion he did approach his audience with some slight degree of trepidation. Not only was it the ! first time that he had addressed a meeting in one of the oldest, one of the largest, and certainly the most beautiful city in New Zealand, but he also felt that, through the kind representations of his brethren of the Press those he addressed had been brought together on false pretences as to his oratorical capabilities. In a city accustomed to hear such men as Sir George Grey he would not think of pretending to oratory, but he would speak of matters of the greatest importance to all, and hope that interest in the matter would make amends for any defects in the manner of its presentation. He supposed they were all quite I tired of hearing the praises of their city sung, bub a piece of news had come to him that day which showed one of the advantages of its position. This piece of news was that H.M.s. Ringarooma had been suddenly ! ordered to proceed to Samoa. That showed very clearly the advantages of Auckland's position as a naval station, because while the Ringarooma was probably not the nearest warship to Samoa, it was at the nearest place connected with headquarters by telegraph. In regard to Samoa he might say that while the condition of affairs was decidedly strange and certainly required watching, there was no immediate cause for alarm. He had also come to the conclusion that Auckland possessed peculiar claims as a political centre, and he could see that a district of such a size and of so great importance should never be left very long without the presence of a Minister. He knew that the Premier and Mr. Buckley had formed the same opinion, and when he went back he would keep that impression alive. THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. Another thing to which he would refer before proceeding to deal with labour questions was the recent appointments to I to the Legislative Council. He might begin by referring to the constitutional aspect of the question, but that had been thoroughly threshed out, and as the Government had won they could afford to say very little about it. When they hud referred the question to the authorities in England their opponents had said that they were depriving the people of New Zealand of one of their rights and privileges, but he thought the result was that they had obtained fo? the people of the colony a full admission of their power and right to manage their own affairs. (Applause.), The opponents of the Government had been i good enough to prophesy that the result [ would be very different, bub unfortunately

for them nearly all of their main predictions had been falsified. (Applause.) Their opponents had begun by saying that they were going to ruin the country and rush into a deficit; instead of that, they had rushed into the greatest surplus that the colony had ever known. It had been said that they would rush into a policy of borrowing ; instead of that, they had taught the colony a policy of self-reliance. (Applause.) Other prophecies, such as that they would lose the Edwards case, the Wellington election, and so forth, had all turned out wrongly— fact, the Government had acquired an awkward and most persistent knack of winning what they were told they ought to lose. He fancied this was a knack that the Liberal party of New Zealand had now learnt; thoroughly, and one which they would be very slow to lose. As to the personnel of the gentlemen who had been called tc the Council, it had been said that they would appoint red - hob anarchists and socialists, and that when the list was announced there would bo a howl of indignation from one end of the colony to the other. Now, the men who had been appointed w%re men of irreproachable character, men of undoubted ability, and men of experience in the public affairs of the colony. The Auckland appointments had, he knew, been most favourably received, and they deserved to be. He might pointout thab'some qualities were required in the Lower House that were not required in the Upper House. Quickness and dash had to be replaced by patience, caution, and deliberateness, and he thought those were qualities that would be found in no small degree in the gentlemen who had been called. It had been said that the Government were taking away the freedom and liberty of the Legislative Council. They had taken nothing from it, but they had given it a great deal. They had given it fresh blood and vigour, and, above all, they had given it an infusion of liberal ideas. (Applause.) It might bo said that the Government had done nothing more than appoint twelve good men to the Council, but from another point of view it must be considered a departure of considerable importance. He referred to the appointment of four labour members, and he hoped it would be recognised that the Government had, for the first time, laid it down that the second Chamber should no longer represent property and property alone. There were now in the Council four men who represented the working classes of the colony. It had been prophesied that if ■working men were allowed to take part in the government of the colony, Parliament would be given over to loud-voiced spouters and rabid Socialists, but what did they find ? The men selected were noted for their high character, their respectability, and their thorough manliness, and he thought the working classes would say that the Government had appointed men who would capably and conscientiously represent them. Id would be generally admitted that fresh blood had been wanted in the Upper House. He was not going to entertain bis audience by exploding fireworks against the Council. It contained men who had done their work well, but also contained men who had not, and who would not be elected to the Lower House. It contained men who had once been good men, but who, through no fault of their own, but simply from the lapse of time, had ceased to bo so, and it contained others who had never been good men. Its numerical strength of late years had been far below what it ought to have been. Since the present Government had been in power, they had really had no majority in Parliament as a whole. They had had a majority un the Lower House, but in the Upper House they had no party at all They had been called upon to face obstruction in the Lower House and destruction in the Upper House, a combination of difficulties it was unfair that any party should have to meet. He did not think the Council had done its work well, and of late years it bad been worse in that respect than previously. To borrow a parallel from Mr. Backland's famous Washers and Mangier** Bill, the Council was supposed to consist of the washers and manners of Pajliament. (Laughter and applause.) Ho was bound to say that of recent years they had neglected their duty of washing, so as to dc-vote all their energies to mangling, and instead of putting starch into the measures sent to them, they had taken all the starch that was in them out. (Applause. LENGTH OF THE SESSION". The Government bad been blamed for the delays and loss of time which had characterised last session, but the public would also have read that no less than four Ministers had within the last two months been laid on beds of sickness through the work and strain of the session. Any fair and impartial man who had watched the four long months of the session would say that the responsibility for the delay rested upon the Opposition and the Opposition alone. (Applause.) Ho did not say that the leader or any individual members of the Opposition were to blame, bub ho did say that as a party they were responsible for the loss of time. Mr. Rolleston had not always led his party in this respect, but had followed them in order that he might be thought to lead. If it had not been for the Opposition tactics the session would have lasted only twelve weeks instead of sixteen, and one-third more work would probably have been done. He hoped the electors would bear this in mind at next election, and emphatically condemn any waste of time, and also that the Standing Orders of the House would be so amended that to cause such delays would be extremely difficult, instead of as at present ridiculously easy. (Applause.) CHARGES AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT. He would proceed in a few minutes to talk about the legislation and the departmental work for which he was specially responsible, but before doing so he would refer in a few sentences to one or two general charges made against their Government. They could hardly take up an Opposition newspaper without reading that the Government were a Government which set class against class ; that they were doing their best to set town against country; that their legislation was class legislation, and that they desired to divide the community into sections, legislating for on e section at the expense of the other. Now, with regard to the charge of class legislation : To a certain extent that must be admitted, because there was no Government which did not pass what might be called class legislation, for if they took the trouble to look into the New Zeal -nd statute-book, or to look into the English statute-book, for the matter of that, they would see that the iinmeuse number of policy measures passed at various times must be displeasing to one section of the people, as they were pleasing to another ; and they always found that the displeased section raised the cry of class legislation. BENEFICIAL CLASS LEGISLATION. If they read history, if they looked at the history of reform in England through the whole of this century, they would see that the best and most beneficial measures that the English Parliament had passed were open to the charge of class legislation. What was that great measure by which the coloured slaves in the British Empire were emancipated—that great measure passed by William Wilberforce by which property in the slave was taken away from the owner, and every man in the British Empire was guaranteed the inalienable right of freedom —was that not class legislation ? (Cheers.) It took away a right from one class, and gave it to another. (Renewed cheers.) Let them take the succession of Factory Acts, the first of which was passed by Lord Shaftesbury, and which have been carried down to the present day—what were they but class legislation? Legislation such as that, their Government, in their humble way, had passed into law into New Zealand. The Factory Acts were just as much class legislation as the Acts passed on behalf of the coloured slaves, and in fact they were emancipation Acts also, for they took the chains of industrial slavery off tens of thousands of workers who were indeed whiteslaves. (Cheers.) What was the Irish Land Act—the noblest and most beneficial work of William Gladstone—(Applause)— what was that but class legislation ? It took away, property from one class and gave it to another. -•* What was the Disestablishment of the Irish Church ,but: class legislation • What was the enlargement of the franchise in England bub a measure of class legislation? — for it extended the powers and privileges of the franchise to class after class until they had been given to almost all the people of England. If they looked at the matter from this point of view, of course, some of the measures of the present Government might fairly be called class legislation. It was a strange thing, however, that when they passed i measures to which their opponents did not

specially object, they did not hear, the cry of class legislation. When they passed measures approved by the farming community, there was no word of class legislation. To quote, for another instance, the Bankruptcy Bill. In one sense that might of course be said to be a measure which affected all classes— (laughter)—but it was carried through at the wish of the commercial class, and was especially pleasing to the mercantile class. But when that Bill waa going through they did not hear the cry of class- legislation raised by the mercantile class or their representatives. (Applause.) The mercantile men took the Bill, and were very glad to get it. town AN ft COUNTRY. Then there was the charge against the Government that they were setting town against country. This charge was really too absurd. Let them take a map of New Zealand and look at it, and they would see that if ib were a mere question of broad acres, the Liberal party represented the greater spaCft. of the surface of New Zealand. Did they think then that such a party would bo so foolish as to set town against country ? It was said that the whole of their party consisted of town and suburban representatives. This was nob so. Some of those who were bitterest against them were representatives of town or suburban constituencies. Three of their bitterest opponents in the House of Representatives were members elected by town constituencies—Mr. Fish, Mr. Fisher, and Mr. D.ithie. He did not class Sir George Grey with them, but he certainly thought that he was nob to bo called a supporter of the present Government. (Hear, hear.) Then there were other gentlemen representing town and suburbs, who though not strongly antagonistic to them, were more or less independent- in their action in the House. Why, the leader of the Opposition, Mr. Kolleston, himself represented a district one end of which comprised one of the suburbs of Christchurch. The present Government had never attempted to set town against country. It was their opponents who had tried to set the country against the towns. (Hear, hear.) LEGISLATION FOR COUNTRY SETTLERS. If they read the Opposition newspapers, and especially those weekly newspapers circulating in the country districts, they would see that week after week, and month after month, there had been nothing but one perpetual attempt to paint this Government as one opposed to the farmers and landowning classes in the country. ■ (Hear, hear.) Let them just take the trouble to look down the list of measures this Government had passed since they took office. Was ib because they were hostile to the country and the interests of the country settlers that they had devoted the greatest of their efforts last session to the passing of the -Land Bill, which dealt entirely with country matters, and the great object of which was to settle the waste lands of the country as quickly as possible ? Was it because they were hostile to the country that they had passed the Native Land Purchase Bill or the Land for Settlements Bill, to enable them to acquire possession of land, so that settlement might increase rapidly? Was it because they were opposed to the interests of the country that they had passed the Dairy Industry Bill, and other Bills especially affecting and benefiting the farming classes ? Was it because of their enmity to the country that they had introduced a measure designed to aid in the irrigation of the dry plains in the South, and to help the farmers who lived on them ? If they examined a great part of the legislation introduced by the Government, they would find that it was legislation especially designed in the interests of the country settler. (Hear, hear.) For instance, the Land and Income Tax Bill, the most important and most extensive which they brought down. This had been absurdly described as a Bill to take taxation off the towns and put . it on the country ; but, on the contrary, , the only class upon whom entirely fresh taxation had been placed by that Bill was the professional and salaried class in the towns—professional men whose incomes and salaries entirely escaped the property tax. That Bill was a Bill to take taxation off the country settler and put it on the great estates. (Loud cheers.) LABOUR PILLS. Turning to his own department, and the Bills for which he was specially responsible, they found that the present Government had passed in the two sessions in which | they had been in office, the Employers' ! Liability Act and its amending Act of last session, the Truck Act, the Factories Act, the Shop and Shop Assistants Act, the Servants Registry Offices Act, and the Workmen's Lien Act. Now, speaking generally of i:hese measures, he would say that instead of its being charged against them that they had done very little in two sessions in getting these on the Statute-book, he knew of no Government which could claim to have done so much in the way of labour legislation in so short a time. Comparing these Acts with the absence of similar measures i n other countries, he would say that New Zealand was now ahead of any other part of the British Empire in its labour legislation. (Hear, hear.) LIABILITY of employers. j The Employers' Liability Bill, as they knew, was simply an Act to make it more easy for workmen damaged through defects in machinery or the carelessness of employers, to recover fair damages. In the amending Act it was provided that a man injured, or his family, might recover up to three years' wages, or £500, and various hampering restrictions to the right of recovery were removed. The position of apprentices had been further improved, and the Act had been extended to seamen and railway servants, to whom it was doubtful whether it applied before. In this year's Act he had inserted a clause enabling a man to an employer who had let rotten pffTnt or machinery to a sub-contractor who was a man of straw, and not worth proceeding against. That was to say, a man might not escape responsibility for injury done through his defective plant or machinery, merely because he had sub-let it. There was now in the Act another clause to which he would refer, because very amusing criticisms had been levelled against it in the House and in the newspapers. It was a clause defining the right of a workman to recover from the employer of another workman by whose negligence he had been injured. It had always been considered that two men in the employ of one man must take their chance of one another's carelessness ; and it had also been thought that if two men were working on what might be called the same undertaking, although in the employ of different men, and one was injured through the negligent act of the other, the injured man could have no claim for compensation. Recently in the English House of Lords it was decided that in such a case an injured man could recover. Ho embodied thi;> dictum in the New Zealand Bill ; and they should have heard the howl about it. Actually this dictum, this decision of no less a body than the English House of Lords had been quoted as an example of American Socialism. (Laughter.) Such were the charges brought against a Labour Ministry ! THE TRUCK ACT. When the Truck Bill was brought down last year its opponents did not hesitate to say that it would lead to a deadlock of all industry. The Bill had been carefully thought over and amended ; and when all the rational objections had been met those opposed to the measure turned round and said that it would be a dead-letter and no use whatever. Neither the one prediction nor the other had been fulfilled. The " Bill had not prevented enterprise or hampered industry ; neither had ib been a dead-letter. The Bill provided that when a man earned wages they must be paid to him in money, and in nothing el*e—(hear, hear)—and that they must be paid at (intervals of not less than one month. It also provided that when an employer gave goods to a workman on credit, ho must nob be allowed to set-off the wages of the workman in payment for goods. (Hear, hear.) Yet when he tried to pass that Bill, it was howled against as a piece of Socialism. FACTORY LEGISLATION. The next. Act about which he would say a word was that relating to factories. That of course was more important than either of the others. It dealt with a very large class of people, and endeavoured to prevent inconveniences and hardships which had been suffered by the workers in factories, and which would have boen more severely felt with every year that passed over our heads. j The Act provided for the registration of factories, so that it would be known what factories were, and where they were. Ib I

provided also for their inspection, by the mapping-outof thedistrictßandappointment of inspectors. This year an amending Act had beep passed appointing a chief inspector. The most important) part of the Factories Act dealt with , sanitation. Factories were required to be roomy, clean, and well-ventilated, and inspectors were given the right to see that they were so. Then the Bill regulated the number of hours of working for women and young persons ; it provided that they were to have a half-holiday everv week from one o'clock in the afternoon ; that women and girls shall not woric for more than four da-half hours without a meal, that boys shall not work for more than 48 hours in a week, and that women shall not work before eighb'o'clock in the morning or after six o'clock in the evening, nor be forced to eat their meals in the unwholesome atmosphere of the room in which they work. (Applause.) Furthermore, the Act limited the age of child labour. No girl would be allowed to work in factories before the age of 14 years ; no girl could work at type-setting or other occupations supposed to be injurious before she had reached the age of 15 years, and no boy could work in a factory until he was 13 years of age. Just to give one example of the extent to which our labour legislation was ahead of that of other countries, he would mention that our factory ages were the highest in the world. Not satisfied with that, he would like to see them one year higher, because he though that boys as well as girls did quite well if they began their factory work at fifteen years of age. (Hear, hear.) The Legislative Councillors thought differently,* however, and so the Government were obliged to accept the compromise. OTHER LABOUR MEASURES. The Workmen's Lien Bill was one of the measures of last session. It was designed to give workmen a legal guarantee that they would get their pay when they had done their work. Under this Act, not only workmen, but subcontractors had the right of registering a lien. It had been asked, Why does this Government, which does not believe in sub-contractors, act in this way to help sub-contractors? The reply was that all private building work for some time would be done by contractors I and sub-contractors, and to protect them meant the protection of the workmen. ! They had to take things as they were, and if the contractors or sub-contractors were not paid, the chances were that the workmen would not be paid either. Mr. Reeves 'also explained the Servants' Registry Offices Act. SHOP AND SHOP ASSISTANTS ACT. Another measure in which a greab deal of interest was taken was the Shop and Shop Assistants Act. As he introduced it, it provided for the compulsory closing of shops on one day of the week, leaving it to the local body in each district to proclaim any one day on which the half-holiday would be observed, and giving them power to allow any speciul trade that would be inconvenienced by that day, to choose another day. He had thought that necessary then, and he thought so still, and principally on account of such trades as the butchers' and photographers. The photographers, he had been informed, did a great deal of their business on public holidays—those, in fact, were their best daysand as for the butchers, if tho holiday was observed on Saturday it would be almost impossible for the butchers to close on that day. That Bill, as he had introduced it, was not a Bill which would have been tyrannical; a few fresh arrangements would have had to be made under it, and a few local trade customs altered, and employers and customers, and all those concerned, would have known where they were. Under the Bill as amended they practically did not know where they were, and he did not think they would find out until the Bill had been amended. The Council had altered the Bill by inserting a provision enabling all shops to remain open, while providing that everybody who worked in shops must have a half-holiday. It seemed to him that if it was an unwarrantable interference with the liberty of the subject to compel people to close their shops for half-a-day in each week, ib was an equal interference to order employers to give everybody who worked in shops, a half-holiday. He did not see the distinction at all. As the Act stood a man might let some of his assistants away on one day, some on another, some on a third, and so he might keep his shop open on every day in the week, while he was obliged to work short-handed all the time. So far a? he could judge from the expressions of public opinion, the public would very much prefer that there should be one day on which all the shops should be shut. (Hear, hear.) He believed himself that great efforts would be made to shut shops generally on one day in the week all over the colony, and that most of the shops would be shut on one day in the week ; and that was what he wanted. Tho trouble with the Act in its present form would be that there would always be mutual heartburnings and recriminations. One employer would De thinking that somebody else in the same trade did not shut; there would be one or two men who would try to keep open arid get a little trade, and those who treated the Act fairly and shut on Id be discontented, while the public would never be quite certain about the holiday. So that he did not see who would bo satisfied, except the few people who did not want the Act. He had simply taken the Bill under protest from the Council, and would try to get it amended next year. He had taken the Bill because it put on the statute-book the principle of tne half-holiday. (Cheers.) He had taken the Bill, but upon the Legislative Council lay the responsibility for all the inconvenience that might result. LABOUR DEPARTMENT BILL. Having spoken of the Coalmines Act as a labour measure, and explained some of its provisions, Mr. Reeves went on to speak of the labour measures which had nob become law. One of these was of minor importance, and the other was of very great importance. The first was the Labour Department Bill. He introduced that himself in the session just closed, but owing to the enormous waste of time and the obstruction offered to the Government legislation ib could not be proceeded with. A great deal of howling had been raised that it was a Bill for the creation of new billets, and a new and expensive department. It was nothing of the kind. It was a Bill to enable the present officers of tho Labour Department to collect labour statistics, and to do it in a complete way—to collect information showing the conditions under which labour goes on, tho money paid as wages, the condition of the labour market, the cost of living, and so on. This was information of the very greatest importance, and inforformation without which politicians and public men would be working in the dark. This was information also for working-men, because they wanted to know the condition of their own class throughout the colony. I Without information of that sort, how could Parliament know the exact effect of Pro- j tection or Free-trade, or the raising or lowering of the Customs tariff? For these reasons, he had wanted to pass the Bill, and he would want to pass ib next session. (Cheers.) INDUSTRIAL CONCILIATION AND ARBITRATION. Last, but nob least, he would refer to the Bill for industrial conciliation and arbitration, This was a Bill in which no doubt they had all taken an intelligent interest. Its history was very simple. He introduced it the session before last, and circulated it, but there was no opportunity of passing it, as other measures had to be considered. It was introduced last session, passed its second reading, referred to the Labour Bills Committee, who examined and amended ib in many ways. Many of the amendments he himself proposed, and nearly all of them had his fullest concurence. The Bill came down to the House again, and was read a third time without alteration. lb was H»nt to the Legislative Council, there it was read a second time, and tho Council then sent ib to a special committee, the special committee did almost nothing with it, and it came back to the Council again. The Council did nob seem to know what to do with it. They did nob like to pass it, and did not seem to be able to pass it in any workable shape. What they did was this ; they took a blue pencil, and ran this pencil through the Bill, cutting out twenty-four clauses relating to the Court of Arbitration. Then they sent back to the House what was called the amended Bill. If that was amendment, all ho could say was that amputation was amendment. (Laughter and cheers.) If that was amendment, it was amendment of a man to cut off his head, and to lop off his arms and legs, and to send his family his mutilated and useless j trunk ; because that was the condition in

[ which bin Bill came back to him. (Laughter.) The House had a conference with the Council. He offered a compromise : the gentlemen who represented the Council admitted that there was something | in it; but after retiring and considering it, they came back and said virtually this: That they were very sorry it was so late in the session; that had the thing come up earlier something of the kind might have been done on the lines he had suggested, bnt as it was so late in the session, it was useless to expect the Council to deal carefully with so large a question as that. That was the end of the Bill. In that -handed way the Council had disposed of one of the most important and most necessary measures, he ventured to say, ever submitted to the Parliament of New Zealand. (Cheers.) A SUBSTITUTE FOR STRIKES. Now, what did this Bill propose? It was designed simply to substitute for strikes and like difficulties, the arbitration of impartial and honest tribunals. Ib would never have put an end to labour troubles, but it would have pub a stop bo those terrible disruptions of industry by which factories are closed, enterprise checked, work stopped, and misery and desolation brought into hundreds and perhaps thousands of homes. (Cheers.) He did not expect that the Bill would be received with enthusiasm by any one class in the community, because it waa nob a Bill which attempted to give an advantage to any one class : it was designed to fairly hold the scale between employer and employed, and was prompted as much in the interests of one class as the other. Although employers had not received it with open arms the attitude of Capt. Russell and other enlightened employers of labour showed thab the Government party might expect to make many converts amongst them when the Bill became thoroughly understood ; and when the Bill, or something like it, passed into law, the employers, he believed, would be the first to bitterly oppose its excision from the statute-book. (Cheers.) UNORGANISED LABOUR. The Minister for Labour, explaining the provisions of the Bill, said that he would not allow any workmen not members of a union to appear before any of the boards of conciliation ; and he would state the reason why : The kind of labour disputes for which State interference had been sought had been entirely disputes in which members of unions were concerned. There had never been any cry for State interference between unorganised workmen and their employers. It had been asserted that if it were the privilege of unionists only to come under the Conciliation Bill thousands of men would join unions to gain that privilege. To that he would merely say that that would be a great compliment to the Conciliation Bill, and a high tribute to the working men of New Zealand. (Cheers.) He did not think they were called upon to legislate for unorganised employes. They appeared to be thoroughly contented with their lot, and so well satisfied with their employers that there was no need for them to organise. (Laughter.) Again, he did not think it would be fair to employers to allow one or two roving workmen to drag an employer before the Board of Conciliation. A union was a substantial body ; it had a status and a reputation to maintain : and that was a reason, why it was unlikely to drag an employer before a Board of Conciliation on a frivolous pretext. (Hear, hear.) The authorities of a union would take care that they would not be perpetually going before a Board, draining their purse until there would be soon no purse to drain. He repeated that it was only right that none other than organised bodies of workmen should have the power of going before these tribunals. It was not necessary to legislate for unorganised workmen because they had not asked for it, and did not want it. THE COURT OF ARBITRATION. He had proposed that the President of the Court of Arbitration should be a Judge of the Supreme Court or a District Court Judge, so that he mi?ht be as impartial a person as possible, and hold the scales fairly. (Cheers.) He had also proposed to give to the Court the power of saying whether its awards should be compulsory. If there was not such a Court as that, the Boards, he believed, would nob be set up at all. They could not be established unless the Unionists and employers co-operated in setting them up ; and, in some districts, employers would probably say, "No, thank you, we do not object to conciliation or arbitration, but we would prefer to do it privately, without State interference. He believed that appeals from the Boards of Conciliation to the Court of Arbitration would be very few and far between. Probably 90 or 95 per cent, of the disputes would be settled by the Boards of Conciliation, and the other 5 per cent, would have to go to the Court of Arbitration, because in some disputes feeling ran so high, and local prejudices prevailed to such a large extent, that those disputes would have to be lifted out of the region of local and party feeling, and decided in the calm judicial atmosphere of the Court of Arbitration. Another objection was that the Bill was supposed to be an insult to the Railway Commissioners, lie did nob think these Commissioners, powerful as they were, were anything more than the same flesh and blood as other colonists, and if it was good that men and women should enjoy a certain privilege why should that privilege be taken away from the thousands who formed tho Amalgamated Society of Railway Employes? He considered this Bill quite as important as any of the other Labour Bills, if not more so. He did nob say ib was a panacea for all the ills of humanity, or a cure for all industrial troubles, but he did say that unless a Bill of the kind were passed in the colony tho relations between employers and employes would in certain crises become intolerable. They would all have noticed that everywhere, in the foremost countries of the world, conciliation and arbitration were being advocated for the settlement of labour disputes. The system of voluntary arbitration had failed in England; what was necessary was State machinery and compulsory arbitration. THE TAILORESSES' DIFFICULTIES. Speaking of labour disputes led him to say a few words about the difficulties which had arisen between the Tailoresses' Union in Auckland and the employers. In order to have spoken freely on the subject he should have done so a little earlier or a little later, as he believed tho matter was now sub judice. The dispute had been referred to the Employers' Association, a high compliment, he thought, to them, and a proper step for Miss Morrison and those associated with her to take, since it showed a confidence in their cause, a confidence he was sure was nob misplaced. He did nob want to go into the case, bub he would say that it deserved every consideration, and if a settlement was arrived at it would show the value of arbitration. The tailoresses had his very best wishes, but if it unfortunately happened that they did not succeed, he hoped they and their fellow-unionists throughout the colony would agitate in favour of the Conciliation Bill. (Applause.) If they did so nine or ten months would see it the law of the country. THE LABOUR BUREAU AND THE CO-OPERATIVE CONTRACT SYSTEM. He was afraid that the discussion of these measures had taken him a much longer time than he expected, and ib was now twenty-five minutes to ten, a great deal too late for him to say all that . he wanted to pay. (Voices: "Go on," and applause.) He had intended to speak with regard to the Labour Bureau and the co-operative contracts. About the co-operative contracts, all he had to say was this, that they worked very well, and that the work was well done. He thought that as a matter of principle this was one of the mo3b important departures ever taken by their Government. (Cheers.) It meant that between the Government and its workers tho middleman would be abolished altogether. (Renewed cheers.) As to theh Labour Bureau, it was nob of so much importance here as to the workers in the South, because we had the gumfields here, but even in Auckland some little good had bee.i done by this institution since it started, for no less than 300 men had been sent out of town into the country. He had heard that these men had done well, and only on tho previous day ho had been informed that a party of five men sent out to do bush-falling had at the end of the term of their employment had £150 of wages between them, over and above what they had spent, and . that they had also other work bo go on with. Surely it was something that the bureau should be able to do that, and keep men from wandering about tho public streets crying out for work, even if it should be to break stones. (Cheers.) '

GOVERNMENT BY THE DEMOCRACY. It might be said that all this Labour legislation was what is called Socialism. He was not prepared to say that from one point c* view, ib was not. It was not condemnation of a measure to say that it was Socialism. (Cheers). What they had to look at were the merits of the measure: Was it good Socialism or bad? From one point of view he was a Socialistthat is to say, of a kind. He believed that the democracy were waking up nowadays to take a keener and larger and more direct share in the work of government than it had done in the past. It had been said that Government in this colony had been government) by the democracy ; but in his humble opinion, this colony, as a matter of fact, had been governed by the middle classes, on the sufferance of the democracy. The middle classes had ruled this country by dint of making skilful concessions, and giving skilful bribes of public money to the democracy. Government by the middle classes bad, he admitted, seen a great many reforms carried, and good work done ; still, many grave errors and blunders had been committed. The middle classes, according to their newspapers, were supposed to be able to govern on business principles, and the democracy were not; but after looking across to Victoria and New South Wales, and looking at the condition of those colonies just now, they would, he thought, admit that Government on business principles was likely to lead to very unfortunate results. (Laughter and applause.) He believed ib would be admitted that the democracy could nob make a more hideous mess of it than was to be witnessed in some of the Australian colonies to-day. THE STATE AND ITS FUNCTIONS. It was the duty of the democracy to be as careful in finance as they were in reform. In legislation let them be Radicals of the Radicals, but in finance let them be in the true and proper sense Conservative. (Hear, hear.) Let them remember the adage, " Pay your debts," and recollect that the first duty of a country is to pay its way. If they did that, there need not, he believed, be much alarm or much uneasiness felt about the Liberal party. Ho believed that government by the democracy—direct government, as we must have it, would mean a very large extension of the functions of the State. In that sense, and that sense alone, would be socialistic ; and in that sense, and that sense alone, he was socialistic. (Hear, hear.) Every fresh extension of those powers ought to be judged on its own merits. If ib was good, it would be no argument to use against it that it was a further extension of State interference. It might be said here, as it was said and written in other parts of the colony, that the State made a mess of everything ib touched, and that what had made these countries was private enterprise. As far as that was concerned, he believed that the vast amount of work done by the State in New Zealand was well done. They could not, ib was true, take up a newspaper without reading complaints against the Government and its officers ; but they must remember this., that everything done by the Government and its officers was done in the light of day, and exposed to a criticism which was not brought to bear on private business. If they knew every detail of every business firm in Auckland, did they not suppose that they would find that many blunders had been committed. Was it the State alone which made mistakes in business ? Had they never seen a limited liability company in trouble? (Laughter.) Had they never seen a commercial firm in the Bankruptcy Court? (Renewed laughter.) Had they not seen even great financial institutions in the various colonies in a state of temporary embarrassment ? Before they condemned the State, let them compare its blunders with those of private enterprise. (Cheers.) Let them look over the water, at Victoria and New South Wales ; amidst the crash of booms and bubble companies there, what was it which alone seemed secure and able to go steadily on its way ? The State. He maintained that as compared with private enterprise, the State was a stable and sound thing. STATE INTERFERENCE. He wondered whether those who were so ready to decry the State and its work, and to object to some new measureon the ground that it was State interference, ever tried to examine into the immense extent to which the State' regulated and interfered with every step of our lives ? He wondered whether they ever asked themselves what they should do without this State regulation and State interference. It made life tolerable and comfortable. Let him take the case of a man coming to New Zealand, to show them how every step of his way was regulated by the State : Such a man came to New Zealand in a steamer subsidised by the State ; when he neared these shores his way was marked by a State lighthouse, and he came up the harbour under the conduct of a State pilot ; he landed on a State wharf; he got into a cab regulated by State by - laws; he went to a hotel worked under State regulations of very stringent character—(laughter) — if he went out he walked on a State pavement; he lived in a town wh"sre life was rendered endurable by drainag- »nd sanitary regulations his letters were conveyed to him through a State post office, and important news came to him rapidly by a State telegraph : if he wished to obtain a supply of money, he went to a bank, which could not be established except under a State Bank Act and State chapter. If he settled in the country, he applied to the State, the largest landowner, to get land on cheap and easy terms; in going into the country, he travelled on a State railway, or on State roads and bridges, and in obtaining the transfer of land, he did so under a system adopted by the State ; ho found that the State, by Dairy Industry Acts, and measures of that kind, did its best to regulate every industry he, as a country settler, took a share in. If, however, he was a professional man— a doctor, he would nave to submit to certain State regulations and to hold a diploma ; if a lawyer, he would find that ho must pass an examination conducted by the State, and that certain State regulations—though he did nob say they were always effectual — had been passed to prevent him from over-charging his clients. (Laughter.) If he went into business, and went into a limited liability company, he would find that its every step, from the time it issued its prospectus until it was wound up—(laughter)—was subject to State supervision. If he married—as he ought to do, if he had a well-constituted mind— would find the State taking an interest in that, too— (laughter)and if, in course of time, he had to pay a visit to the Registrar of Births, he would find the State waiting for him there. If he were unfortunate enough to break the laws of his country, he would find a State policeman and State magistrate taking an interest in him—(laughter)and then, after all this, if he were ill-advised enough to die, he would be buried in a State cemetery. If he had had sufficient forethought, his wife and children would be provided for by a State insurance company ; and if he died intestate, hie affairs would be very cheaply and very well taken care of by the Public Trustee. THE STATE AND CHARITABLE RELIEF. The State, however, not only attended to the affairs of the ablebodied and vigorous working citizen. Since he had come to Auckland, it was his duty to inspect some of the public institutions here. He had visited the Hospital, the Lunatic Asylum, the Costley Home, the Institute for the Blind, and the Industrial School for the waifs and strays of society. Who was the angel of mercy which in these institutions cared for the poor and sick and injured, doing something to smooth the lot of the madman, to cheer the way of the afflicted, and to train up neglected children into good and useful citizens? Who but the much-abused State?—that State which certain flippant critics had represented to be only self-seeking politicians and meddlesome inspectors. That good and noble work was the most important of its duties, because in that they would see the power which the State had over the individual. The individual, when well and strong, could look out for himself, bub it took the collective power of the community to look after and protect the weak. (Cheers.) RAISING THE MASSES. If they wore going to raise the masses of the people, and to raise the scale of civilisation, ib was to the collective power of the community, the State, that they would have to look. Co-operation, organisation, unionism—call it what they would, it was nob a question of getting a shilling more in wages, or . regulating the number of apprentices or the hours of labour—these things were only the means to an end, and that end was to raise the masses of the 1

community and to improve their condition. (Cheers.) This the Liberal party were trying to do, and they were going to continue working for that end, no matter what) criticisms were brought to bear against) them. (Cheers.) The citizens of Auckland were no doubt sick and tired of having the praises of their city sung by strangers Theirs was a very highly-favoured country among nations. Looking back to history, and looking round about us, it was difficult to find a community which has so many natural advantages. The people of Auckland lived under a sky often called the sky of Italy ; they lived by seas and shores aa beautiful as those of Greece ; they enjoyed the freedom, the complete freedom, of Switzerland; they possessed the unsurpassed literature of England ; they lived under laws better and juster than the great laws of Rome. What might they not do in the future if they were resolved to do it! What would they not do if only they had that indomitable spirit of -improvement and progress which had made every generation of our race determined to leave that generation better than they found it! (Cheers.) What would they not do if they devoted themselves to the improvement of the condition of the masses, and educated and reared up that spirit of patriotism, and that spirit of love for the State, which would make New Zealand a truly civilised and therefore a truly great country. (Loud cheers.) QUESTIONS. Mr. H. R. Jury asked if the Minister had noticed that a report from the Industrial Committee proposed that the taxes on machinery should be remitted ? Mr. Reeves said the Government was nob responsible for the reports of the committee. This was only a suggestion from tlie committee, and it would be for the Government to decide during the recess. It was quite likely that they would endeavour next session to alter the tariff; he hopec they would. In doing so they would no alter it in favour of one industry and tothr rein of another. . The following written question was read by the Chairman "Is it true that Ministers were not in earnest in regard tt the Women's Franchise Bill ?" Mr. Reeves said that the Bill was passed by the only house in which the Government had a voice, but when it came back from the Council with its whimsical amendment they could not adopt it. The Government had a right to resent any attempt to tamper with the secrecy of the ballot, and that was what the amendment meant. Female franchise would now have been the law of the land had it not been for the action of the Legislative Council. (Applause.) The next question was, " Will the Government immediately use its best endeavours to throw open for settlement the blocks of land now owned by them in the King Country." Mr. Reeves said he would consult with his colleague the Native Minister, and inform him of the interest taken in the matter in Auckland. Mr. Neylojt asked if the Government ought not to be just before it was generous, and satisfy the claims of old soldiers before voting such sums as £3000 to the widow of Sir Harry Atkinson. Mr. Reeves said he quite agreed that the Government should be just before being generous. He did not say that they had satisfied all the claims of the old soldiers, but no previous Government had done so much as they in this direction. They had been trying to settle the claims, and would continue to try. THANKS AND CONFIDENCE. Mr. G. Peacccke moved, "That this meeting of Auckland citizens thanks the Hon. the Minister for Education and Labour for his able address, recognises his good services to the Liberal cause, and expresses its confidence in the general policy of the Ballance Government." He said he had very great pleasure in moving the resolution, and he was sure they would all agree with him that it was no mere form to describe the address as an able one. Mr. Reeves had opened by deprecating the position assigned to him as an orator, but he had given them a good sound business address in which there had been a good deal of eloquence, especially towards the latter end. (Applause.) There was no doubt about the nature of Mr. Reeves'services to the Liberal cause, and his career had always been ma Jked with an earnest desire for the welfare of the people. He (Mr. Peacocks) also desired to express confidence in the Ballance Government. (Applause.) He did so not because it was the Ballance Government but because it was a liberal Government. It was the most liberal Government the colony had had for many years, and the principle it had adopted was governing for the sake of men, and not for the sake of property. This was the principle they ought to bear in mind at the next genera! elections. Mr. W. Duncan seconded the motion. He thought Mr. Reeves' address would dc a great deal to dispel many of the false impressions that had been created by the newspapers with regard to some of the Labour Bills and their effect on the colony. On the motion being put, it was carried almost without dissent. Mr. Reeves said he thanked the meeting very much for their kindness, and hoped to have the honour some day of an-ain addressing an Auckland audience. (Applause.) Until that ti&e he would be able to carry with him a memory of one of the most patient, kindly, and courteous audiences he had aver had the pleasure of addressing. A vote of thanks to the Mayor closed the meeting.