PARLIAMENT

Wanganui Chronicle, Volume 74, Issue 243, 14 October 1931, Page 8

PARLIAMENT

BUDGET DEBATE VIGOROUS LABOUR ATTACK DEFENCE BY GOVERNMENT [ Per Presa Association. | WELLINGTON, Oct. 13. The House of .Representatives met at 2.30 p.m. Large.y-signed petitions were presented asking for the regulation of prices in the retail trade. Mr Langstone asked the Minister in charge of unemployment if he was aware that cooks and assistant cooks working in single men’s relief camps were compelled to work 14 hours a day for seven days a week and that they were receiving 10s a week pay and that the wage tax was being deducted from their pay. Hon. Mr Coates said Mr Langstone had been misinformed. The cooks worked 14 hours a day and received from £3 5s to £3 15s a week. Mr Langstone: What about the assistant cooks?” Mr Coates said he did not know about them, and he would inquire. The wages tax was deducted from the cooks’ wages, but not in respect of men with 10s a week. Imperial Coinage. Replying to Mr Wilkinson, Eon. Downie Stewart outlined the provisions of the Order-in-Council issued on July 23 last in reference to the importation of silver coins from Australia. He said he was not aware of any reports to the effect that large quantities of Australian silver were at present coming into New Zealand, and he did not think that such was the case. Regarding the arrangement with the Royal Mint for a share of profits on Imperial coinage used in New Zealand, he had to say it was based on a fiveyearly average of the amount of new coin brought to New Zealand, less the worn coin returned, The profits already received this financial year amounted to £13,820 and it wsa estimated that they would reach nearly £20,000 per annum. Regarding the suggestion that New Zealand should be allowed to mint its own silver, the Minister read a cablegram from the Imperial Government in which the Treasury regretted that under the existing financial conditions such a concession was impracticable at present, because the sources from which profit was derived to finance the African and the Irish arrangements had been dried up. An additional Parliamentary vote would be necessary before the matter could be entertained. If the concession were made to New Zealand as a favour, later on the redemption of coin in circulation would require to bo spread over a period of not less than say 20 years. The Deputy-Master of the Royal Mint had said that under redemption, New Zealand would make hardly any more than the profit enjoyed under the generous concession recently made by the Imperial Treasury. Financial Statement Debate. The debate on the Supplementary Financial Statement was initiated' by Hon. Downie Stewart in formally moving that the paper be referred to the Government for consideration. The Leader of Opposition said there, was a touch of unconscious humour in this mtion, because the paper was the

production of the Government. He thought it would havo been more fitting for there to be a motion to refer it to the people for consideration. Mr Holland submitted that the statement could no be adequately discussed until it was known how long the Houso expected to remain in session, and what were the details of the unemployment scheme to bo presented by Mr Coates. Ho contended that in view of the nature this Supplementary Budget, which represented a complete reversal of policy on the part of the United Party, and a partial reversal of policy on the part of the Reform Party, it would have been a fair thing for the people to be given the opportunity of declaring upon it before it was put into effect. Ho asked whether it would not have been the correct line of procedure for the Coalition Government to have taken this policy to the country and enabled the electors to express an opinion upon it. It represented a policy which had never been approved by the electors, and he was satisfied that there were portions in it of which a vast majority would disapprove. It was not sufficient for the House to express its approval of the policy, because such an expression would be upoii party lines, and at the crack of the crack of the party whip. It was true that the Labour Party had held the United Government had commenced to scrap its election policy. The Labour Party had ceased to support it when it had taken the step of reducing wages, but the Reform Party had then kept the Government in office. The United Government. had continued to scrap its policy bit by bit, and had then commenced to scran Ministers, quite a number of whom had been sacrificed, believing that it meant for the good of the country. But since then they had found that the position had been manipulated for party considerations. The latest appointment to the Upper House, for instance, was purely a party move. Mr Fletcher: And a disgraceful one, too. Mr Holland: And one of the most popular members of the Upper House has been sacrificed for party considerations. Continuing, Mr Holland said it was no excuse for the United Party to say it had been dominated by the Reform Party. It would still have to accept tho responsibility for its actions. But the fact remained that it was dominated by the Reform Party. Farmers’ Income Tax Referring to the proposal to abolish the graduated land tax, and substitute income tax on farmers, Mr Holland said that this represented a change of opinion on the part of the Minister of Finance, and, while he was not going to say it was not open for anyone to change his mind, nc considered that before suefi a reversal was put into effect the electors should have been consulted. He contended that the abolition of the graduated land tax was going to benefit only the big landowners, while the income tax would be applied to the small farmers as well. Mr Holland urged that Mr Forbes should make a frank and full and free statement regarding the Government ’s intention in respect to the general elections. There was tho utmost concern throughout the country as to what was proposed. There was now only a little over a month until, in the ordinary course of the life of the present Parliament would end by the effluxion of time. Tho candidates were getting ready for the contest and they had a right to know when it would take place. The electors also were entitled to this knowledge. He could understand the Prime Minister’s reluctance to face an election, but there were bigger questions than the fate of political parties. There were serious conditions requiring attention, and he insisted that the people should have the opportunity of saying in what manner these conditions should be dealt with. Mr Holland said that in view of tho indefiniteness concerning several portions of the statement, he did not nitend to deal with it in detail at the present time. He regretted that details of the unemployment scheme had not been submitted before the debate commenced. Mr Savage said the evidence of the intend to deal with it in detail at the submitted to the House, otherwise the Financial Statement could not be accepted. The Minister of Finance had said that prices might rise in the Old World, but why should New Zealand wait for that to happen? Surely New Zealand could act for herself? The Government might as well admit that it had not imagination. There was nothing in the statement at all, and it was useless to try and discuss it. The statement purported to help the farmer, but it would help the big landowner. Mr Adam Hamilton: That’s a favourite bogty. Mr D. Jones: Where does the graduated land tax begin? Mr Savage: It begins away above the heads of the smad farmers. Continuing, Mr Savage said the great bulk of the people assessed for land tax were below £lO,OOO mark and the bulk of the tax paid was above the £lO,OOO mark, so that the relief was being given to those most able to pay the tax. The object was to help the farmer, but the proposals would not help him. If ever there was a case for an appeal to the electors, this was one. The House was being asked to discuss the question niecemeal. There were 50,000 men unemployed, and no one knew where the position would end. The Government had no policy and would not take the House into its confidence about what it was going to do. There was not a member outside the Cabinet who knew what the position was and he doubted if many in the Cabinet knew. There was a proposal to help farmers with fertilisers, but there was nothing definite about it. Mr Lye: It is in operation now. There is a saving of 17s 6d a ton. Air Savage: Why doesn’t the member for Waikato get up and tell us something about it if he is on the inside ? Air Parry: He is only on the outside. Air Savage said he wanted to ask the Ministers for their intentions. Air Stewart: What is your secret hope ? Air Savage: I will hope and pray for an election so that the people will have a chance to get even. Air Samuel: What is your opinion of the Supplementary Budget? Air Savage: No language, Parliamentary or otherwise, would express my opinion. J?here is nothing in it that will help anyone, and nothing in it that will hurt the member for Thames, ami for that reason he will vote for it. Would the Government ask for supply and go to the country straight away, he asked, or would they bring their measures down, dispose of them, and go to the country in the usual way. Air McCombs said that no Government had a mandate to repeal the

graduated land tax or the Arbitration Act. Those two things were the two greatest principles of Liberalism. It was clearly tho duty of tho Liberals to go to tho country if they could not carry out their promises. Instead of doing that they had made tho most ignominous surrender. The Government was going back further than the Kight Hon. Air Alassey had dared to go, and that with a Liberal Prime Minister in office. How was tho repeal of the land tax going to help balance the Budget, he asked? How was the abolition of compulsory arbitration going to help? All that such a step would do would be to inflict hardship on the workers and perhaps lead to serious industrial trouble. Ho wondered why the Government was so foolhardy to attempt to carry out the proposals of tho Supplementary Budget. Was it a case of ‘ ‘ whom the gods wish to destroy they first make mad.” Continuing, he quoted figures to support his claim that the wealthy landowners would benefit by the proposed alterations. Tho big landowners were to be made a present of £320,000 a year when the Government was searching for money. The economic committee had suggestions irom representatives of the landowners that old age, widows’ and soldiers’ pensions should be reduced, and if that had been done the present might have been greater. Mr McCombs said that the suggestion regarding arbitration was a most reactionary one. Compulsory conciliation and voluntary arbitration would not. ensure reference to the ultimate arbitrator. Budget Well Received. Air D. Jones expressed the opinion that the Supplementary Budget had been received with general satisfaction throughout the country and the confidence that had been shown generally since the statement had been made had justified tho Government in taking a considerable amount of credit for it. He interpreted Mr Holland’s speech as meaning that he also gave the statement strong support, for the abolition of the graduated land tax and the proposal regarding the Arbitration Court were apparently the only things he objected to. Air Holland: I did not say so. Continuing, tho Alinister said that the Supplementary Budget was based on the principle of taxing those best able to bear it. Income tax w'as probably the fairest of all taxes. The graduated land tax was not based on ability to pay. It did not take earnings into account, and from that point of view differed fundamentally from income tax. Another reform in the Budget was in connection with company taxation and he believed that tho farmers would appreciate the consideration given stock and station agents. It had been said that nothing had been done about interest rates. If tho Government had wanted to gain popularity and support it would probably have done as Australia had done and reduced all interest rates, but that, system in Australia had not given relief to the people who needed it most. If the New Zealand Government gave a statutory reduction of interest amounting to 20 per cent, of the total, it would benefit a great many people who did not require it. The Government had found that many people who had lent money on farms were in far more difficult circumstances than those to whom the money had been lent. Tho reduction of interest would not be as fair and equitable, as the proposals outfined in the Supplementary Budget, and those proposals wore going a long way to meet the troubles of tho farmers to-day. Referring to tho graduated land tax, Air Jones said that properties shown in the Year Book as being valued at £40,000 were probably worth not more than £20.000 to-day, and he asked whether it was fair to put 8d in the pound tax on those properties. Air McCombs: They can get a revaluation. Would Not Be Paid The Alinister said that the Government was faced with the fact that the graduated land tax on large estates to-day simply would not be paid, and unless owners were given relief it would be impossible for them to carry on their finances. The big farmers were worse off financially than the small farmers. The Government recognised that it had, in justice, to remove the graduated land tax. A Labour Member: Why don’t you consult tho electors? Air Jones: Because Parliament is still sitting. Ho submitted that the Labour Party was making purely political capital out of their demands for an election. While they were clamouring for a general election immediately, they were hoping that it would not take place. It had been stated that there was nothing worth while in the Supplementary Financial Statement. Ho contended that the £250,000 relief which was being granted in connection with rural rates was certainly worthwhile, and the assistance being given in connection with fertilisers was also worth while. Everyone realised the importance of fertilisers to the farming industry, and prices were now well below anything they had ever been before. The price was now £3 17s 6d a ton on rail for 44/46 grade. Mr Savage: Is it going to stay there? Air Jones: Yes. He declared that this meant that fertilisers were being brought within the reach of farmers at an exceedingly low figure. Air Savage had seemed somewhat sceptical about this, but the Minister said he could assure him that it would remain there till June next. It would be reconsidered then. Air Holland: Docs that mean that there will be an election In June? Air Jones: Any Government honours the undertakings of its predecessors, but there is no need to worry about that, because, whether there be an election or not, we will be in office. Air Semple: You’re a wild optimist. Air Jones said there had been a complaint that the unemployment statement had not yet been presented. He insisted that there had • ot been very much time wasted because the statement would be presented this evening. The Government recognised that unemployment was one of the most pressing and distressing problems of the day. He believed that the stale.m-.a would meet with general satisfaction and the Government was prepared to do its utmost to carry it into effect. Coalition Government. Air C. A. Wilkinson said ho had urged the economic committee to establish a national government. Tho Coalition Government was another matter, and he was doubtful if it would succeed because they were still working on old party lines. He did not think that the proposals before the House

justified a coalition, and he believed the country would not be satisfied with tho proposals. He was of opinion that rates of interest should havo been reduced by Act of Parliament. He did not believe in broken contracts, but if no reduction were made contracts would collapse under their own weight.. Money values would have to be forced down and the Government should attend to that instead of increasing taxation.” What good will it do to balance the Budget if you ruin the taxpayer in the process?” he asked. Referring to tho subsidy for fertilisers, ho asked the Alinister of Agriculture why the South Island deniers could take off 12s 6d a ton while the north could only take off 6s. If the Government could reduce the price that way why did it not reduce it still further by treating the north and south alike. Ho asked why the subsidy was confined to one particular class of manure. If the Government wonted to do the fair thing it should havo given the subsidy to all classes of fertilisers. Air Wilkinson said ho must take exception to the abolition of the graduated land tax. It would mainly relievo the man who could afford to pay. Air Walter Nash also commented on the abolition of the land tax and said that tho people who wore being relieved had been relieved before from the payment of between £2,000,000 an' 7 £3,000,000. Hon. D. Stewart: What years are you referring to? Air Nash: From 1923 for about five year.,. Continuing, he referred to tho sug gosted amendments to arbitration and said that tho worker was as much entitled to consideration as the landowner. The House adjourned at 5.30 p.m. Continuing the Supplementary Budget debate Air. W. Nash said that he hoped the Government, would not increase the. wages tax insofar as it applied to the workers.