AN INTERVIEW WITH THE HON. MR SEDDON.

Tuapeka Times, Volume XXIV, Issue 1800, 3 June 1891, Page 3

AN INTERVIEW WITH THE HON. MR SEDDON.

"I'm always happy," said the Hon. Mr Seddon, in his blandest manner, " to hold commune with the members of the Fourth Estate," as he received our representative in one of the snuggest rooms of the Commercial on Saturday evening. "No apology, and not a word about time. At the present moment I'm exclusively the property of the public, and I've set out on this Ministerial voyage of discovery, if I may so term it, with the firm resolve to make every sacrifice and put up with every inconvenience in order to satisfactorily and fully attain the object of my cruise, to follow out my nautical simile." And the object of your cruise, as you call it, Mr Seddon ? Well, the object of my visit here and elsewhere is a definite and a practical one; and the more I travel and the more I see and converse with the people the more I am convinced of the great good to be gained by Ministers following such a course. Of course it is said that my place is in Wellington; that both myself and my colleagues should remain at headquarters and be guided by the reports of our responsible officers instead of putting the colony to a lot of unnecessary expense, as it's called. Well, people who talk in this manner, do so either from ignorance or prejudice, or probably from both. Now, just to give you an instance of what I mean : My Auckland trip cost the country something like £40, and just by one change I made in. connection with defence a clear saving of £500 was effected for the taxpayers. I could, were it necessary, furnish many similar instances; and no doubt I will do so when the proper time arrives. Why not rely on the heads of departmenbs for this kind of information ; and, as regards the requirements of the various districts, are not the representatives of the people supposed to attend to such matters as these ? Well, to be candid with you, the heads of the department were not in a position to supply me witn the kind of information I desired. The fact is the public" have no idea of the disorganisation and the utter absence of system qr principle, that prevailed in many of, the departments of the " civil service prior to our taking office. To a practical, plain, matter-of-fact man like myself the whole business was absolutely appalling. ' And as regards relying on the representatives of the people, that's impossible. Their continual cry is for spoil and grab andmore grab for their districts. I flatter myself that I've .been pretty successful in catering for the district that I've represented for so many years, but the demands and the expectations and the tactics of some of the members whom I have come into contact with during my travels have satisfied me that I'm only a novice, a mere child in that important department of politics.7— And Mr Seddon laughed heartily, apparently at the recollection of some of the big orders he had recently received. And your opinion, Mr Seddon, as regards the Otago Central ? I have very little to say on that subject,further than what Ihavealready said. I went over the line, and tested the arguments and the appeals of those who advocate its extension in the only practical manner possible : that is, by a personal inspection of the country, and by learning the opinions of the country settlers and others. From what I have seen and heard I must say that I am not at all convinced as to the urgency of completing this line. Why the very people who are making all the outcry are not able to agree among themselves as to the direction in which the line should' be taken. But Ministers before your time have been over the line, professional reports . in abundance have been furnished on the subject, and the same arguments advanced by the deputation that interviewed you in Dunedia a day -or two ago have already been listened to by your predecessors in office, and no doubt they will be repesited again and again during the next session of Parliament. In fact, this Ministerial pilgrimage or picnic, or by whatever name it may be most fittingly designated, is regarded by the general public as a useless and most un- ] necessary waste of money — a mere tactical performance undertaken to satisfy that portion of Otago interested in the extension of the line, Besides, you persist in saying there is nomoney for suph. works? I quite .agree with what you say to some extent, at all events. But the public, as a rule, is not as acute or as discriminating as one could wish in suph A matters, No allowance is made for the

• exigencies of my position. Is it not 1 better for the'- people and the colony that 5 I carried out the programme, or the ! performance, as you prefer to call ifc, ; as I am dping, than that I agreed to the .' demands of deputations and encouraged . a recourse further borrowing for the [ completion of' that and similar other works? Which of the two courses would be the cheaper and. the more beneficial for the country ? We have for disbursement on public works a windfall of £300,000 which we inteiid to 'spend in as judicious atjd careful- a manner as we 1 possibly"' can. I have' from • the outset promised nothing,, though I have at times been subjected to pressure of all kinds. . , And the general result of your trip through the colony ? I am convinced that, in the first place, it will have a fine moral effect on the people. I have met in the course of my travels all kinds and conditions of people ; and as far as I could I have endeavoured to inspire them with a higher ideal of politics, and of their duty to the state, and induced them, I hope, to take a more hopeful view of their own and the colony's prospects. Many people seem to regard this as a kind of pleasure trip, but I assure you it's about the hardest work that ever I engaged in in my life. There's neither honour, emolument nor pleasure connected with it. They make a great outcry about special trains and so on ; but I assure you it's a martyrdom to me, and I submit to it solely from a desire to serve the country and to improve, if I can, the condition of my fellow-colonists. It would be much better for me — for my present and future — had I never entered politics but dovoted the energy I have given to public matters to my own private 'concerns. And yet the result in the main is abuse and misrepresentation. Yes ; but virtue is its own reward, Mr Seddon, and, no doubt, posthumous ' fame or, better still, the applause of Sir • George Grey's unborn millions will acknowledge your services. And, speaking of Sir George, do you think he is likely to prove embarrassing to your Government ?. Well, embarrassing he may be, perhaps, at times, but never, I think, dangerous. I quite understand his hostility to Mr Ballance. It's a matter of ancient history that. But there's a very close and a very old friendship existing between Sir George and myself — a friendship extending, now, over an unbroken period of fifteen years ; and I feel confident that my influence with him will be quite strong enough to prevent his re-entry into political life becoming a danger to the party to which I belong. I I quite recognise, however, the possibility of a few of our prominent supporters kicking over the traces, becoming unmanageable, and giving some trouble. And among the few faithless ones-, you include, I assume, Mr H. S. Fish, one of the Dunedin city members ? Well, not exactly. I expected a certain amount of antagonistic feeling from him during my intercourse . with the public in Dunedin, and, I must say, I was not disappointed in my expectations. He is a man of undoubted abilty : one of those men that I , certainly would much rather have with me than against me. Tes ; his characteristics, as far as politics are concerned, are great force 'of character, a command of vigorous English and a width and quickness of intellect- v ual grasp that few menjn the House can lay claim to. Tou can't in the natural order pf things expect a docile following from such a man. His attitude towards us, I' believe, during the next session will be that of candid friend, but on all critical occasions we can rely on having him with us. As regards his relations with the labour party, and, indeed, I might also say with myself and the Go1 vernment of which I'm a member, I can't add anything to what your Dunl ediu correspondent says on all these matters. In my opinion he has exactly hit the nail on the head. There are also a few others, but neither he nor they, however much they may desire to harass us by a kind of guerilla warfare, have [ any sympathy for the other side, and we have, therefore, no serious apprehensions on their account. The, session will be one of about the usual length, and there is not the slightest danger of a dissolution; neither party desires it, and the country least of all. I suppose you are aware, Mr Seddon, that statements have been publicly made accusing you of utilising your position and opportunities for electioneering purposes — for advanciug the interests of your party — and that, as most people know, cannot be done without an expenditure of public money, with the accompanying result of debauching the public mind ? No doubt you are now referring to the Egmont election. Well, I consider that election had a fine moral effect on the country. You just want a few more such elections under the same circumstances to educate the people up to their duty. The people have now a Liberal Government, such as they have never before had in this colony. You speak of the Stout- Vogel arrangement as a Liberal government! Bah! It was a hybrid affair ; had as miich Conservatism as Liberalism in its composition. It was inoapable of doing any good for the country. Indeed, in my opinion it was the biggest misfortune that ever befell the colony. Now, at the present moment, you have the pure, unadulterated article, and we want the people to understand that fact thoroughly and take it to heart. And how' can that be done except by -taking advantage of contested elections to expound our principles and explain our policy ? The position I take up is a perfectly constitutional one. If you, follow Home politics, as I haye no doubt you do, you will see that members of the Imperial Government go down into the constituencies and take a leading hand in the political battles. Do you imagine they do it at their own expense? I tell you this : we mean to fight every election that takes place for the future, it doesn't matter in what end of the colony. That's the intention of Ministers, and it will be vigorously parried out. I don't want to b,e thought as speaking egotistically, but I pan assure you, suph is my influence with, the masses, I could at this moment turn the scale in almost any' constituency in the polony in favour of a Ministerial pandidate. Not to utilise this power i would be simply madness on mv part, And now having travelled, so much of l the polony, and learned so much of public opinion, what is your feeling, Mr i Seddon, as to your retrenchment policy P Our retrenchment policy we carried • out as a mere matter of duty, and as far l as we haye gone we have almost the ! entire people of the, cliquy aij our backs.

; In fact, all through my travels I have ; ■ everywhere received the thanks and the i applause of the people for my action on , ■'"•his retrenchment' question. Of course 1 I've had terrible experiences too. Dis- , missed officials have blocked my path at i every tui*n. But not only that, but their wives and in many instances, their daughters have come to me with tears in their eyes and entreated me to have i their husband or father re-instated in his position. I tell you my experience in this respect has been a terrible one, and I hope I may never have to go through it again. But I suppose you are aware that your action has produced a feeling of dread and uncertainty — a reign of terror, in fact — in the public service that is even worse than anything you have done in the way of dismissals. There is, apparently, no finality in your retrenchment scheme; no one knows when or where if is going to end ? Well, that's where the mistake is made. There is finality in our retrenchment policy. It is no haphazard affair, conceived in a moment of panic and intended merely to serve the purpose of the hour. We intend during the next session, with the consent of the House, to give the civil service a stability and a freedom from interference that it never had be.fore in its life. lam soi'ry y to observe that you appear to entertain the belief,/ common among our opponents, that personal or political feeling had anything to do with our action in the matter of retrenchment. You speak of instances in which it is assumed my colleague, Mr John M'Kenzie, has been actuated by personal feeling. Well, I believe, it will be found there are no grounds for such an assumption, and for myself I can say that I allow no personal or political influence to affect my action. I insist on having good officers, and in getting good work done, and beyond that I do not go. A man may hold what opinions he please : this is a free country, and, to my mind, inhere is no greater abomination, nothing more repulsive, than to molest or persecute a man for his political opinions. Such conduct is altogether opposed to the creed of Liberalism, and I can conceive no member of a Liberal Government being guilty of it. But I had to encounter a good deal of that kind of thing myself, particularly in the stand I took in reducing the police inspectors. But in that matter I was neither guided nor influenced by any person. I simply took the seniority list in my hand, and learned the duties of each officer and his capacity for work, physically and intellectually, and I then acted according to my own unbiassed judgment. Yes ; you may well say it caused a commotion, but time and reflection will prove the correctness of my action. And now, I ask you, has there been since then any unusual crime — has crime become more rife, or life more insecure or does lawlessness go unpunished P A Minister's duty in such matters is simply to satisfy himself as to the propriety of his action, and once convinced on that point he should allow no influence, no clamour, to hamper or interfere with him. Just as Mr Seddon delivered himself of this piece of political or administrative or retrenchment doctrine, a deputation, unbidden and unannounced, came with heavy tread into the Ministerial presence, and the interview abruptly ended.