THE PROPOSAL FOR A COLONIAL LOAN.

Otago Witness, Issue 2105, 28 June 1894, Page 19

THE PROPOSAL FOR A COLONIAL LOAN.

PUBLIC MEETING. A public meeting of the electors of the City of Dunedin, convened by the Mayor, for the purpose of considering the propriety of urging the Government to at once raise a loan for the speedy completion of lines of railway in both islands " which are likely to be of a reproductive character, and will advance and promote settlement of the country," was held in the Princess Theatreon Monday evening. There was a large attendance, the building being crowded. The Mayor (Mr H. S. Fish) presided, and seats on the stage were occupied also by Messrs J. Rattray, R. Wilson, J. '■£. Mackerras, A. Burt, A. Bathgate, E. B. Cargill, C: -S. Reeves, F. Meenan, R. L. Stanford, J. B. Thomson, H. Guthrie, W. C. Kirkcaldy, 'J. Robin, C. Haynes, J. Hyman, W. Wright, Donald Reid, H. M. Henderson, L. Mendelsohn, S. M'Donald, A. Matheson (mayor of Roslyn), T. M. Wilkinson, D. W. Woods, J. Gore, S. N. Brown, D. Keid jun , D. Nico), and J. M'lndoe.

The Mayok said at the request of a large number of fellow citizens he had convened the meeting for the purpose of enabling them to take into consideration the propriety or otherwise of raising a loan for the prosecution cf our national railways, and thereby providing work for all classes of the commuuity. — (Applause.) He thought every one would agree that it was desirous to hive a loan at the present time. Money was exceedingly cheap now, and our credit was exceedingly high ; so ho might assume if it was wise to raise a loan that the present time was most propitious for doing bo. We were raising about £150,000 or £200,000 a year more than we wanted for the government of the country for the purpose of prosecuting public works ; but this Bum only enabled us to do that in a pottering, humbug sort of manner, which did no good to anyone living, and it would take many years' at the present rate before these important works would be finished. If we raised four millions of money at the price vie could get it at, it would take less than the money we raised ia surplus taxation to pay the interest on the loan, while immense benefit, content, and happiness — (laughter) — would flow from the spending of our neighbours' Bovereigna. At the present time throughout the length and breadth of New Zealand there was great depression, and our traders had conbiderable difficulty in makirig bo:h ends meet. A large number of artisans were also out of work. If we raised this loan, and spent it at the rate of £650,000 per annum, there would be work for everybody during the next six or seven years. He did not mean to advocate for a single moment that it would be sound to borrow simply for the purpose of providing work for the unemployed ; but when we had got the Otago Central and the Cafclin's River railways unfinished, and had besides these lines thousands and thousands of acres fit for settlement, the fact that there was a considerable number of men out of employment must be a factor in considering the propriety of constructing these works. — (Applause.) Now a great many people said the Government did not want a loan, and when Me Seddon was in Dunedin a short time since he had a conversation with him on this matter. He (the mayor) suggested that the Government ought to go in for a loan, but Mr Seddon Baid the

Government did not want a loan although the country did. — (Applause.) The Hon. Mr Ward, in his speech at Oamaru, also said': "If a million or two of outside money were brought here for circulation would any man say that would not have a salutary and advantageous effect on every industry in the colony.'* To that he (the mayor) honestly said "Amen !'* (Applause and laughter.) Tho time had arrived, after long abstention from borrowing, when we might judiciously raise a loan for works of a reproductive character and nothing else. He was extremely glad to see so many ladies present that night. It augured well not only for 'the quietude of the meeting, but for the common sense conclusions to which the meeting would come. — (Laughter,) He did not know why they should laugh. They were not ungallant enough to deny the truth of his words ; and he appealed to the ladies that night to vote for the proposals to b9 laid before the meeting. He had just received the following telegram from Mr John Stronach, the chairman of the Vincent County Council:— "H. S. Fish. — Only one opinion in this part of Central Otago— that is, unless all and every means are taken to complete tha Otago Central line that this part of Central Otago will bo wiped out. I earnestly hope that a loan will be obtained to complete this and other important lines with all possible speed." Ho had aIBO a telegram from Mr George Fache, of Clyde, who said -.—". — " Clyde ia thoroughly in accord with object of your meeting this evening. Unless Otago Central railway is pushed on to 'his poiut without further delay this portion of Otago will be depopulated. Business from northern parts surely drifting towards Invercargill." Ho would now call upon Mr S. N. Brown to propose the first resolution. Mr J. M'lndoe : Perhaps, Mr Chairman, you'll allow me —

The Mayor : No, I wou't. We have gob our maeting.— (Disorder ) Mr M'lndoe desired to propose this in opposition to the mayor occupying the chair: — "That whereas the mayor, Mr H. S. Fish, has presumed to call this public meeting of electors in tho Dunediu district without in any way consulting the mayors of the other boroughs interested, this meeting protests against his assumed authority and reminds him -for the future to proceed with greater caution." — (Loud laughter and interruption.) He maintained tbat the mayor had no right to call that meeting. — (Laughter and applause.) One of the members or the three members for the electorate might do it. — (Cries of " Sit down" and uproar.) The mayor was, no doubt, a superior person. — (Groans.) The Mayok asked whether it was the pleasure of the meeting to further hear Mr M'lndoe.— (Cries of " Yes " and " No.' ) Mr M'lndoe declared that the meeting was not against him, but, as the uproar continued, he returned to his seat.

Mr S. N. Brown said he did not know why the first resolution was entrusted to him, unless for the fact that for some 20' years he had lived in Central Otago, and he had probably as wide an acquaintance with that district as any man in Dunedin had, and was thus able to speak with some .degree of truth of the wants of the district. He felt that that meeting would sonnd the first note of a cry which would before many weeks ring from one end of New Zealand to another — (applause and cries of dissent) — and his reason for thinking that was that from his own experience and the knowledge he had gained of other people's experience he knew that New Zealand was, so far as the trading people were concerned, never in a worse state than ab present, and that certainly it had been infinitely better so far as the industrial people were concerned. The question was not a party question and it was scarcely a political question, for he cared not who had the spending of the loan moneys so long as they were honestly expended oh specified public works. If he thought; the Government were going to float a loan of one million or two millions and have a scramble for the money such as there had been under the public works policy of 1875, he would be the last person to appear on a public platform to advocate a loan ; for not only was that Bcramble a disgrace to the colony, but the result was a scandal to the colony. — (Applause). The resolution which had been placed in his hands was to this effect : — " That in the opinion of this meeting the time has arrived when the Government may judiciously raise a loan in the London market for the purpose of expediting the completion of such lines of railway in both islands as are already in progress, and which are likely to be of a reproductive character." — (Applause.) Naturally enough there was a division of opinion in the country regarding the advisability of raising a loan, and he had no objection to the division of opinion s6 long as those opposed to the movement were prepared to come- on to the platform and give reasons for their opposition, and sub stitute a better remedy than a loan for the p'reyailing depression. — (Applause.) Referring to the resolution of the Knights of Labour urging upon the industrial portion of the community the advisability of not consenting to any money-borrowing policy until the Budget had been delivered, he saw nothing unreasonable in that resolution ; but it did' strike him as a paradox that that resolution, which might be taken as the resolution of a body representing the industrial classes, should be in the same direction as a newspaper f xfcracts, forwarded to the Daily Times with tho endorsation of Mr A. C. Begg, who might be taken to be the representative of capital. If they read between the lines of that newspaper extract, it meant that Central Otago was to be reduced to the state of a wilderness embracing one or two stations [with half-famished dogs at the gates barking at civilisation ; for if we were net to have progress— if we were not to borrow but simply to spend — it meant that the centre of the province would speedily become depopulated. This loan was not proposed with any local Bpirit, but was intended for the benefit of the whole of the colony, and he believed the North Island was as much in need of having its Trunk line pushed through as the people of Otago were in need of having the Otago Central and Catlins railways pushed on. As for Central Otago he could say that the crying want there was tbat the settlers should' have an oppor* tunity to bring their produce to a suitable and profitable market and to bring their mineral products to the seaboard. The Catlins river line would also, no doubt, be of groat utility, and the one railway would be the feeder of the other, for in Central Otago the great scarcity of timber had been a serious bar to the progress of the mining industry, and the Catlins line would open up vast forests of timber, and traflb would thus be created for both lines. He was quite prepared to give the present Government credit for what they had done. He thought they had pushed on the lineß as well as their resources would allow them— (applause)— but he wonld point out that we had already reached only the threshold of the Otago Central country, which we were all anxious to open up and settle, and if it were opened up a great impetus would be given to the whole of the industries of the interior. Amid repeated interruption the speaker referred to the difficulties under which tha mining and agricultural industries had in the past been prosecuted in Central Otago, and to the possibilities of the development of those and the fruit-growing industriee. Speaking from

his own knowledge, he thought that, in the best interests of the colony, it would be a judicious thing that a loan should be raised for the prosecution of reproductive works, and that not only would a vast benefit be thus conferred on the present generation but an unspeakable benefit on generations to come. — (Applause.) Mr E. B. Cargiix seconded the motion. In doing so he said everyone agreed that the Otago Central railway ought to be completed, and that it wap a scandal and a disgrace that the construction of the line had not been carried through long ago. — (Applause.) There was no question that the making of the line would greatly help settlers in the interior of Otago, and would promote further settlement and develop further industries, which were not now able to find a footing for want of communication with the coast.— (Applause.) The only question was, how was this to be accomplished. They had various plans put forward to get over the difficulty. The proposal to set aside land and give land grants to syndicates did not meet with public approval, and he did not think that many now living would see the railway finished if it was to be constructed out of surplu srevenue. — (Applause.) It was, however, a reasonable way to construct the line by borrowing money.— (A Voice : " Yes," and cries of " A State bank," followed by loud applause.) A State bank might be a very good thing ; but to say that the country could make a railway out of "shin plasters" — (Cries of •• Ob, oh ! " and laughterwas to his mind impracticable. He knew there were a certain number of people who decried anything like borrowing — (hear, hear)— but he believed himself that the only way of making the Otago Central sooner or later would be by borrowing money. — (Cries of "No.") The question was: Was it to be now or some future time. — (Cries of "Now.") There were a number of people who said that borrowing was bad — (hear, hear) — and that the public works policy was a mistake which had ruined the colony — (Hear, hear.) He did not believe that a little bit, and for people to say that the public works policy had ruined the colony showed that they must be blind and deaf. — (Hear, hear, and laughter.) Was it not a marvellous colony ? Let him ask what it was doiog at the present time. It was not only, in response to the labours of a small population, giving an abundant supply of everything that was good in the way of food and clothing, but it was exporting goods of the value of eight or ten millions sterling. That was unparalleled in the world at the present time. — (Applause.) We had gone wrong in many ways : we had gone wrong in our finance; we had suffered reverses from various causes, but do not let us cast the blame in the wrong place. Our wheat had come down to 22s 6d a quarter in the London market, our wool had fallen to a greatly reduced price, and our gold export had fallen to a fraction of what it used to be ; and it was these things that had brought us down in common with the rest of 'the whole world, and not our public workß policy, But in the face of all these depressing things, and all the trouble, financial and otherwise, the colony had never a shadow of doubt thrown upon its credit up to this time ; indeed the credit of the colony now stood higher than that of any other colony. — (Applause.) This was to a great extent due to the public works carried out in the past by borrowed money, so it was not true that borrowing was always bad. Nothing, as a matter of fact, could be done without borrowing, and it was absurd for us to say we would never borrow again.— (Laughter and applause.) He did not think a State bank would be a means of raising money for the purpo3e of carrying on our public works, because Government notes had never succeeded in other parts of the world. There were people who said, " If you raise a loan you will have a scramble." — (Hear, hear.) He, however, was not of that opinion, and thought that they might trust their own Parliament to deal with the money. He was not prepared to agree with the Crovernment in everything they did, but in the measures they had taken with regard to colonial finance they had done themselves very great credit. They had raised the credit of the colony, and put it in a position it never occupied before. — (Loud applause.) But the Government no more than anybody else could make bricks without straw ; and if the meeting agreed that these works must be constructed they must find the money or show the Government how to do so. He thought it would be their strong desire to raise sufficient money to carry out these works, which, if left partly constructed, would entail great loss on the colony. — (Applause).

' Mr R. L. Stanford rose to propose an amendment, because he believed that borrowing at the present time would be exceedingly undesirable. — (Applause.) The amendment, which he would submit, was in three parts, and read : " (1) That it is not desirable at present to urge on Government the obtaining a loan in Great Britain ; (2) that a half-million loan contracted within the colony would be of advantage ; (3) that Government be earnestly requested to introduce such legislation as will compel the three Australian banks tradiog in this colony to advance the whole of the deposits in their hands here — (laughter) —to traders in this colony." — (Laughter and applause.) — Ho was at one with those who desired to put tin end to the depression. After careful inquiry he had learned that our progress was beiDg stopped, that industries were being cramped, that traders were beiog hampered, that workmen were being nearly starved — (murmurs of disf ent) — for the want of money to carry on the business of the colony. — (Applause ) He was at one with those who lamented the unhappy ccndition of the trading and industrial portion of the colony ; but he took leave to think that the proper remedy for this unhappy quiet was not in borrowing from the English moneylender and increasing on our backs a burden which we already found intolerable, and which, if largely increased, would lead ultimately to repudiation.— (Applause, and cries of "No.") He knew that those who differed from him were apt to look back to the pleaeant times of the roaring seventies, when the public works policy was first started, and whtn in the short space of 10 years 15 millions of foreign capital were spent in the colony. Those wero good times — (laughter) — when everybody could make a little and some could make a good deal; but he ventured to thiok that if they examined the prices of our products and other statistics they would agree with him that the temporary prosperity of the colony was owing a great deal more to the prices of our commodities than to the borrowed millions. — Applause ) He noted from Government Btawstics that the whole burden on the back of each ir ember of the population in 1870 was only £S9, but it rose in 10 short years to £47 ; and during the years 1880 to 1890— the " taper-ing-off " eighties — the burden again rose, uitil in 1889 every one of the population of the colony was payiDg positively £60. In 20 years the amount of texation per head had rather more than doubled. That came of borrowirg millions in Great Britain and of pending 10 years, not in a bar-room — (loud aughter),— but in the money lender's parliament in London. Now, he said, do not let

us pay more tribute ; we were paying plenty already — that was the source of our depression at the present time, and every additional million would increase the burden heavily. He would not spend their time, as he believed they all had now to be in bed every evening at 10 o'clock — (roars of laughter) — in discussing his second proposal, because it was of minor importance, but he would ask their grave attention while he put some of the features of the banking question before them. The Mayor rose, but was greeted with groans and cries of "Sit down," and after he had waited patiently for some time for a hearing without succeeding in obtaining one he subsided. Mr Stanford said he would endeavour to point out to the meeting a way by which they could do without a loan. The Mayor : It has nothing to do with the meeting at all. Mr Stanford said that, whereas in 1883 the Australian banks received £2,771,281 in deposits and made advances of £4,780,800 or an excess of advances over deposits of £2,069,519, they received in 1893 in deposits from their customers in New Zealand alone no less a sum than £6,135,054, which represented the eaviDgs of the artisan, the workman, the retailer, the merchant, and the settler, and they advanced, by way of discounts and advances of an open nature, to the whole people only £4,890,651, or less by a million and a-quarter than they received from the colony. — (Applause.) He put it to the meeting, whether if that million were restored, whether if the Legislature by an act compelled the Australian banks to restore the million and a-quarter to those from whom they borrowed it, it would not be a wiser course to pursue than to pay £40,000 a year for every million that was obtained from Great Britain. — (Applause.) He put it to them whether, considering that there were now in office the best Government who ever held the reins of power in the colony — (loud applauae) — a Government who had found repeated deficits in the public chest and had turned them into repeated surpluses— (applause) — he asked them, would they harass the Government now? — (cries of "No") — or would they not rather say to them in all seriousness, " You have done so magnificently with our finances in the past, that we'll leave you to work out your own salvation in your own way in the future " ?— (Applause.) In reply to a question from one of the audience, the Mayor said that Mr Stanford's amendment required no seconder. Mr James Rattray then rase to address the meeting, but as his voice was quite unequal to the task of penetrating to the majority of the audience, the noise and interruption became worsej than ever, and after several fruitless attempts on the part of the chairman to restore order, Mr Rattray resumed his seat. The Hon. W. Downie Stewart ssid the subject of borrowing was one that had occupied his attention for a considerable number of years, and he had no hesitation in saying that to borrow at the present time would not only be a blunder, but a crime. — (Loud applause.) If we borrowed money now we would be just where we were now four or five years hence, and would have £100,000 of interest to pay in the meantime, — (Applause.) He believed that we should go in for a policy of self-reliance — (hear, hear) — and although we had borrowed largely in the past— (uproar)— they would find he had been opposed to borrowing for many years. He said to them now that he agreed very much with the remarks of Mr Stanford, who had hit the nail on the head. At the present we had a debt of thirty-eight millions of money, and we had to pay over £1,800,000 a year to the Home creditor, and he said that the very worst policy would be for us to increase our present indebtedness. He would not occupy their time further except to warn them against going into the London market and placing their heads under the heel of the Home creditor. Mr John Weir said the meeting had been mismanaged from first to last. He agreed with the honourable gentleman who had just spoken that the amendment before the meeting was a reductio ad absurdum. — (Loud applause.) Mr Stanford divided his amendment into two parts. — (Uproar.) One half of the amendment referred to borrowing in the colony, and the other half to leaving the Government to their own resources and to their own sweet will. — (Renewed laughter.) He would speak in favour of the amendment only so far as a non-borrowing policy was concerned. — (Uproar.) He would ask the gentleman from Central Otago who had previously spoken to step forward and let him examine him. — (Renewed uproar, and cries of 11 Order.") The Mayor : Gentlemen, we are met here to discuss this question. If you will not allow the speakers a fair hearing I will simply close the meeting. ' I think it is disgraceful that a lot of citizens should come here and make the noise you are making. — (Applause, and cries of "Put him out.") Mr Weir (proceeding) said he detired particularly to examine the gentleman from Central Otago in regard to the interior with a view of finding out what kind of an asset it would really be in the event of the railway being, constructed to a particular point. — (Uproar.) In regard to Central Otago it was so excessively hob during the summer months that it was neither adapted to dairy farmiDg, pastoral farming, nor any other kind of farming. — (Uproar.) The heat was so intense during the summer, and in winter it was so cold, that the country was not adapted for farming of any kind. — (Renewed uproar and cries of '' Order.") 'lbs Mayor asked if it was the wish of tha meeting that the speaker should be heard, and after taking a vote upon the matter he allowed Mr Weir to proceed, but the audience eventually apparently got tired of that gentleman, and he resumed his seat. Mr A. Bathgate reminded the meeting that the question before them was to borrow or not to borrow, and they did not want "any red herrings drawn across the track, such as the capabilities of Central Otago or the action of the Australian banks. — (Hear, hear.) There were many persons in the community who shrank from the idea of borrowing, but there was borrowing and borrowing, and it was unfortunate for us that when we did go in for a borrowing policy all the main products of the colony were, as Mr Stanford had pointed out, high in value. Had the reverse been the case — had prices been low then, and had they risen during the tapering-off policy — we should have had little or none of the present depression. — (Hear, hear.) Seeing that everything was low now, and that the colony was suffering from a depression which was not peculiar to it, but Irom which the whole world was suffering, it appeared to him to be an appropriate time to lift New Zealand out of the depression and put it forward by some other manner — (applause and cries of "No") — and he thought we could do that by borrowing and spendiog judiciously. — (Applause and cries of "No.") A great deal of money borrowed in the past had been squandered, but surely we could benefit by experience and employ money in future by opening up country for settlement. — (Applause ; a Voice : "We don't want it.") In Central Otago there were 5000 men who wanted it, and who were induced to sink their little all there in the expectation of having

a market ; and there were other portions of the colony which were similarly situated. We did want the money ; we wanted to see the colony go ahead ; we wanted to see the cloud of depression somewhat lightened, and it struck him that the question whether borrowing money and spending it in the manner he had indicated would not have that effect might be fairly considered. He believed for one that it would have that effect, and for that reason had much pleasure in supporting the resolution.

Mr D. Nicol then rose to speak, amid uproar and cries of "Sit down." Mr F. M.Lester, who was seated in the stalls, also rose to speak, when the Mayor requested him to come up on the platform if he desired to address the meeting.

Mr Lester then ascended the stage and seconded Mr Stanford's amendment. He said he had listened to the various speeches in support of the motion, and he had not heard anything reasonable in support of a borrowing policy.— (Applause.) Working men were all agreed with those speakers who said the present time was one of great depression. They were all agreed that they had been reduced far below what might bo termed a living wage, and they were all in perfect accord as to the necessity of finding work for those who were at present unemployed. — (Applause.) But when we came to look at the policy of the past, when we came to think that every child born into this fair colony was born with a burden upon its shoulders of from £50 to £60— (a Voice : " More "), — and when we considered that each child had to carry that burden through life, we need not wonder at there being such times of depression. Were the working classes any better for the money that was annually sent out of the colony to pay interest upon loans in the past p — (A Voice : " No.") It was true that they had a larger share in paying the interest, for it was a well-known fact that all taxation must come out of production. Hence the man who laboured was the only man who paid taxation. — (Hear, hear.) Now, he admitted that a borrowing policy was good for a certain few. — (A Voice: "There they are behind you," and laughter.) But if a borrowing policy was good for the whole community we ought to be able to look round Dunedin and find happy homes of working men and great prosparity. As the seconder of the amendment he did not intend to give much attention to the subject of a State bank, but he could say it was perfectly feasible. Money was simply a means of exchange, and nothing more — (applause) — and when they talked about building railways on "shin plasters," let them do away with gold as a medium of exchange, and what would gold be worth ? Nothing more than "shin plasters." Surely if we could get the moneylender to advance us a million of money then it must be safer for the Government to issue notes. — (Loud applause ) The party who took those notes in payment for either labour done or material supplied was in a far safer position than if the Government borrowed a million of money and had something like £40,000 a year to pay in the shape of interest. — (Applause.) With regard to the Otago Central railway and other public works the unemployed could be set to work as soon as the people gave the Government sufficient support in favour of a scheme to issue Treasury or State notes.— (Applause.) He wondered how many bits of paper the gentlemen behind him were in the habit of floating. — (Loud laughter and applause.) The issue of notes such as he had referred to was recognised as the basis of the present system of trade ; for what was the meaning of promissory notes ? What were they but " shin plasters " ? and how was the whole commercial world carried on but by "shin plasters " ? We talked of gold being at the back of the notes, but we must have something at the back of gold, for gold was only valuable as a means of exchanging commodities. — (Applause.) Mr D. Nicol, speaking amid great disorder, held that the no-borrowing policy was the correct one. What guarantee, he asked, had they, supposing the colony did borrow, that the present Government would remain in office and that the money would not be squandered. If it were wished to borrow money, ho advocated borrowing in the colony. Mr H. E. Muir asked if he would be in order in moving a further amendment. He was in sympathy with neither the motion nor the amendment, and he believed a large number of people in the theatre were in the sa-ue position. The Mayor said that if the meeting desired to allow Mr Muir to move another amendment he would receive it, though it was not in order. He had come there to preside that evening believing that the meeting would be one of respectable men. If they did not keep order he would simply close the meeting. — (Uproar.) A show of hands, being taken, was in favour of Mr Muir's amendment being received. Mr Muir observed that both the motion and the amendment affirmed the principle of borrowing. So far as he was concerned he was opposed to borrowing either in England or in the colony, and he desired to move this amendment—"That this meeting urges the present Government to take no action in regard to borrowing money without first appealing to the people of the colony."— (Applause.) The Mayor said it appeared to him that either amendment was practically a negative to the motion, and hs thought the best thing he could do was simply to put- the motion. Mr Stanford submitted that hi 3 amendment was not a direct negative, because it purposely included the words " at present." The Mayor said he could not put the last put of Mr Stanford's amendment — that portion referring to the foreign banks— because it was not an amendment. It had nothing to do with the purpose for which the meeting was called. — (Groans and general uproar.) Well, he would not put it. — (Disorder.) Mr Muir's amendment was then put to the meeting. There was apparently a considerable majority of ■hands held up in its favour, but The Mayor said he thought the amendment wae lost. The ruling was received with groans, cries of " Shame," and requests for the appointment of two scrutineers. As soon as he could make himself heard the Mayor offered to put the amendment again. This was greeted with cries of "No." His Worship thereupon declared the amendment lost, and further groaning and disorder ensued. When this had subsided, Mr Muir said : I protest The Mayor : I am chairmau of this meeting and am going to rule. — (Disorder.) Mr Muir : I demand that you appoint two scrutineers from the audience to count the hands. — (Renewed uproar.) The Mayor then proceeded to put Mr Stanford's amendment, but could not make himself heard for some time. Eventually he said that if they did not like to listen he would close the meeting. (" It's a farce," a voice cried). " The amendment ? " replied the Mayor, " I quite agree with you ; ibis." His Worship proceeded to put the amendment, reading the first and second clauses only. Cries of " Read it all " were raised, and great confusion ensued, the Mayor ultimately stating that the last part of Mr Stanford's amendment, referring to the banks, was not an amendment, and he would not put it. "We won't have it," "You're a shuffler," and other cries were raised, and when

the amendment was submitted to the meeting there did not seem to be any hands held up either for or againet it. When the mayor was about to put the original motion, the disorder continuing,

Mr J. F. M. Fraser interposed, and said he thought the meeting should remember that it was a meeting of orderly citizens, and behave so that it might be a credit to the city. This, too, should be remembered — it was well known he was a political opponent of Mr Fish's— that there was a gentleman in the chair who held the highest position in the city. They should wait until the motion was put. Ib would be lost by an overwhelming majority, and the mayor would have the honour to declare it lost. Surely they could give the chairman an opportunity of showing that he could conduct a meeting properly — as he had conducted it to that stage. Let them wait till the motion was put, and then vote against it as one man. — (Applause.) The motion, on being put, was lost by a large majority, and on the Mayor declaring that it had been negatived loud cheers were raised.

The meeting then broke up, a vote of thanks to the mayor for presiding being passed on the motion of Mr C. Colclough,