EDUCATIONAL MATTERS.

Otago Witness, Issue 2672, 31 May 1905, Page 17

EDUCATIONAL MATTERS.

Mr J. A. Millar introduced a deputation which had been appointed by the School Committees* Conference to wait upon the Premier. Mr J. H. Wilkinson said they appeared, as representatives of the Dunedin and Suburban Sohool Committees' Association. He would like to congratulate Mr Seddon upon the great interest he had_ taken in. educational matters since coming into power, and upon the increased amounts from year to year ho had had jJaeed upon the- Estimates for school buildings and for educational purposes generally, and for the magnificent; -services he had rendered the cause of education. They noticed with pleasure Mr Sed ldon's promise that a Teachers' Superannuation Bill would be introduced at an early date, and were also strongly in accord with the appointment of teachers apart from an average attendance.

Mr W. Soott desired to say a few words on Education Board representation. Und-er the present method of electing members U£ education boards of the colony the town and suban'ban schools ccmld noiT elect a representative and were disfranchised, notwithstanding the fact that the Education Boards derived the great bulk of their revenue from them. They suggested that the existing

education districts^ should be divided into education electorates, and that Otago be BivicUjd' into' four- districts — metropolitan, ■Cruthenr,, northern, and' central. In the metropolitan district there would be. 31 ■c&ools. witn. an average 'attendance of 7000 pupils, the population of the district being §2,000. &b present this district was entirely .•unrepresented' on the- board. They did, not wish to take advantage* of these figures to bring, about, a preponderance of votes for the town. "With regard' to the mode of elec- — lion; they, would leave- that to the Government ;, but. they suggested that the municipal, or, parliamentary roll should be used. He. wished it to, be. understood that they iiadL no grievance with, the Otago Board: 33x"E.' Gr. Cray "brought under the notice tof the: Premiere thet subject- of; the payment of teachers, staffing the. schools. It haa iieen. brought under- the- Premier's notice, and it had been stated, publicly- -that the present inadequate, payment of teachers jwould be remedied^ They thought it desirable' to emphasise' "the. object-ions to the. present system. Mr Seddon was fully aware of. the effect of the. present ediicationaL. system on -male, teachers, coming, forward! and it .was Hardly necessary for him to- mention the inadequate, payment, offered! He mentioned-- the' case of a. teacher who lad- been, appointed, to*- a, school at. £160,. iwiho became: married,, became _a fatherland: in 12 months- time: his salary was. reduced. 1 to JBlflO, He.(Mr:-Crayi,,exDresse < asthe hope jthat- during- the- 'coming, session. Mr. SeddonSmuld deviaff- some- scheme whereby teachers, jjwrald. be. adequately? paioT for their work. H&; pointed out, that, there; were various cirinnnstaricei- which had.a.controlling; influence «S"wexr the average? attendance- at- a. school, and- thafe as- a. consequence of. a decrease 5 in the: attendance,, by- which- ih&. teachers lost, they- leffe" their occupation. Mk-Pryor brought under,- tha- notice, of the j iPnsmiec the- drifting-- towards-, centralisation, fim educational, matters,. -They felt. it. was at mate of serious, moment,, andr required, inrmediste- attention. The.- faefc that during recent, years, there had? been taken from, feetneafckrn- Boards; tb&j po_wer. to .-spend, money tipon.. new^ schools: seemed to- be,, -a very •erioais- matter. Uowrtliejsrhad: only? pow»£ ioimake^ repairs, ten old. schools.. Education Beards .had* better? opportunities of. knowing, the* requirements: off-theirc particular, districts-. ihsnx at central departments couldi. hare. Anotherr objectionable 11 feature was the : taking atfu^r from-, sohook committees and •Education Boards the. appointment of. teachers* . He\thougluy there-- was - no^ doubt . that thefr effect, of*' takings that pewer* away/ from/ committees and' Educationa Boards-. ■wroxUd' Bare tte- <>ffecfc o£- causiix^ the= in? tenesfcst in- schooL matters- i».- dwdndlfti asray-. iTOhent tHafe- power w«s taken.- away tiiereivould. ber-. no^ such* thing: as th©. parents or. scholars- subscribing? towards, inrnroyjng the grounds and buildings, and the burden•would be, a great. deaL heavier, on Governjnent - - - • Thß^ Premier-, saidlhe, had', been . agreeabjy; Burprjaedfto. fifadt.that-tiie-iittle' he had' done as. Miniatex 'o£j Edupation> had Keen- fayour^ aMyr received: He_"might- say- that--Ke: tbolci »" deep, interfist,- in educational , xrmtters. !?3kaß-- wsfßr- room: fbE.inq>rovem£ait, and l^^ tfemetna;^ its'- cfimmaid- the- Government hadi- endearouredl .tfac- nraite : that, improveidfuA^ . Siill; tHertr- tntss.a. great- deallmoie; *6^he= done,; anithey might attempt- to do* Sfc. Oaniiig;' to. iIW superannuation oF teacher^. he_- might? say tEat 1 th.€r otheir diy.- *-. r»Borfc was. broiight under: his^ notice- fromtljet- Atituary; - andY U&- received quite a fclietckV as. to. th& amount to be contributed. and, the pension that)m>ulcL Be,- coming: from, "that contribution. /When he. told, them, that; jwith the- teacher. toff SB' years-, of age. contributing £9j a year«n±iL 63^ years of: age; to- be aetuarily correct the pension would' be £10,' a year; hr Jwould- give them some idea of tHe. difficulties^ that hadi to- be" faced. It was very nice, to: say Hringi' in a superannuation Beheme for tfia payment- o£' teachers, but' swißeh. tEey. considered' How larg-e was- the xuunb'er. ofi teachers, the chief- troubleBeemed to.- him. to h& as to what they were to^ da- with teachers of advanced; ijjearß,; and, what aouldi these contribute for jHie, aniount tfiej- might' be able to give 1 (fch'em, to put the scheme- on- ar sound : financial" basis. Anything short of that basis TOrould" be a mistake. He would not like to see- a repetition of the fate that had over-ifaa-ken the- New South Wales scheme. He ffelt that under the,- existing state of' salaries and the amount teachers in advanced, years OTuld contribute unless the State diisoinefHiing their pension< must be- very limited. However, he did not belong, to a Cabinet that would, run away in the- face of difficulties. The, difficulties/ must be faced and got over; and what h» was going" to suggest to them now was, this : He- wished to •Have the assistance of the teachers tfaem■elves, and of the Committees' Conference, end h9 would ask them to communicate with such and allow their representatives to come to Wellington to confer with the Ibspeetor-general and the actuary, and the Government would pay their expenses and _Hreir expenses while there, for it was desirable to have the idvioe and assistance

of those particularly interested. They would then see what they could do, for they wished to make the scheme as perfect a. scheme as possible,, and they wished that "those specially interested should see the difficulties that had* to be faced, and help them to get' over them. He thought this was a very fair proposal, and it would give confidence to the teachers themselves and show that" the Government was not trying to shelve the responsibility because of difficulties, but was trying to face these difficulties. Another of the- difficulties that came under his notice was in respect to contributions in accordance with salary and the uncertainty, of salary under existing conditions.- 3?ixity of salary must be given before their scheme could bo on a sound 'IJasis. One case brought on another, and ,for that reason- particularly he had con- . suited his colleagues, and they came to the conclusion that they would place the . salaries of teachers on a definite and fixed basis. The a-rg-ument in the past had been that by making salaries dependent on attendanoty teachers would see to the attendance, -report truants, and interest themselves; in getting children to school. But when- epidemics made their appear--ance; what, could' the teacher do? Settlers ..left a— district,, and how could the teacher -heljr itf The- school teachers were a most •important body, of public servants; they ; were paid, by the colony, and ere long their salaries, would! Be made as definite as those of other, public, servants. Then came the 'question of" salary.. An improvement had j been made,, btxt there was still room • further.- improvement* in respect to male ■teachers. He, thought the trouble began at the- initial' stage with the small' amount paid, to pupil teachers, especially, the males. !If a- cadet', was wanted for the public ser-^ . vice,, it wasi simply a youth who had passed" the junior civil", service examination and 1 (educationally), was. no better equipped than a youth, required as a pupil teacher, and the paltry.- amount given its punil teacher by the- Education Board-, compared* very unfavourably with the, £40 a year .given the cadet byr the. State.- Both, were servants, of the State,', and' the; disparity was too great. If a. cadeir was- taken from, say, Dunedin to Wellington, by regulation he got his salary of £4-0: a* year with £25 lodging? allowance, or £65^ a year. It; was natural, therefore, that boys, should, endeavour to- entsr the civil servioe.; and. then,, of course, there was- the- uncertainty of the salaries paid afterwards, to teachers. However, the whole scheme, of payment was in review, and' he, hoped next 1 session, to achieve improvement in the direction indicated. Then, as to tKe question of the. Education j Boards and' the- p.resent method of their j election, Be would like to know what the i present representation, was, and where the-j nine members, elected were from.

Mr Cohen, remarked that", formerly everyschojaT committee gave one, vote, but. now schools- hadt five orr seven or nine- votes, according .to-, size,- and the country; schoolsf could thus- swamp, the city altogether. jThey had. hadi thee intolerable position of' ]H3i school' committees' voting- and then " ceasing^ toe exist. , ThVP.remiete (continuing), said: rcpresentaiticaisr were made- to. him fronr Canterba?ry jafca, and ifc was- evidently^ the case, ihafc: the .> country dominated- in. educational matters. could! be' snot' to some extent* by a !cl»ange in- thY method of- electing' EftEcaiaon j ; Boards. The present system was defective. ; A few householders- niet and; selected a committee, and- the committees, of course, - elected the board, and* it really meant, meetings of" a^ few householders were responsible for the election of the most importaiit bodies< in the- colony; He was- entirely with the- deputation, as to the- need for a change. Ho- vsas op the opinion that members of' the Education- Boards, representing the educational' districts- divided into wards, should b& elected- from- the popular roll, and he thought that could be done with little expense: Hfr was inclined to think the boards would l then baj^leeted on a very papular basis. GomplasSt- was made as to ourtailir.ent of the- powers of the boards, but. if they wei*B- elected on the basis- named theirfunctions - and powers might be further extended-. He was- not a party to, nor did Ho countenance or desire, centralisation. He believed' by diversity a-nd local control education was populai-ised' and made more complete than if it all depended on a central department. As to the question of buildings, complaints had .been made, and He might- say in this connection that nothinghad. been taken* from the boards. The boardsr received, their ordinary- building grants now- on an improved basis, and' that basis- was fixed' byj; a committee of the House; and was considered a* great improvement on wh'a^e^jSjpcUpi'evirv'VisH*. No power Had. Been, taken the boards-; but therehad' been of' recent- yens?*- k stwrea} vote for the erection of^nHcote in newf/T^itled districts, many of \vhjcih districts had really rome into existence o-winar to the purchase of land under the Hand iov Settlements Act. A* -far ac thes*- ~.ihooW wore eoncltiuk! tue board liad to mak-e a lpoom-mendat.-oi-i and thp (-Joio-rvrnent (rimu^'i the monpy. But what hupi.r:?>i.' Thu loaith

I Iliad the money given them for schools that iveFe very necessary, and h& was told that they used that money for other districts and purposes. Speaking of a- system that was in vogue before h© beoame Minis-tor of Education, he ooruld tell them that a board had to send in ite application, and it received the money and voted that money into its ordinary account, and the schools for which the money was- asked were never erected. It was not taking away the power of a board to take away its power of doing that sort of thing. The Wellington Education Board, further, took money and_ spent it upon technical schools in Wellington, while the school buildings in that district went unpainted, unrepaired, and overcrowded and insanitary. Was- he going to elandr that, he asked? No ; the boards were only being put in their proper position. The Auckland Education Board, again, shifted a school half a mile away to another plaids, which they said was more central, and in less than 12 months they shifted it back and spent £1100 ; and yet in Devonport and other parts of the district sahools wer-o overcrowded and in a rotten and insanitary condition. • He could give them many otber instances, and" he was not going to allow this to go on. The Government was not taking away the power of the-b-cards. but was seeing, that the public got value for its money. The board that did its dufy properly had nothing to fear in bringing under his notice proper reforms, and he would undertake to attend to such. There- might be some delay as to votes being pa-id to boards, but fehe boards did, as they were aware, anticipate when they got an overdraft agranst the building votes, and the only inconvenience entailed was a little payment of interest. When a board showed him ifc wanted money and i was doing its best, the Government was ! not hard up, and, if anything, he stretched a point in helpnig such boards. At the same time he wanted the boards to be reasonable, and not give so much, trouble as they. had. Again, he could say there was not the slightest danger, of: the appointments of teachers being made by a central authority-; but- something- oufirlit to be done io amend the existing conditions-. A-t the present time consultation of committees was provided for, and there had been considerable friction in some cases, which had not helped education in the locality. He thought this question should- be dealt with, and the power of committees and boards defined, and, where differences did arise, there might bo some authority which could- step- in and pour oil on the troubled, waters. But. given the election, of- boards on a. widened basis, so that local interest oouid not definitely ' ebaps t±Le-- ©leotion. titan, he tiK>tn?h.t fcha± | ,-so fa. r as the appointment of teaoher& was' concerned there would be an end to clashing between- committees' and boardsi They might convey from him. to their teachers ; the- assurance- that, anything- that oould be ; done; within, reasonable limits tb improve r th®ir- ppoaitkwL, would j be; au work oft love. Tfie» oolony scarcely, realised how-- moae'h, its •future depended; ojv the teadSeis of- New Zealand^- — (Applause.) - ; The deputation,- then.- withdrew, havingthanked the.Pfamier> for his- assurances: