TIE BUDGET DEBATE.

Dominion, Volume 4, Issue 1233, 15 September 1911, Page 6

TIE BUDGET DEBATE.

OPINIONS FOR AND AGAINST,

"A VOTE-CATCHING SCHEME/

The debato on the Budget was continned in tho House of Representatives yesterday. Mr. B. Dive (Egmont), tho first speaker, began by. referring to one or two matters outside of tho Budget. Tho first was a remark mndo by tho Hon. R. Jf'Kenzio on tho occasion of a recent visit to Tarunaki, when, speaking about grants for publio works, he had said something to tho.effect that people need not expect much while they returned Opposition members. ■ Mr. M'Kenzie made an inaudible interjection. Mr. Dive said that ho was prepared to bring evidence in support of tho truth of his statement, and to call as witnesses several members of tho Government sido of the House. Tho year had been a year of promises, and the Budget was patently a vote-catching scheme. Now tho Government did not quite know how they stood with their supporters, and this was an attompt to induce them to Tally round again. Ho criticised also ■n'hat he described as the taihoa policy of dealing with Nativo lands, and the administration by tho Agricultural Department of experiment farms. THE POLITICIAN'S METHODS, "GIVING THE SHOW AWAY." Mr. J. C. Thomson (Wallace) told Mr. Dive and his colleagues to be patient and to wait for a little while, when no doubt tho promises which had been mado to the people would fructify. On the question of the cost of living ho argued that tho Government was wrongly blamed for tho increased cost of living. The Government had taken tho duty off a number of necessaries of life, but tho consumer was sometimes prevented by' the action of monopolists from benefiting by the remission of the duty. As a matter of fact, tho man who had only .£3OO per. year paid not a penny in direct taxation of. any kind. If this man indulged in a little tobacco and his wife in a httlo jowcllery, ho would pay say .£lO per year through tho but if lie had five children the State would pay more than JC2O to educate them. He did not consider the naming of tho Budget a "vote-catching/ Budget" was altogether justified. Of course, it would catch votes, and was in a measure meant to do so. Was not every politician a vote-catcher? Did they not spread their political wares in such a way. as to meat with tho approval of their constituents? And did they not occasionally practise a little humbug, and at other times did they not approach on the verge- of mendacity? Did they not deal in half-truths?, : Of course they did—and they got their votes. Mr. Eisner:',"You arc giving tho whole show away." ,

Mr. Thomson: "I speak of what is in Jny mind.". Ono of the half-trnths which ho accused the Opposition of dealing in was their complaint about the amount of tho debt. They stated the amount of the debt correctly, but they omitted to toll their people that it was secured by intnrest-bearing assets. The only deadweight debt in New Zealand was in fact soma' twenty-five millions. Ho supported the Government in their refusal to purchase land while the present high prices ruled.

Mr. Buchanan: Who says the prices aro high? Are you a judge of land values? Mr. Thomson thought that whether the price was .£2O or ,£lO per acre, Mr. Buchanan would 'still say tho Government should purchase. A member: And then criticise them for doing it. Mr. Thomson thought the Government • aliould reduce the duty on certain of the cheaper grades of tobacco used by workins men. , ■ Mr. Poland: And doublo tho duty on beer. The crying need of tho times, said Mr. Thomson, was for politics to be raised to a higher plane. This would do away with this mimic war of parties, which was eometimes only noise and nonsense by which politicians tried to delude the people. MR. E. NEWMAN'S VIEWS. LAND PURCHASES. Mr. E. Newman (Manawatu) said he considered the Budget one of tho best for electioneering purposes that ho had seen. It contained bribes for votes for practically every section of the oommunity. Instancing the promised increases of salary to railway servants, ho had no doubt that, the men deserved the increases well enough, but ho did not think tho Government had acted rightly in withholding the increases until the cvo of an election. He discussed the Government's action in establishing sinking funds for tho extinction of tho debt. In a gencTal way he approved of sinking funds, but not while tho country was already pursuing a borrowing policy. All; financial experts were agreed in this. He urged that tho Government need not delay in tho pnrchaso of flat lands where they were available for purchase on the pound that tho prico was too high, for it'was fairly safe to_ assume that the price, of flat land in New,-Zealand would not.fall. The area of flat land in the country was too small to permit of this. He did not think that any estates had teen acquired hy the State at prices so high as to involve rente that were oppressive to settlers. The settlement, of Native lands was not being pushed ahead as vigorously, as it should, be. Tho proposals in regard to family land settlement amd financial assistance to farmers had his very hearty approval. Speaking of tho proposed State note issue, Mr. Newman said one could not but regret tho position of the member for Masterton, Mr. Hogg. In support of this, conclusion ho read the Hansard 'speeches of tho Primo Minister and Mr. Hogg at tho time when the latter was called upon to resign from tho Ministry for advocating the issue of notes by the State. There was a great deal more distress in New Zealand than most people thought. It appeared that both in Christchiirch and in Wellington there wore a good many men out of work. It was of no' uso to live in a fool's paradise. Many of the Budget proposals had his sympathy, and ho fully approved all efforts to relievo distress and to assist widows and the aged.' Ho hoped tho optimism of tho Prime Ministor would bo justified. MR. SIDEY OPTIMISTIC. CHEAP MONEY AND DEAR LAND. Mr. X. K. Sidey (Dunedin South) admitted that the only remedy this country had at the present time* for unemployment was borrowed money. No other conclusion was possible than that the country was enjoying a period of remarkablo prosperity. Practically all the' main Bouroes of revenue showed a substantial increase. Exports had also 'been largely augmented, and there had been an increase in imports which possibly called for consideration. The Advances to Settlers Act and tho Advances to Workers Act, both good measures, had helped to increase the price of land. " Mr. Fisher: The cheap money has made dear land. Mr. Sidey said that, on the other hand, it would be unfair to deny that the Government had done a great deal to reduce the cost of living. Referring to the proposal to encourage the development of the oil industry, Mr. Sidey mentioned a possibility that, if tho enterprise pToved successful, a big trust outside might make such a tempting olfer that tho owners would be bourn! to accept. The Priine_ Minister: In that enso wo will nationalise it. Mr. Fisher:. Yes, after the trust has cot it. The Prime Minister: Oh, you are against it. Mr. Fisher: No, I am not. Mr. Sidey foreshadowed a possible extension of State competition in order to curb monopolies. SCIENTIFIC METHODS. IRRIGATION AND AFFORESTATION. Mr. G. M. Thomson (Dunedin North) said there was a good deal in tho Budget of which ho approved. He stressed the necessity for pushing on with tho work of irrigating and planting arid areas in Central Otago and other parts of the Dominion. He would liko to see a projerlj

trained scientific export appointed to direct afforestation operations. Our forests were steadily disappearing and it' would pay the country handsomely to appoint an expert. As showing the necessity for this coiirso Mr. Thomson mentioned that the State Forestry Department had put down in its nurseries five million eucalypti trees of a species which was condemned as useless for timber purposes, by the Government botanist of Now South Wales and other Australian experts of high standing. If a skilled botanist had been in charge" of tho Slate Forestry Department this mistake would not have been made. Mr. Thomson also urged that scientilic methods should bo followed in the development of mining enterprise. In tho journal of the Department of Agriculture details of experiments- wero not given as fully as they ought to be. Someone, presumably tho .Minister for Public Works, had jumped his claim in the most bare-faced manner by inserting in the Budget ft proposal anent tho production of chemical manures by tho agency of eloctrical energy. If tho Minister expected to produce chemical manures with fag-ends of electrical energy he would bo disappointed. Five thousand horse-power at least would bo required for the purpose. Theso chemical manures would bo of no use in new lands and there would bo no great demand for them in New Zealand or Australia for some time, but there would bo a demand in the future. Mr. Russell: What ingredients would bo required? Mr. Thomson: "Nothing." 110 explained that tho atmosphere, with steam passing between the points of an enormous olectrical machine produced nitrates. A first essential to tho development of tho iron-sand'industry would bo electric magnetic separators. Even when tho ironsand had • been obtained no means had yet been dovised of working it. On reading tho Prime Minister's statement that ho hoped to see 10,000 men employed after somo years in a great iron-industry, ho felt inclined to say: "Blessed is ho that expects little." If the alternative proposal to nationalise the industry wero carried out, he would guarantee that the country would run into a great waste of money. Referring to the largo increase in the education voto Mr. Thomson contended that tho Education Department could bo a little more-economically conducted at headquarters. ' There was too much clerical work. Mr. V. H. Reed (Bay of Islands) complained that the Leader of tho Opposition had not delivered any counter-blast to the Budget proposals. He touched upon tho dairy regulations of three years ago, and referred to what he described as the "bogoys" raised by tho Opposition. He denied that the Government had stolen any Opposition planks. MR. OKEY ON REGULATIONS. PENSIONS FOR MAORI WAR VETERANS. Mr. H. J. H.Okey (Taranaki) remarked that only one occupant of tho Government front benches had as yet spoken on the Statement. The dairy regulations seemed'to play the part'of a red flag to a bull in tho case of the Government. Ho suggested that the dairy regulations might, be allowed to rest, and some attention be paid to tho tramway regulations. Tho Opposition had been just as ready as the Govornment to establish old age pensions, the only difference being that tho Opposition desired to establish universal pensions. Mr. Okey suggested that, in view of the very largely-in-creased cost of administration, a Commission might very well be set up to go into the affairs of the Dominion. He urged the Primo Minister to provide a sum of fivo or six thousand pounds to provide pensions for Maori war veterans. Mr. Glover: I believo it can bo done, Mr. Okey.

Mr. Okey continued tl\at the State note proposal, in its application, would be more expensive than, useful. Unless it were mado good by loss or destruction of notes in circulation, there would be a loss of about .£BOOO a year. He promised to heartily support the proposed encouragement of the oil industry in Taranaki. Mr. Okey next proceeded to say something about the Opposition policy. A Government member groaned, and the member for Taranaki advised him to cross the House. His woes would then bo lightened. _ Mi;., .Okey said the greatest sin of'tne Government was wasteful administration. If settlers under the Land for Settlement Act wero permitted to acquire their holdings, and tho money applied to the purchass of further land the need for borrowing would disappear. The member for Taranaki concluded by advising members to read and thoroughly, digest the Opposition platform. The debate was adjourned on the motion of Mr. Arnold, and the Houso roso at 11.55 p.m.