THOSE GUNS.

Press, Volume LXIV, Issue 19258, 13 March 1928, Page 9

THOSE GUNS.

\ pBO TEST AGAINST " REMOVAL. A LIVELY MEETING.

1 carried at the last * -„f the Christchurch City Counmotion of Cr. J. V. Roberts, Ale'«» trophies in the City should moved was followed by protests W "the presidents of the Christchurch the Beturned Soldiers' Assovlj,*iid the Navy League, which culTtad in » MaTwhich was held in Jellicoe Hall including several women, and r 1 Mot's from both parties in the Kunril were present. More than PLwiker was at times drowned in the If *s< protest that followed his re*"a, and one was silenced at the end StS* meeting by the singing of the wttenal Anthem. %. following resolution, moved by jlrH. D. Acland, was carried by a big Majority: *• "That this public meeting of jjjrijtchurch citizens . emphatically JXests against the action of the City Council in moving the war trophies from the City." ' Jii B.\A. Cuthbert, president of the presided, and with him ttitUelßTS H. D. Acland, J. J. Dougall, jjd&'tf. Lloyd, Dr. J. Guthrie, and the Li H. Norris. "An old fable of La Fontaine tells of iwelei animal—wicked because when Uttetced it defended itself," said Mr Mhoert. "The Returned Soldiers' AsLattoh has held this meeting because joini things it holds dear have been atjUekedi 'The majority of the City Counpora are not content to let Bleeping sjnriie, and the challenge has to be bkes up by our Association. There are Ere points to make clear. The E.S.A. is Jii bo way a political organisation. A ijjlt number of the members voted for L'Labbirf Party, and all we ask for is and square deal from the Labour P'trilita we would from any other felly. (Hear, hear.) The 8.5.A., as in organisation, does not stand for pgoiim 'or the perpetuation of national MsiiSsliies. Hundreds of our men are ji'Bympithy with the people who are jMilring-to bring about a peaceful state if", tio World, but the U.S.A. of ChristMBctyand the members of our club are pondOf those guns." (Loud applause.) Sfiiely/ said Mr Cuthbert, there was about them. A bravo IWiny f6|ght and died in their defence, juoVtlieii own kith and kin fought and :&d in taking them. The public was TM&Jnd thei "returned soldiers in their seqOett that the decision be again con♦jdtied and reversed.

Ls^.Absurd Suggestion. 'f.lpett those guns were placed in the the consent, and at the iwfiMtof/95'per cent, of the populaAcland. "There has been io nuvndate by the City Council to remove;theap.v They are a memento of the men who fought . for ns, andithO'inen to whom we owe oui thanks fotbeing.able' to stand here ito-tlay; The Suggestion that the guns cause a warlike spiitifcis absurd. New Zealand, owing to its'/size and distance, can never be 8 warlike- country. 'We 1 must always, of necessity, fight on the I defensive. Wu is 'horrible, but howI «rer much we diglike it, our civilisation ■ ud -toe 'Government of the country rata mainly on force. . . . When the notion was before the City Council the Mayor expressed public opinion much ittjer/ithan most of the other councilAcland moved "'the resolu<io|"m set out above. Blood of Valorous Men. * 1 ijT&o Boer War was the only one in wM r the British people were engaged »wh was not a war of defence. Every like we went to war we were unprejired, and sacrificed lives unnecessarily, |4d,spent huge sums of money that not to have been spent," said Mr *J. J. Dougall, president of the Navy 'league. "People say that children lDOßld.know nothing about guns, but tke'nation that is not prepared to deTenS its possessions will soon go west! ' tAnathetic as our people are in peace i .tnj,, negligent as they are as to the folate, there are no people on earth )v in war time, can stand against i itttm. I sincerely trust the City Couni 'titt'will reconsider its decision. Those guns are covered, metaphorically, with -■the blood of valorous men. Are we, »t a gesture, to say, 'Pass them out, t they are no good at all'l No! I have Bieh pleasure in seconding the motion." . AVthis stage the chairman noticed ■Councillors J. W. Beanland, E. H. Aniflrews, and others in the hall, and ■asked them to be seated at the platform. Cr. J. W. Roberts (who was 'ito mover of the resolution at the 'Coiinjiu meeting) and the Councillors Stationed mounted the platform, and W s their seats with the chairman ami&t applause. - ! Dr» J. Guthrie rose to speak. \ "Who are you?" came from a memMr of the audience. , f Dr. Guthrie gave his name, and pro- |' f eeefled to say that the Association had I .Men' much perturbed at the decision of I "We are proud of the k *|"?s, and proud that we are able to is >M«ed men brave enough to take them," s})» aaid. "They are no ornament, and .Athey are of no use, but they are there f, iparely as a matter of sentiment which 1 dfOttld be outraged by any Council that WWW take them away."

f c An Amendment. i* S. Fournier, well known in the i.'jKki of the unemployed, moved an •wiendment that the guns now in posi- «* in public places be dismantled, and t.«»t the proceeds of their sale bo dei Wed to the relief of unemployed re--5 soldiers. ' 'i? 118 cnaiH ßan: Tou're out of order. { a direct negative. v &jh onri "® r: You will permit me to f U« flDge t ' lat as an iH°gi ca l interprewon of my amendment. (Laughter.) , At the chairman's invitation CouncilsS. spoke, stating that it was Sm tte inten "on of the Council to j«raoy th e g Ung# Ho na( j s i mp ly *4 that they should be removed to *J» i&ueum, away from the City's -"**!% »pots. "I used the same words *! w. Guthrie/' he said. "They are "Mrnamenta, and should be taken off J? fI °WOT-beds. Cr. Beanland has said tenure are there as heroic monur*V»» but if you built guns as high -«UB- 0nnt y° u could not express appreciation of the valour of r*men. But is it necessary to have 'W? 1 * 36 "* Ge ™any? ( Noise and J??i ■) If you want mementoes J™ «e little pieces of artillery which used* against much heavier arin Prance. It was said that *«f ft -? erin g on disloyalty, but most e privileges we enjoy have been WhL throß gtt disloyalty—gross dis'■"fc «wh as Magna Charta." The tt<hth '* efeiTed to Cromwell, and then *3oir/"aS 4 * 618 who wrecked a certain W*i£i rter of Cairo - " Tnat waa dis&fy*K ha «aid. (A roar of laugh- * remarks by Cr. Eoberts were cries of "Cut it out." *^7, aßd "oonnting-ont."

The chairman: It is obvious that Cr. Boberts is entitled to a fair hearing in this hall. Cr. Roberts: I hope no utterance of mine has hurt the feelings of any returned soldier. The E.S.A. has a great task before it in speaking of the horrors of war—not its glories—to the younger generation. A voice: Never on your life! Cr. Boberts: As I said to the Mayor, you are talking as an old man. There is no glory about war, only horror. If any people can say that there will be no more "war it will be the returned soldiers.

"Disloyalty." Cr. J. W. Beanland said that the Councillors of the opposition received a shock when the motion was put forward. The .bottom of the whole thing was disloyalty. The guns had been there seven or eight years, and until now there had never been such a res> lution. The Labour Party, gaining a majority, thought to do things a bit differently. "I was astounded and could hardly believe the intention of the resolution," said Cr. Beanland. A voice:' No one else could;

Cr. Beanland: That gun standing in front of the Supreme Court is in keeping with law and order. The talk about the children is nonsense. There was norer a word about the Boer War guns. I hope the people of ChristchuTch will come along with a deputation and .make a change in the decision. The Mayor was outspoken and was in the right. "I voiced.my feeble protest at the Council meeting," said Cr. E.H. Andrews. Referring to mementoes of history, such as instruments of torture, etc., he said that their effect was to stir up horror and a desire that there should be no repetition. On that score it was a good thing to keep the guns on view. Dozens of other guns were offered to the Council that placed them in position, but the City was not plastered with them. (Applause.) The chairman: I wish to correct Cr. Roberts in his statement that no Canterbury men took part when the guns were captured. The big gun in Victoria square was taken by the New Zealand Rifle Brigade.

Cr. R. M. Macfarlane: Statements have been made that the bulk of the Association men are behind the resolution put to-night. There are 100 returned men here. Where's the mass? A voice: You'll find them at the ballot box. (Laughter and applause.)

"A Political Stunt." Cr. Macfarlane: They are not here, and I do not believe the resolution expresses the view of the majority of the returned soldiers. I believe this is a political stunt on behalf of a pilitical organisation. (Cries of "No! Nol") The chairman: That is manifestly unfair. This is in no sense a political meeting. Cr. Macfarlane: Mr Dougall said that .the Boer War was no credit to the British nation.'

Mr Dougall: Not me! Cr. Macfarlane: The City Council is copying very good examples set by Councils in England. People should be sincere when they say that war should be abolished. A huge disaster is threatening mankind. A voice: Yes, Bolshevism! (Laughter.) Cr.. Macfarlane: This meeting is no criterion 7 and I refuse to accept it as such. Mr Dougall is a jingoist of the first water.

A voice: Is this gentleman talking about the- motion or about himself? "The last speaker would make an excellent auctioneer or a SergeantMa jor," said Captain J. W. Crampton. "Sentiment placed those guns there and sentiment will have to remove them. But Heaven help the blighters who do remove them! (Loud applause.) Mr "W. W. Scarff: Does it mean that the gun near the Queen Victoria statue will be removed also? If so I will protest on behalf of the Veterans' Association.

Overwhelming Majority. At this stage Mr Pournier asked if he could speak again, but was ruled out by the chairman. The motion was put and declared carried on the voices. A show of hands was called for, and those in favour stood up. The chairman announced that it was carried by an overwhelming majority. Cr. Macfarlane stated that he wanted to ask a question, and repeated the request, but was howled down and his remarks were drowned by the singing of the National Anthem, during which some of those near the objectors to the motion remained seated.