FIRE INSURANCE.

Hawke's Bay Herald, Volume XXX, Issue 10058, 27 July 1895, Page 3

FIRE INSURANCE.

A largely attended meeting of fire Insurers, coDvened by Mr J. M'Vay, was beld io tbe Borough Council Chambers last nlghb to consider tbe formation of a Fire Insurers Protective Assoeiition. HU Worship the Mayor wan voted to the chair, and after explaining the reason of the meeting, eaid ho was very glad to see so many present. To-night they had met on a question of paramount Importance, one thai; bad been mooted for a long time past, and offected both large and small property ownerß. They had met to inquire if in the past they hnd been fairly dealt with, and in the face of the expense they bad been to ia providing a water supply of the kind which the town now pnssesaed. He considered that the Fire Insurance Association had not been wonderously kind in their treatment of their supported, and the thnnki of the community were dne to Mr M'Vay and others who had brought this matter prominently forward. He was not going into argument, but would leave that to the convenor of the meeting. Mr M'Vay eald be hoped be would he able to put a few facts before them to show he was warranted in asking them to come there. He would q note comparisons to show the rates rnling here and In other parts of the colony and in England also, j He first explained the causes which had led Wm to convene this meeting. They had all groaned under the fire insurances they had baen paying for yeara. (Cheers.) They had also gone on grumbling and paying for years. They had had a compact body to deal with in the associated companies, with whom fixed tariffs at exceaolvo prices bad generally prevailed. Occasionally concessions had been made, which like kißßine had gone by iavor— ono insurer having got n concession which another could not. He did not intend to take a lead in the matter, but would ask the Insurers to do what they thought best. tie had arranged all his own insurances so as to fall in on one day iv the year. He had intended asking for a redaction because the character of bis risk had altered, brick buildings adjoining bis premises having taken tbe place of wood. Bat wbea a few weeks ago ha wrote to the companies asking them for a redaction in rates, pointing out the great advantages which existed In the direction of fire extinguishing apparatus, be hnd met with no success, Io wbb tine that three weeks after he got a letter from the companies — not hU idea of a business letter, but apparently good enough for the companie-i. The letter conveyed thn Information " That on and after the 25th July all insurances taken or renewed shall bs subject to present tariff rates, but that In the event of any subspqnnnb reductions bslng ma<iM in tbe tailff as to the outcome <if tho Melbourne conforeno<> all ri-ks taken or renewed after t^o 20:h July shall obtain the benefit of such reduction, aud that in the event of a revision of rates being affected by the conference, then the association will at once consider the question of revising the taiill" with a view to reduction where necessary." This letter was ambiguous and Indtliuite, and did not satisfy him. He saw some of tho ' agents and asked what it meant, but still got no satisfactory explanation, although be had to get a dictionary to rliow hoiuo of them what tho word "consider" meant. At the lime he made this app'leatioD one rink near him had teen reduced by 5a per cent, although It bad not altered la any way, and as he could not see why he should not have been similarly treatod, he convened this meeting. It was a matter of public notoriety that the association's tariff hnd not been maintained, If those present had done years ago what he hoped they would do that niuht— (applanne)— combined, they would have been much better oil to day. The speaker then went on to refer to tho money which had been expended ou firo tx'inguisbiDff appJiaDces, aud to tbe association withdrawing its snbaidy to the brigades. He hnd written j to a friend ia Wellington asking dim to ! put him io communication with thu Wei lington association. lie übo wired t' Aockland and pot a letter from Mr Taylor, secretary of the Auckland Kirc (naurore, enclosing rules find s'c&lu of 1 subscriptions of the Cuutorbuty ausocla-

I tion, whioh with some triflioc alteratlonn I had been adopted In Auckland. Tt« letter stated that there was really no tariff In Auckland, anything like « firstclass risk being taken as low as 5a for afcoek and buildings. The companies were acting independently, nud bad been since 1893, and no risk was now declined it the premium offered was anything loiaonable. That wag In striking contrast to what they paid. Here the lowest price for any business premises waß 17s 6d. The speaker also read newspaper extracts, reports of meetings held In Anckland, also a letter from a resident of Auckland saying tbnt rates there varied, but were very low ; fi sb-class warehouse 4s 6d to ss, Queen /street shops Ss, brick hotels 6s, private houses la oattkirta and suburbs &i upwards, wooden blocks 12s 6d. There was n'ways a great amount oi secrecy obseive I by tho companies flnenfc the tariff. He did nob ace why this shon'd bo if everything was abovebpard. Kccent'y a fileud of his had nslted for some information for a friend in New Plymonth, and local agents had refused to give it. Kecently the Council had also wanted information, and a reply had been obtained from the Town Clerk of Chrlstohuich that the secretary there had refused to supply Iti. He knew of one reduction which had been brought) about by side influence, and ho did not) think this kind of thing was right. The present tariff was, In his opinion, nbou ll 50 per cent too high. He would quote a few rates : — Auokland : Brick or stone warehonse, 4s ■fid to 53 i Quee^street, Bhops ss, brick hotels 6s ; dwellings, brick, 4s upwards j , wooden blocks 12 6J. Dnnediu : Brick dwellings ng low as 3s, hotels in town from 69, offices 7s, wholesale houses 7s. : England (compiled from Whittaker's ' Almanack) : Common insurance la 6d to 2a, hazardons Insurance 2s Oil to 3s 6d, donbly bnzirdoua 4i 6i to sj, special insurance 53 acd upwards. A note with reference to the EngHeh quotations was as follows :— " Much depends upon the building Insured ; for a printer's or bookbinder's workshop in a narrow lane with with old wooden huitdlt>g3 new It tbe premium would possibly be 10s to 15a per cent. The insurance companies were never tired of refening to the money they lost and the amall profit they made. Still they were always anxious for a new risk, Yet the most recenD returns of 64 British fire offices "bowed funds, exclaslve of capital, £33,443,514, and pold up cpital £8,831,672 ; and tbe Norwich Union office was advertising paid up capital £132,000, exclusive of the accumulated profits in reserve, £817,000. He would just like to mention os showing the disparity of premiums in Napier and else where, that he knew that In Auckland the Sonth Biti;h Company hai token a risk on a collegiate establishment of £4000, and the premium waa 9d per cent, and another agent h.d tild him thftt his conpany held a risk on s university at Dunedin ntj la 9d pet cent. Borne of the townspeople thought the promoters of tbe present movement nuditated starting a rival insurance company, but his idea was to co.operate and form an a a ?ocimtiou to look nfter their interests and force coin panic < to meet them at reasonable rates. He explained thai in Canterbury nnd Wellington txeessive rates prevailed, while In Dunedln and Auckland such wia not the cise. He read the scale of subscriptions wbich tho Wellirgton Insurers' Protection Association had adopted, viz. : £500 and under, 2* 6i per annum ; £501 to £1000, si ; £1001 to £1500, 7s Gel ; £1501 to £5000, 21s ; £5001 In £10,000, 425 ; over £10,000, 63. Mr M'Vnv concluded his speech by quoting the objects 0/ the Wellington association. Mr Neal said they owed a debt of gratitnde to Mr M'Vay. He concurred with him that they did not waub to f'lght the insurance companies, but to form an association to look after their own Interests. He would move, " That on association be formed to fre called a Fire Insnrers 1 Protection Association." Mr Satton seconded the motion, r.nd • said the companies nmsb have made a amall fortune In Napier of lute year?, tbe i losses by fuo havlug been very small i Indeed. They were paying heie four | tlmei the pnmiunia puid in fonie other places. They would lie quite justified in appealing to some big English company to cpmo and take over the whole of their bneineeß, Mr M'Vay exp'ained that the risk was greater in thickly populated places such as London, where fires often burned for' weeks, and yet theie the premiums weie lower than In a scattered town like Napier. Mr Conroy said he had seen 40 fire engines at work at one time In St, Mary's Axe, England. Mr Tj erman said tho people of His Hdrb also groaned nnder the loud of fire insurance, and he a^ked if there was any reaeon why the Napier people should noli co-operate with the resiients of Hastings, who were paying os much 57 per cent, 60 per cent, nud 70 ptr ceut) for buildings in blocks, notwithstanding their water supply nnd extinguishing apparatus were aniotg !ho bM io the colony, At Waipukuruu rs mucli 70 per cent w«9 charged for detached buildings. Mr Ned thought the towns would do better separately, rb their interc:ta wero divergent. Mr A. C. Bennett siH If Mr M'Vay thought reductions wonld bo made aa low aB he quoted as ruling in Dunedln and Auckland ho was mistaken. He con. tended the rates qootpd aB rullug there were ridiculously low. Ue quoted a few figures to bliow that insurance in Napier was not such a gcd thing as some people i seemed to think it was. Ho denied thiti information on ioaurauc; nulfc-rs wns not) available to the public. Mr Large said it was evident that Mr Bennett belonged to an insurunce company. I Mr Bennett) explained bunt be was In no way connected with any such institution. Mr Conroy said that iimwauco rutei came like n rent on insurers. Mr M'Vay said he paid £114 a year on his preuiuoH aud stock-in-trade, | The motion was then put aud carried unanimously. Mr Dinwiddie then moved that rt provisional committee of nluo ho appointed j to draw up rules and cuuvbbb the town, rtcd report to a meeting to be held on Fiiday next, 2ad August. Ho bad been taking an iuterestin this matter for some time. Io Auckland brick buildings coat 6a ter c-fnt. b\r hln premises he was at present paying 17a 6'l. In Australia j the ratea wore even lo.ver thuu in Eng- \ lacd. Mr liirgo secouded the resolution, which w«9 carried. Tho Mayor piopnsed that) the provisional committee bo composed as fol« ' lows : — Messrs G. H. Swan, J. Cloao, W. K. Blvtbe, H. Williams, P. Dinwiddie, J. M'Vay, J. Hlggins, J. S. Lirge, J. G. Gllberd, and F. Suttou,— Cariied Mr Cox proposed that the uames of those willing to join a protective association be at once taken down. — C»nied. Mr M'Vay aaid they had discussed tho question of co-operating with llasiicfn and had come to tbe conclusion that they wonld be more successful if they acted separately at the inception, and joined na a Hawke's Bay Association with Hastings, Daneviike, Walpawa, and other pladea afterwnrds. He hoped ultimately to see that the whole of tho towns in the colony wonH co-operate to protect) themselves, and if necessary make overtures to English companies. Mr Large said ho would submit the followiug resolution before tbia representative meeting for tho purpoie of testing bbc feellnc of those present on tho subjecb :— " That the Borough Council be asked to formulate n acheuie of insurance for tho town of Napier, such iusuranca to be conducted by the Borough Couucll itself, and thab a bill be drawn up for submission to Parliament by the local representatives, enabling this to bo carried ont." The Mayor seconded pro forma. He said he had been deputed by biie Borough Council to nttenrl a meeting of the executive of the Municipal Association in Wellington recently, and ono of the chief matters discussed waa the subject contained in this reaolntion. It was then reaolfed to send to Canada and other places for information on the subject. At the nextmeebingof the Municipal Association tbe whole matter wonld be gone into. He thought it would bo dangerous to attempt municipal insurance iv ipoluted instances, but believed in the principle if applied in a general way. To be efi'ectus'.l any movement of tliin kind must Ij3 backed up by Act of IVrliwurnr. The qneation was well worth tin; oarueat consideration of tho™ interested, Mr Blythe pointed out that there wna at presunb a Mil beforo tho House ileftHng with the question. He nymp'itliised with Mr Large's motion, but miggested thnt the provisional eonmiiUeo should obtain n copy of the bill and embody recomI mendatloiiH iv reference to when reporting on the whole mibler. The Mayor explained that the bill | before Ihu Houeu waß simply to retaliate the pnyuietitK btbwecu liru brigades and llm JJoroD^li Councils and Insurance ''■ ollice?. i MrSut'on thouglit tluvt isolated cases of municipal insurnucu would not be successful. Hi; thought H would bo he-lljcr to defer tho resolution tilt pooplo hud tlmo to tlilnk it over. Mr Large snid thai n rUHnliitlim of tliis kind would hliow that n fcelltig in bympatliy with inuiiiclp-i! iiistirnucj w«s prevaleufc. Mr Neal thought that it wnu'd be bctiter to withdraw tl>c veto'.ution until more liiforinatlnii lnnl lieesi obl'iined. Tliß reHolution wus cinied, though tl\or« were v nnmlier of di-.'.oiitiei.ln. A vote of tbank:; to tlu> Major nnd Mr M'V.iy wan curried, uml tlie incutln^ „<(j mnipd.