PARLIAMENT.

New Zealand Herald, Volume XXVIII, Issue 8663, 4 September 1891, Page 6

PARLIAMENT.

[BY TELEGRAPH.—PRESS ASSOCIATION.] LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. Thursday The Council-met at half-past two p.m. FACTORIES BILL. The Factories Bill was read ' third time and passed. CUSTOMS DUTIES. Mr. Walker brought up tho report of the Select Committee on Customs Duties Excise Bill. The committee recommended that the Bill be allowed to proceed as printed. workmen's lien bill. The Colonial Secretary moved the second reading of the Workmen's Lien Bill, and explained its objects, adding that the late Government had introduced tho same Bill. Mr. Stevens desired to disabuso the minds of members of tho Council as to the statement that the late Government introduced a Bill similar to the present one. The late Government certainly did introduce a Bill, but it was one entitled the Building Lion Bill which it would be recollected, he said, was rejected in another place. The present Bill, he thought, required careful consideration on the ipart ot the Council, more especially on the part of tho legal members of [ the Council, before it was referred to the Labour Bills Committee. Mr. Stevens at some length reviewed the provisions of the Bill, remarking that the _ tendency of the measure was to do away with contracts, and compel persons building to employ day labour, and he felt convinced that the provisions of the Bill were such as would bo calculated to deter persons from building ; in fact, the restrictions should deter the Council from passing the Bill, which if passed would inllict real hardship both on employers and workmen. Mr. Stewart regretted the Bill had been brought down at such a late period of the session. The Bill was taken from the Canadian law, and its right title would have been Contractors' Bill. The measure differed materially from the Lien Bill brought down j by the late Government. When in America I sixteen years ago he had taken tho trouble to inquire into these lien bills, and therefore he was in a position to know of what he spoke. The chief feature of the Bill was that a person might easily find himself involved in a multiplicity of actions. He thought the Council should take care that the owner of property should not be harassed by unscrupulous sub-contractors. It appeared to htm absurd that an owner of land should be threatened with actions brought by workmen, notwithstanding that the landowner was not indebted to his contractor to the extent of a halfpenny. He was bound to say the Bill was not adapted to the requirements of the colony. He thought that powers should be given _to owners of land, who might be assailed with actions, to go at once into Court and obtain a settlement of the claims by workmen lodged against the contractors. The principle of the Bill had his support, but the measure would require a careful scrutiny on the part of the Labour Bills Committee. Mr. Pharazyn had no hesitation in saying that the object of the Government was to make owners of land abandon contracts, and undertake all building work by day labour. He moved that the Bill be read a second time that day six months. Dr. Pollen opposed the Bill, and expressed his astonishment that a Government which was affected with unionism such as tlie present was should have brought down a measure such as the present one. Already the Statute Book contained sufficient legislation to protect labour. This Bill, however, would injure workmen more than it possibly could employers, and the passing of it would be for workmen to cut their own throats, because it could not be expected that if it passed land owners would enter upon new work. Sir George Whitmore expressed a hope that tho Council would not shirk its work, as it would do if the amendment were agreed to. He confessed he did not like the Bill, but lie thought if it were referred to the committee its objectionable provisions might be eliminated. Mr. Bowks thought the Bill, which was, he admitted, a difficult one to deal with, should be referred to the Select Committee. The Bill, i" his opinion was not a Workmen's Lien Bill, but one calculated to improve the small contractor, than whom no more useful citizen existed, off the face of the earth. However, he hoped the Bill would be sent to the committee. Mr. Fulton, although not considering the Bill a perfect one, would like to see it referred to the Select Committee in order that any possible wrong to workmen might by its provisions be remedied. The Colonial Secretary having replied the original question for the second reading was agreed to by '24 to ii: and the Bill was referred to the Labour Bills Committee.

The following is the division list: — Ayes : Acland, Baillic, Barnicoat, Bowen, Buckley, Dignan, Fulton, Hart, Holmes, Johnston, Mantell, Martin, Millar, Peacock, Reynolds, Shrimski, Stewart, Swanson, Taiaroa, Walker, Wahanui, Whitniore, White. Wilson. Noes: Grace, Pharazyn, Pollen, Stevens, Williams. SHOP HOURS KILT.. Mr. Walker resumed the debate upon the question that the Shop Hours Bill be read a second time, to which an amendment had been moved by Mr. Shrimski that the Bill be read a second time that day six months. Mr. Walker remarked that lie did not admire the Bill, and he hoped it would be amended in committee, although lie could not" support it. He said this because he thought it due to the Colonial Secretary, who was ever courteous to the Council. Mr. Bo wen - intended to vote for the amendment. He intended to take this course as the Select Committee had reported adversely to the principles of the Bill. The liberties of the people had been entrusted to the Council, and he hoped the Chamber would continue to guard the liberties of the people. He regarded the Bill as being an unjustifiable interference with the rights of certain people who were endeavouring to gain their livelihood. Speaking to the exemption clause, lie remarked that he failed to see its justice. The Bill, more than any other Bill he knew of, showed a want of consideration. It was an unwarrantable interference by the Legislature, which would tend to degrade people, and rob them of that spirit ot indeEendence which had ever been the proud oast of Englishmen. Mr. Fulton* objected to the exemption clause ; as presenting an almost insuperable objection to the working of the Bill. lie regretted to say public opinion was drifting in the direction of giving persons everything they asked for, to the detriment of many deserving persons. He objected to the statement, nowever, made by Mr. Shrimski, that the object of the Bill was to crush small shopkeepers. This statement, he thought, was wron?, as he believed the object had been to give those who at present did not possess the advantages of short hours the benefit of it. But there were others, commercial, bank, and Government clerks who should participate in the privilege of working shefrt hours. He felt acutely for this hardworking class of the community, and should like to see them relieved. For the reasons he had stated he should vote against the Bill going into committee. The Colonial Secretary replied. The motion for the committal was rejected by 21 to 8. The Bill was thus killed. The following is the division list Atf.S : 8. Acland Hart Baillie . Stewart Barnicoat Whitmore Buckley Wilson Noes : 21. Bowen Pharazyn Dignan Pollen Fulton Reynolds Grace .Shrimski Holmes Stevens ■ Johnston Swanson Mantell Taiaroa . Martin Wahawaha Millar White Ormond Williams Peacock SELECTORS LANDS REVALUATION. The Selectors Lands Revaluation Bill was further considered in committee. Clause 2: "Interpretation." The clause was verbally amended. Mr. Fulton thought the title of the Bill should now be Selectors Fair Rent Bill. Mr. Millar from his own knowledge said that pastoral tenants had been pushed to the wall, in fact they were being ruined wholesale. Conspiracies had been set afloat with the avowed intention of ruining these pastoral tenants. Could it be ascertained, it would be found that, inOtasroatanyrate, pastoral tenants had never obtained 5 per cent, on their capital. Instead of being successful these hard-Working men had lost their all. Mr. Shrimski pointed out that the Crown tenants, notwithstanding their losses, had applied for renewals of licenses. The clause as amended was agreed to. : _ A verbal amendment was agreed to in clause 3. Several unimportant amendments having been agreed to, the Bill was reported with amendments, and the third reading I was fixed for the following day. The Council at five o'clock adjourned to the following day.

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. Thursday. The House met at half-past two p.m. JUDGE EDWARDS. Captain Russell presented a petition from Judge Edwards praying the House to take his case into consideration.

TUB AUCTIONEERS BILL. Mr. Seddon brought up the report of the managers of the conference on the Auctioneers Bill. The report was to the effect that the conference had agreed that auctioneers'fees should be paid to the local body of the place where the auctioneers have their usual place of business. The conference had ' also agreed that account sales should be rendered in fourteen days after the sale instead of seven. He moved that the repprt be agreed to, but the debate was adjourned. LOCAL BILLS. A number of local Bills were put through their final stages. The House rose at -past five p.m. The House resumed at half-past seven. FEMALE SUFFRAGE. The Femalo Suffrage Bill was considered in committee. ' , , Clause 2, Electoral Franchise conferred upon women. Mr. Ballance wished to say this was not i Government measure, and it was no part of the Government policy. The Government were, in fact, not agreed on the principles of the Bill and Ministers would vote in different lobbies on the question. Speaking for himself he was in favour of women suffrage and of this Bill. As to the date when ' the measure should come into operation, Sir John Hall wished it should come into force in 1893, but he (Mr. Ballance) was in favour of postponing its coming into operation _ till 1891. He held that if the Bill were given effect to at once, there would _ be ail immediate demand for a dissolution :iu order to enable the new constituencies) to be formed. He himself did not think ib should be followed by a dissolution, but that course whs urged even by members of the House. He intended to put the Bill on the Statute Book this session, but thought they should postpone its operation till after the next general election, as it was very desirable that the country should have >an opportunity of expressing on opinion on it. He did not think the country would reverse the decision of the House. If the country desided against the Bill it could be repealed, but if not it would remain as the law of the land. After further discussion, Claaso 2 was passed on the voices. Air. Blakk then moved that the Act should not come into operation until 31st March, ISSM. „ Mr. 0 "Conor was in favour of tho Bill coming into force at the next election, and thought that next Parliament should bo elected under it. Mr. Fish said if the people of the colony desired this monstrous change he was quite willing they should have it, but it was only right the country should have a voice on such an important question. Mr. Rolleston did not approve of the Bill, but he wished most distinctly to disassociate himself from the course the Government were now taking, ami he would vote against Mr. Blake's proviso. It was utterly wrong to put a measure on tho statute book giving the franchise to women, and yet postpone its operation for five years. The whole position now was very despicable, and lie hoped the House would pass the Bill and reject the amendment. Sir John Hall expressed his great disappointment at the lino of conduct now pursued by the Premier. The House by a large majority had affirmed the principle of female suffrage, and there was therefore no reason why the operation of the Bill should be postponed till 1894. His proposal to bring the Act into operation in 1893 was, he thought, a fair and reasonable one, and he hoped the committee would agree to it. Mr. Rees condemned the proceedings that had taken place over this Bill on the previous occasion. Mr. Fish had stonewalled the measure, and threatened the Government with desertion, but now it was publicly stated that he had gone back to the Ministerial party in consequence of the Government having agreed to postpone the coming into operation of the Act till 1894. Sir George Grey said the Premier had undertaken to carry this measure through Parliament, and yet he now proposed to pass a resolution that would kill it. Mr. Ballancf. contended he had fully redeemed his pledge in affording facilities for briuging up the Bill that night, and he feared Sir John Hall was using this question as a political stalking horse. _ Sir John Hall absolutely denied that he had used this question as a political stalking horse. He had moved in this matter as far back as 1579, and he nearly carried the principle of female suffrage. After considerable discussion, Mr. Blake's amendment to extend the time till 1894 was lost by 27 to 22. The' following is the division list :— Ayes— Ballance Mackenzie, T. Blake McKeuzie.J. Cadman Parata Carncross Reeves, R. 11. J. Carroll Reeves, W. P. Dawson Smith, W. C. Duncan Swan Fish Taipua Fisher Taylor Fraser Valentine Hogg Ward Noes— Buchanan Mills, C. 11. Buckland Mills, J. Buick Newman Karnshaw O'Couor Grey Pinkerton Hall Rees Harkness Richardson Houston Rolleston Hutchison, W. Saunders Kelly, .1. Shera Kelly, W. Tanner McDonald Thomson, J. W. Mackintosh Wright Meredith Pairs. for. against. Mackenzie, M. J. S. Joyce Rhodes Russell Hamlin Smith, K. M. Thompson, T. Mitchelson Guinness Hutchison, G. La wry McGuire Valentine Wilson Seddon Thompson, R. Sir George Grey moved -that the Bill come into operation in 1892. Lost on the voices. Sir John Hall moved that the Bill should come into operation on the Ist June, 1893. Agreed to. Mr. Pratt asked Sir J. Hall whether Maori women would be allowed to vote under the Bill. Sir Jno. Hall said the Bill made no distinction, and it would allow Maori women to vote as well as Europeans. Mr. Carncross moved a new clause enabling any female elector to be elected a representative for the House of Representatives. After a lengthy discussion it was carried by 30 to 24. "The Bill was then reported with amendments. On the motion for the third reading, Mr. Fish said the Bill had not been carried on its merits, and there was not a real majority of the House in favour of it. Mr. Carncross said he had proposed his amendment in order to make the Bill distasteful to the country. The third reading was then agreed to, and the Bill passed. The House rose at a quarter-past one a.m.