N.Z. PARLIAMENT.

Otago Witness, Issue 2006, 4 August 1892, Page 16

N.Z. PARLIAMENT.

WEDNESDAY, JULY 27. Tho House met afc 2.30 p.m. A FARMERS' PETITION. Mr SAUNUERS presenbed a petition from a large number of farmers iv Canterbury on the subject of the land and income tax, which was read by the clerk. Mr Saunders moved that the petition be printed. The Hon. J. BALLANCE said the petition came from a Conservative association, but he had no objection to its being printed. Sir J. Hall, Messrs Rolleston, Russell, Fergus, and other members strongly supported Mr Saunders' motion. After discussion, Mr HOGG moved an amendment — "That the petition be referred to the Printing Committee to ascertain its opinion as to whether or not it should be printed. Mr SAUNDERS pointed out that it would be only an act of justice to print tho petition, which came from a very largo number of people who would have to pay considerably under the new taxation. The Hon. W. P. REEVES said the Government had no desire to prevent the petition being printed, but he pointed out that it came from a political association organised for the purpose of opposing the present Government. He then read out the names of several of the petitioners, and appealed to Canterbury members as to whether or not they were squatters or whether there was a single name on the petition that was prominent in the Liberal party. Mr John Holmes also had never been in touch with the present Liberal party, and had on a certain memorable occasion written a letter against that party, which would never be forgotten by the Liberals of Oauterbury. He also read a speech by Mr John Grigg, which showed that the object ef the association he referred to was to build u\) popularity by setting town against country. Mr T. MACKENZIE (Clutha) said Mr Reeves' speech showed what country settlers had to expect from tho present Government. He had denounced the gentlemen who signed the petition merely because they were country settlers, but ho never told the House what those gentlemen had done for the country. The Opposition were twitted with being actuated by a desire to stonewall business, but the speech of the Minister for Labour was exactly calculated to eftYcfc that object, and it was unbecoming of a AiinUlrii* of the Crown. Ho would a->k whether thosfs gentlemen had no right to approach the House if they thought they had a grievance, or w.is everybody to be of the " right colour " before they veulured to get a grievance redressed . Mr MEREDITH regarded the debate as most irregular and inopportune. The petition presented by Mr Saunders came from a section of the community that had every right to receive consideration from the House. The motion for printing the petition was carried by 4-2 to 21, and the amendment lost. THE FINANCIAL DEBATE. Mr ItEEVES continued speaking on the Financial Statement. He regretted the Government did not bring down a more expansive system of public works, and also that they did not do more to develop the goldfields of tho colony. He regarded the Statement, however, as the best and most straightforward submitted to the House for years. The efforts of the Opposition could not prove to the contrary. The Hon. J. M'KENZIE congratulated tho late Minister for Lands on the very goodtempered tone of his speech last night, but when he admitted that he said all he could say as to that gentleman's remarks. Mr Richardson had taken up the Statement with tho evident intention of finding every possible fault with it, but the exhibition he (Mr Richardson) made of himself was very extraordinary, as ho made some huge blunders ; and he was not surprised at the reports they hoard about Mr Rolleston wishing to give up the leadership of the Opposition when so many embryo Colonial Treasurers were always ready to get up and address the House. He ft-lt sure Mr Richardson would not deny that he prophesied last year there would be a deficit this year, but none of his prophecies had been fulfilled. The hon. gentleman had blundered in the tables he laid before the House, which seemed to be compiled in order to mislead members. But apart from the absurdity of the compilation, Mr Richardson was wrong in almost every particular. — (The Hon. Mr Richardson: "Who wrote your speech?") Never mind who wrote it. He was prepared to explain that the figures were all wrong. Mr FISHER here called attention to tho standing order, which prevented hon. members from reading their speeches, but the Speaker ruled Mr M'Kenzie in order. i The Hon. J. M'KENZIE then referred to several of the figures quoted by Mr Richardson, and said Mr Ballance would go fully into the whole matter, but he could easily show that Mr Richardson had mixed up the liabilities of the public works fund and consolidated revenue, and had brought out a balance to suit himself. He explained at some length the item of L 62.000, which Mr Richardson had stated Mr Ballance had counted twice over, and quoted several paragraphs from the Financial Statement to prove that Mr Richardson's contentions were altogether incorrect. Mr SCOBIE MACKENZIE rose to ask whether it was permissible for an hon. member to read his speech, as it might not be his own remarks at all. The SPEAKER said it was not in order to read a speech, but extracts might be raad. The Hon. Mr SEDDON pointed out that Mr Hutchison did exactly the same thing when addressing the House recently. Mr FISHER said if the Speaker ruled the Minister for Lands was in order he presumed any other member would be in order to read his speech. The Hon. Mr BALLANCE pointed out that his colleague had full notes, and was commenting on them as he went on. Sir J. HALL said they should call a spade a spade. If ever there was a deliberate infraction of the standing orders the Minister for Lands was now pursuing that course. The Hon. W. P. REEVES said a similar occurrence took place in the House some years ago, when Sir J. Vogel had read out a considerable portion of his speech. Mr FISHER remembered that occurrence perfectly, and said Sir J. Vogel d'd not read his speech on that occasion, but he did read out several figures to the House The Hon. J. M'KENZIE submitted that Mr Richardson had quoted from full tables last night, and as it was impossible for him to recollect them all, he was replying to them. The SPEAKER ruled that, according to the

standing orders, a member was not in ordet in reading his speech, but he could comment on it without using tho exacb words of a written statement.

The Hon. J. M'KENZIE went on to say the Opposition had simply raised points of order so as to prevent him (Mr M'Kenzie) from exposing Mr Richardson's misstatements, and in order to allow those misstatements to be published in the papers all over the colony 24- hours before he (Mr M'Kenzie) could reply to them. He referred to Mr Richardsbn's statement questioning the saving the Government had made in their Estimate, but ho asserted that. the Government were perfectly correct in tho statements they made as to those savings. After giving in detail several figures in connection with the administration of the Lands department, and repl3'ing to some of the charges rnado against the department, he assorted that he had acted in the best interests of tho colony. He referred to the sale of cash land in Canterbury, and said Mr Richardson had received for the lasb year he was in office L 54.000 for cash land in Canterbury, against L 4030 which he (Mr M'Kenzie) received last year, and this year he received the magnificent sum of L 250 from the same source. He had bud 28,000 acres to dispose of in this way, and he could have received L 20.000 for them, but he cut them tip into small grazing runs, aud had pub eight settlers on them instead of selling the land in large areas for cash. He deprecated the action of tho Opposition in continually crying down the village settlements started by Mr Ballauce. Ho thought that was one of tho beat aebs his colleague had done in providing for poor people in this way. Mr Richardson had found faulfc with him for nob spending more money on roads, bub he found on comparing the expenditure on opening up land for sale for tho last three years that he (Mr M'Kenzie) had spent more on roads than Mr Richardson had done. He admibted he had nob spent enough for thafc purpose ; but he had had to curtail his expenditure, und if the House voted him the moneyhe would, be only too glad to spend it on roadmaking. Mr Richardson had accused him of having stated that he put 1741 settlers on tho land in one ye.ar, but he never made such a statement. What he said was that there were 1741 applicants for land under the small-farm association system. Whoever expected ho could put all these people on tho land in one year. He h:ul proclaimed 200,000 acres under this system, which ho was empowered to do under the law, and if the House in its wisdom passed tho Land Bill those people could gel titles tothe land. Ho denied ho had done anything in this matter illegally. All ho had done had been by tho advice of the Crown law officers. 1I& defended his special regulations for laud settlement, and said they were working so satisfactorily that he could not supply tho people rapidly enough who wanted to take up land under (hern. Ho agreed with Mr Duthie bhafc settlement was not progressing so satisfactorily as might be wished, but that was not his fault, as it could not . bo expected that settlerscould in one year burn the bush, sow it with grass and stock it. He quoted largely from figures respecting land settlement, and said that the land ot the colony had for several years past been mopped up by banks, companies, and speculators, to the detriment of genuine settlement. Ho expressed the opinion, that more crimes and abuses had taken place under tho freehold system in Scotland than any other, and ono groat advantage of the leasehold" system under the regulations of tho present Government was that leaseholders would get the full value of their improvements. He asked whether Mr Rolleston believed in the policy of the gentlemen with whom he was working — with tho policy of the member for Tuapeka, for instance, who Jpublicly declared that the would like' to see every acre of land in he colony out of the hands of the Government. Several- Oppositionists had referred to the travelling expenses of the Government, and he was not going to shirk that subject. (Mr Fisher : " Why don't you put the return on the table ? ") All necessary information had been put on the table, and all the money he had recoived for travelling expenses had gone through his bank-book. He had travelled a great deal through the country and wherever he went the people were very glad to see him, but ever since he took office he had never spent a single day on his own farm, and had ofben travelled the whole night in order to economise time. Ho was quite willing to take his share of travelling oxpeuses, but he found ifc absolutely necessary to travel in order to make himself acquainted with the wants of the colony. Referring to the speech of the member for Clutha, he said it was very amusing, and contained a good deal of information. He referred at length to the Balclutha banquet during the recess, and said he had done so in order to give Jtbe House a correct account of what took place at that gathering. The mo saber for Clutha had stated that two valuers under the land and income tax had told him they had received instructions to raise the valuations of certain properties, bub he thought that hon. gentleman should give the names of those two valuers, as he felt sure no such instructions had been given. The member for Mount Ida had accused the Government of pandering to public opinion, but no man pandered to public opinion more than that hon, gentleman. He had come into the House in 1884 as a strong supporter of Sir J. Vogel, but gave him the cold shoulder in 1885, and finally withdrew his support of Sir J. Vogol's Government. He then supported Sir H. Atkinson, whom he in turn also attacked, and referred to him on one occasion as a purely professional politician. He should like to ask what slr Scobio Mackenzie had done in the House for these eight years. Why, he was the author of the Mackenzie clause in the Land Bill (which ho would hereafter be greatly censured for), and he had passed the Dunedin Drillshed Reserve Bill. The member for Mount Ida had stated that he (Mr John M'Kenzie) was afraid of a dissolution, bub ho would toll that hon. gentleman that whether a dissolution took place this year or next year he would fight him (Mr Scobie Mackenzie) in the new district of Waihemo, and he was nob afraid of the result. He concluded his remarks by saying that he quite agreed with Mr Ballance in slating that the policy of the present Government was one of self-reliance. The Government meant to pursue that policy.

Mr FISHER said the Minister for Lands, if he were so desirous of replying to Mr Richardson's statements, could have done so _ early in the afternoon withoub waiting till so late in the evening. Tho Minister had made the usual appeal to the poor working man, but he (Mr Fisher) only wished the poor working men could have heard Mr M'Kenzie's speech

When be was in Opposition as to agitators ■amongst the poor working men *b.o had done such injury to the colony during the" late strikes. He referred to the remark made during the debate by the Minister for Education, to the effect that he (Mr Fisher) was kicked out of the Atkinson Government, but he now wished publicly to state that up to the day of his leaving the Cabinet Sir H. Atkinson and he had not had one word of difference, although it was quite true that after he left the Cabinet some unfortunate differences arose between them. Up to the date of Sir Harry's death, however, he (Mr Fisher) and the lato Premier were on the best of terms. After referring to the late strike at some length, he said the Minister for Education had told him (Mr Fisher) that afternoon that he knew nothing of Canterbury, but he wished to tell that hon. gentleman that he was concerned in the strike of the Lyttelcon Times office several years ago, and that the proprietors of that paper had done their best to prevent " that man Fisher" from getting any employment in Canterbury. His (Mr Fisher's) opinion was that the present Minister for Education was at that time the aristocrat, and the present leader of the Opposition was the Liberal. Mr Rolleston had, indeed, all along been a most consistent administrator of the land laws oi the colony. He was author of the land laws which the present Minister for Lands was administering, and he could not for the life of him understand how anybody could call Mr Rollestou a Tory. Mr W. P. Reeves had told them that afternoon that Mr John Holmes, of Christchurch (who was well known as a real Liberal) was not in touch with the Liberal party as at present constituted. Neither was he (Mr Fisher). In fact there were some gentlemen on the Ministerial benches whom ho could not possibly support. The Minister for Lands had declaimed just now that the Government would not play into tho hands of the banks ; but he (Mr Fisher) asserted that the present Government were the men who did play into the hands of the banks, and he had challenged tho Premier last session as to why he had exempted banks from the mortgage tax in the Land and Income Tax Bill. Referring to some of the statements made in the debate on the taxation question, he pointed out that the Stout -Vogel Government had -compulsorily put 2d per lb on tea, and had also put on a heavy tax on the commonest drapery and boots worn by working men. He strongly condemned the action of the Government in appointing two extra Ministers to tho Cabinet, and said it was an unfar exercise of political power to increase their number to such an extent as to give the Government a preponderance of influence in the House, especially after the House had been so greatly reduced in number. He referred at considerable length to Mr M'Lean's charge against the Hall Government of having given 210,000 acres of land to the Wellington-Manawatu Railway Company, and giving away L 150.000 of the people's money. After detailing the circumstances that led to the formation of that company he denied that Mr M'Lean's statement was correct,*and said all the company received was 19 per cent, of the area they were entitled to according to law ; and perhaps Mr M'Lean would be surprised to hear that the company were yet entitled to receive 11 per cent, of the area. They were entitled to it, and it was a poor reward for the energy and enterprise of the directors of this company, who had made Wellington the commercial centre of the colony, to be held up to ridicule in the House for party purposes, especially by men who, owing to their recent arrival in Wellington, were not at all aware of the facts of the case. He strongly condemned the Bystem of espionage which he asserted prevailed in all ranks of the civil service at pre- , sent, and said be knew of no less than 50 men who had been promised billets at the late Wellington election. Respecting the appointment of members of the Legislative Council, as he had previously stated, the Government were using this as a stalking horse for the purpose of deceiving the people of the colony. The Government should have followed the ordinary constitutional course and resigned when the Governor refused their advice to appoint additional members to the Council. He next referred to the co-operative system, and said it was established not for the benefit of the working man, but to establish political communities which might be shifted from place to place under the one month's residence clause which the Government had put in thoir Electoral Bill. The Government professed to' practise severe economy, but he held there .. was no economy at all, and said the increased cost to the State since they took offico was L 135,000 per aunum. After referring to the conversion operations at some length, and tothe Government Insurance department, he said the Government was a borrowing Government, aud they intended to borrow to the extent of a million and a-quartcr. He also asserted that they were more extravagant than- the late * Government. Their co-operative system was also not to tho advantage of the working man, and whilst the colony was losing tho best of their working men they were getting instead a very undesirable class of people from the other colonies. The policy of the Government was fallacious, unstable, and unreliable in every respect. He predicted that when the Government left office they would leave a deficit of at least half a million. Their party had already left a deficit of a million iv 1879, half a million in 1887, and - they could not fail to have another large deficiency when their time came for giving up possession of the Government benches.

Mr PINKERTON moved the adjournment of the debate. — Agreed to. The House rose at 12.40 a.m. THE OTAGO CENTRAL RAILWAY.

Tho Otago members of both branches of the Legislature met to-day to consider the question of urging the more rapid prosecution of the Obago Central railway. The Hon. T. Fergus presided. The Hon. Downie Stewart moved that Messrs Fergus aud Fish form a committee to arrange for a deputation to interview tho Premier and tho Minister for Public Works relative to the extension of the Otago Central line. Mr Valentino seconded the motion, which was agreed to. Mr Fish moved—" That the basis upon which those present demand the prosecution of the line should ba on the lines proposed by Sir H. Atkinson in 1889." This was seconded by Mr Pinkerton, and agreed to. Mt-ssrs Fergus aud Fish subsequently waited on the Premier and 'arranged that the interview should takefplace on Saturday next. The basis proposed is that mentioned in my former telegrams on the subject — viz., the allocation of 25 per cent, of the locally derived territorial revenue toward the prosecution of the railway ; that is to «-ay, L 15,000 out of the total L 60.000. The suggestion is that this should be capitalised for the purpose. So far Ministers are understood to be antagonistic to the proposal.

NEWSPAPER POSTAGE.

Arrangements have been made by the Hon. J. G. Ward, Postmaster-general, that lha old rate of newspaper postage of Id per paper

shall be reverted to. This has been agreed to by the Imperial Government, and will be carried into effect by an Order-in-Council next week. PROPERTY LAW CONSOLIDATION BILL. A deputation, comprising Messrs Meredith, Tanner, and Shera, interviewed the Premier, this morning and presented to him a request** signed by 19 members of the House asking him to give facilities for the discussion of the Property Law Consolidation Bill, or that it should be taken up as a Government measure. This bill proposes to confine the mortgagee to the real security upon which he has lent his money. The Premier replied that he would facilitate the discussion of the measure, and would consult the law officers of the Crown as to whether it could be taken up as a Government measure. LOCAL INDUSTRIES COMMITTEE. At a meeting of tho Local Industries Committee to-day, Mr Holmes, general manager of the Bank of New Zealand, was a witness when he gave an account of his recent tests at the Ouehunga ironworks. He stated that in his opinion the Parapara ore at Collingwood gave better results than those of the ironsand. Mr Smith believed that the proprietors of the Onehunga works wished to give an opportunity for more exhaustive experiments with the Taranaki ironsand. Colonel Hume also gave evidence in favour of the cartridges manufactured by the Colonial Ammunition Company. JOTTINGS. Mr J. Mills is going to ask the Government if they will place on tho Supplementery Estimates a sum of money for the repair of the road from the Seacliff railway station to the Main North road leading past Seacliff Asylum. As tho latter property belongs to the Government it does not contribute to the rates of tho county council. John Campbell, lato of New Zealand, now involuntarily of Woonona, New South Wales, petitions the House for a select committee to inquire into the circumstances set out as follows :—": — " The Otago Government in 1874 called for tenders for 37 miles of railway, tenders to close on the 27th March. On account of the absence of a contractor with whom a member of the executive was iv partnership, the time for receiving tenders was extended to 3rd April. The .petitioner and his partner, Norman Campbell, made the requisite deposit of 10 per cent., But tho successful tenderers, Proudfoot and Co., did not do so. Still, though their tender was L 24-24 more than that of petitioners, it was accepted, to petitioner's considerable damage, for which he claims compensation." PORT CHALMERS RAILWAY WHARF. A deputation consisting of Messrs James Mills, Allen, Mitchelson, Fish, Fergus, Pinkerton, Carncross, and Valentine, waited on the Premier to press upon him the necessity of placing a sum of L6OOO on the Estimates to extend the railway wharf at Port Chalmers so as to admit large cargo steamers to come alongside. The Premier promised to consult the Railway Commissioners on the subject. THURSDAY, JULY 28. LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. In the Legislative Council to-day several members condemned the action of the Premier in signing the congratulatory telegram to Mr Gladstone in his official capacity. The Wellington Sanitation Loan Bill and the Land Transfer Bill were considered in committee, the former being reported with amendments. LAND TRANSFKR. The Land Transfer Act Amendment Bill was further considered in committee. Clause 14-, relating to a trespass action being brought bef.'ru :i resident magistrate, and upon which progrcs - had been reported on the previous day, was »g «in postponed. Clause 15, refer, ing to registration of deeds, was struck out by 14 to 5. The Hon. Sir P. A. BUCKLEY said as the rejected clause really affected the policy of the bill he moved that progress be reported, with leave to sit again, in order to enable him to consider tho position of the bill. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. In the House of Representatives to-day the message congratulating Mr Gladstone was also discussed for some time, after which the Ocean Beach Public Domain Bill and four other local bills were read a second time. In the evening the financial debate was resumed after some discussion about the action of the Minister for Lands in not laying on th« table, as he stated he would, the figures which he had quoted on the previous evening. REPLIES TO QUESTIONS. Replying to Mr E. M. Smith, whether the Government will place an oil painted portrait or tablet in the Parliamentary Buildings of the late Sir Harry Atkinson as a mark of ebtccm and in part recognition of his long, faithful, and valuable services rendered to the colony as a pioneer settler, a bravo colonial soldier, and an able New Zealand statesman, The Hon. Mr BALLANCE said if any tablet or memorial were presented the Government would be very happy to find a place for it in the precincts of the Parliamentary Buildings. Replying to Mr Houston, The Hon. R. J. SEDDON said the Government proposed to place a sum of money on the Estimates to encourage prospecting generally, but he thought it would not be wise to allocate money to any particular district. E.ich case would be dealt with on its merits. ROADS ON PRIVATE LANDS. This afternoon Mr R. Thompson asked the Minister for Lands if the Government would during the present session introduce a bill for the purpose of simplifying the present mode of taking roads through private property. He said that it was a well-known fact 'that very great difficulty was experienced by local bodies in making roads through private property, and as the law stood the process was expensive and cumbersome. The Hon. J. M'Kenzie replied that he had considered this subject very carefully, and in the Land Bill had gone as far as he thought he could reasonably go by providing in section 13 of that measure that the Governor-in-Council might proclaim a road when the owner of the land did not object. Of course if an objection was made by the owner the work could not be done. THE FINANCIAL DEBATE. Messrs Pinkerton, Mitchelson, and Meredith carried on the debate on the Financial Statement to-day. Mr Pinfeerton made an excellent party speech and deepened the "favourable impression hitherto created of his capacity. Mr Mitchelson followed with the ablest speech he has ever made in the House. Mr Merodith came on at 11.45 and wound up the debate for the night. It is almost certain now that it will run into next week. JOTTINGS. A return laid on the table to-day gives the net public debt of the colony on the 31st March last as L 37,675,206. Mr Seddon intends to bring down the Kaitangata Relief Fund Bill, which proposes to transfer that fund to the Public Trustee, who will hold it for the purpose of the trust. Two new bills are announced to-day by M

Seddon, viz., the Mount Ida Water Trust Bill and the Kaitangata Relief Fund Bill. At present there are 73 bills before the House in various stages, and up to date 239 petitions have been presented and 124 papers laid on the table. A deputation headed by Mr Buchanan, M.H.R., interviewed the Railway Commissioners to-day to ask that the railway charges on stallions and brood mares during the breeding season should be reduced, with a view of encouraging an improvement in the breed of horses. After Borne discussion the interview was adjourned to allow a member of the deputation who was unavoidably absent to express his views. The Government rail ways show an increase of L 20.000 in the net revenue of the Juno quarter as compared with last year. FRIDAY, JULY 29. LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. In the Legislative Council to - day the Statutes Revision Committee reported adversely on the Testamentary Trusts Restriction Bill. A motion was carried to remove to Supreme Court offices in the chief centres the wills proved, and other documents of importance, in district courts. BILLS. The Waikouaiti Reserves Bill was read a first time. The Wanganui Hospital Board Vesting Bill and Palmerston North Courthouse Site Sale Bill passed the final stages. The Wellington Sanitation Loan Bill was read a third time and passed. The Couucil adjourned till Tuesday next. HOUSE OF REPRESENSATIVES. The House met at 2.30. WESLEYAN METHODIST BILL. The Hon. J. BALLANCE moved— •' That the report of the committee on ' The Wesleyan Methodist Church Property Trußt Act 1887' Amendment Bill be agreed to." Mr SANDFORD moved an amendment to the effect that no Wesleyan minister should be allowed to remain in any district more than five years. A lengthy discussion ensued, in which several members took part, after which Mr Sandford's amendment was lost by 32 to 30. The following is the division list : — Ayes (30). — Messrs Allen, Blake, Carncross, CarrolL Duncan, Ewnshaw, Fraser, Guinness, Hall, Hamlin, Hutchison, Joyce, Kapa, Lawry, Lake, T. Mackenzie, Meredith, O'Conor, Palmer, Flees, Rhodes, Rolleston, Seddon, Shera, B. M. Smith. Swan, Tanner, R. Thompson, T. Thompson, Wilson. Noes (32).— Messrs Ballance, Bruce, Buckland, Buick, Duthie, Fergus,' Fish, Fisher, Hall- Jones, Harkness, Hogg, Houston, W. Hutchison, J. Kelly, Scobie Mackenzie, Mackintosh, J. M'Kenzie, M'Lean, C. H. Mills, J. Mills, Mitchelson, Moore, Newman, Parata, Pinkerton, Russell. Shera, W. C. Smith, Taipua, Taylor, Valentine, Ward. Paiks.— Ayes : Messrs Dawson and W. Kelly, Messrs Wright and Buchanan. Mr Ballance's motion that the report of the Select Committee be agreed to was carried by 46 to 15. GOVERNMENT BUSINESS. The Hon. J. BALLANCE moved—" That for the remainder of the session Government business shall take precedence on Wednesdays." He said the Government would give every facility to private members for getting their bills discussed by devoting an afternoon for the purpose, and if necessary they would afford other opportunities. After some discussion the motion was agreed to. FINANCIAL DEBATE. Messrs E. M. Smith, Bruce, Rees, J. Mills, and J. Kelly continued the financial debate to-day. Mr Smith quoted some verses of his own composition, and his,two-hours' speech was so florid as to excite a good deal of amusement. Mr Bruce followed with a splendid speech, the finest yet "heard in the Hou.se this session. He was loudly applauded by both sides, and spoke just an hour. Mr Rees came next, and Bpoke well ; as did Mr J. Mills, who also was commendably brief. Mr J. Kelly followed on shortly after midnight, and the debate was adjourned. Mr BRUCE said all parties in the House would, he felt sure, regret the cause which brought him back to the House. He should not refer to the eminent services rendered by Mr "Macarthur, the late member for Rangitikei, but he thought all would unite in saying "Peace to his ashes and honour to his memory." He had fought the recent contest at Rangitikei as a pronounced opponent of the present Government, but still he would not offer them blind, unreasoning hostility or factious opposition. His chief reason for opposing them was that they were placing an undue share of the taxation of the colony on the country districts, and that was bound to injure the whole colony It had been said that tbo property tax bad been abolished. It was abolished on everything else but land and on money advanced on land. The property tax, it had been said, clogged the •whcols of industry, but it had never been objected to by the lauded industry as clogging the wheels of that industry. He held that land was very unfairly dealt with by the new taxation. The Premier said we could have no finality iv taxation, yet Mr Seddon had said we must have finality or the effect would be disastrous. Here was an important divergence between two Ministers. Mr Ballance had further stated publicly that if the present taxation was not enough he should have to give auother turn to the screw. The Premier was strongly in favour of bursting up large estates, and he believed if they were burst up to-morrow they could not be secured on more advantageous terms than hundreds of properties that were now iv the market. He did not believe large estates were such a great evil, as their owners were after all merely the medium of distribution. At the same time he was not an advocate of large estates, believing that the more widely distributed the landed estates of the country were the better it would be for the colony. He emphatically denied that he was in favour of low wages for working men, and he had the greatest consideration for the workers of the colony. The wages question was one that was regulated by economics, but he utterly repudiated the assertion more than once made against him, that he advocated working men being paid only 5s or 6s per day. Referring to the cooperative system, he pointed out that scheduling work afc unduly high prices would destroy the self-reliance of the men employed. The policy of the Government he considered would lead to the departure of capital and cause an undue influx of labour. If it wore not for the iinpecuaiosity of the working men in the other colonies New Zealand wouKl soon be flooded with labour, owing to the attraction offered by the Government in this co-operative system. It was well known, indeed, that plenty of men had left employment in farm districts in order to join the unemployed on the West Coast. He had no doubt in his own mind that capital had been withdrawn from the colony, and he was sure that the Government policy had a deterrent effect op the influx of capital. The Premier in his Financial Statement admitted that finance companies had been making a noise ; • and what was the logical sequeuce of that alarm but fright ? So that the Premier himself was evidently aware that

capital was leaving the colony. He (Mr Bruce) Had stated during his election that several civil servants who had grown grey in the service had been displaced by the Government and their places filled by their own supporters, and after listening to the present debate he was afraid there was a good deal of truth in that statement. He objected strongly to the vicious principle of the spoils to the victor that prevailed in America, and hoped it would not be established in this colony. The withdrawal of subsidies from local bodies was another instance of the policy of the Government being injurious to country settlers. He believed the country was thoroughly prosperous, but any prosperity the colony had to-day was in consequence of its natural resources, and not owing to the policy of the Government. His principal objections to the Government were because they advocated land nationalisation as opposed to the freehold tenure of the soil. They were also Protectionists, which would unduly press on the poorer classes ef the oolony and hamper country industries. Their policy also tended to deprive the people of tho colony of their self-reliance. It would deprive one section of motive and another of effect. Their policy was, further, one of covert borrowing, and it would take from the people that self-reliance which had enabled Englishmen to force their way into every quarter of the globe. Mr REES congratulated the House on Mr Bruce'B: accession to it, and he thought they would all admit that the late Mr Macarthur's mantle had fallen on very worthy shoulders. While saying that, however, he differed from Mr Bruce on nearly all the cardinal points of policy he had touched on. He had told them, fW instance, that owners of large estates were merely the medium of distribution, -but who would not be a medium of distribution under such circumstances with L 20.000 or L 30,000 a year ? His opinion was that such men were living, on the labour and toil of others. He combated several other statements made by Mr Bruce, and asked whether thoy were not to make any progress from the state of things which formerly prevailed. Ho held it was to the credit of tho Government that they wore endeavouring to provide a remedy. There were now in the House two distinct parties, brought into existence at the last general election ; but the principles of those parties had been in antagonism from the first day people landed in New Zealand. He referred at considerable leugth to the framing of the New Zealand Constitution, and said but for Sir G. Grey's action at that time the colony would not have had a parliament for 100 years. After tracing the political history of the Continuous Ministry, which he alleged had endeavoured to prevent the colony getting a constitution, he referred to the coalition between Sir R. Stout; and Sir J. Vogel in 1884- . Ho said that was a most fatal act ;. there could be no coalition between two distinct parties ; and at the next general election people spoke out and said they would not have any coalition, in proof of which the Premier was defeated at Dunedin and the Minister for Justice in Auckland. He referred to the defeat of the late Government and the formation of the present one, and criticised severely many administrative acts of the late Government, especially the appointing of a judge of the Supreme Court without salary, in appointing seven gentlemen to the Upper House when they did not possess a majority, aud the appointment of 155 justices in one day, and their mismanagement of the Natives. He contrasted that state of things with the policy of the present Government. That policy had yet to be carried into effect, and if it were found that it was oppressive, unworkable, or unduly placed burdens on any portion of the community no doubt means would be taken to remedy it. He said great dissatisfaction existed in several parts of the colony that many strong supporters of the Liberal party were passed over for avowed opponents of the Government when appointments were made to the civil service, and not only so, but men who were in every way inferior were appointed. That being the case it was absurd for the member for Mount Xda to say no appointments were made unless people were of the right colour. Mr Bruce had referred to the graduated tax as oppressive, but all modern economists had agreed that a graduated tax was perfectly just and fair. The Ministry was on its trial before tho country, and by its principles it must stand or fall. It behoved them, therefore, to use every effort to assimilate labour and capital in such a way as to benefit the whole community, and that being so what better plan could they adopt than the co-operative system introduced by the Government? He advised the Government not to be swayed by any considerations either for members of their own party or their opponents, and to follow out the course they had marked out for themselves. If thoy did so tl^ey would earn tho confidence of generations yet to come. AN IMPORTANT REPORT. A most important report was presented to tho Legislative Council to-day from the Statutes Revision Committee upon the Testamentary Trusts Restriction Bill. It is as follows: — "The committee are unable to approve of tho bill for tho following reasons :— (1) That the bill is retrospective in its operation. That the bill proposes to interfere with the discretion which a testator possesses in the disposal of his property. (3) That a testator knowing the special circumstances of his family as well as the character of the members thereof, and probable value of his assets, is in a better position than anyone else to decide how his estate should be best administered, and when it should be divided. (4) The bill contemplates realisation at the instance of a child coming of age of all the real aud personal property of the testator. This exercise of power might prove disastrous to the estate by forcing the sale of whole real and personal estate at an inopportune time, and although there were funds sufficient to pay the share of such child, such sale might be quite unnecessary and also inimical to the interest of the other beneficiaries, even to the extent of breaking up the home of a family without any reason whatever. (5) Th*t if tho share or shares of one or more of the beneficiaries in the capital sum were withdrawn, the income from the residue might, and would iv many cases, prove altogether insufficient to support, educate, and maintain th«i children under age, and thus defeat the objects of the testator. (6) That the bill provides that the income of persons under age shall accumulate in the hands of the public trustee, and thus a serious injustice would be done to them while under age. (7) That the effect of the bill, if acted on, would be to displace the trustees chosen by the testator, and whose judgment he had full confidence, and to to place the estate in the hands of the public trustee, in whom he might not have equal confidence. (8) That the income arising from an estate under arrangement of testator's trustees might be sufficient to maintain and educate hischildren, but if placed in the hands of the public trustee might prove, when reduced to 10 per cent, per unnum, quite insufficient for such purpose. (9) That the Public Trust Office was only intended for those who voluntarily chose the public trusteeor who died intestate. (10) That no facts have been brought before your committee to justify interference in the manner proposed by the

bill witti the power and discretion of a testator. (11) That in most wills, especially where the assets are of much value, testators make provisions giving their trustees power to advance any part or parts of the expectant share of their children up to the extent of a half thereof. (12) That if any case of hardship or injustice can be shown to exist under the present law the committee are prepared. to Favourab)y consider such an amendment of the law as will meet such cases. — R. Oliver, chairman." JOTTINGS. The committee's report oa the Testamentary Trusts Restriction Bill is regarded as having completely killed that measnre, whereat there is rejoicing. There were expended on medicines and medical assistance for the Nativea durin« the year in the North Island L 896 7s 6d, and in the South Island LI9Q Is Id. Though it is likely that thsre will bo a discussion when the Estimates are before the House regarding the representation of this colony at the Chicago Exhibition, the Government have resolved not to do anything in the matter. They recognise that it would require about L 25.000 to have proper represoutatiou, and do not feel themselves warranted in taking action. From the vote of L5OO on the Estimates last year any expenses already incurred will be paid. The amendments made by the Legislative Council in the Oyster Fisheries Bill were agreed to by the House to-day. One "is a formal alteration, and the other is a new paragraph providing that a person shall not be deemed guilty of an offence for consigning for sale any oysters within the first 14 days of any close season if he satisfies the court that the oysters were actually taken before tho commencement of tho close seasoa. There was very nearly great disorder last night in tho House through an eifort on the part of Mr G. Hutchison to have placed on the table a paper from which tho Minister for Lands quoted in his speech in the" financial debate, and members say that unless the Speaker is firm there will bo a scone before the end of tho session. A petition was presented to-day embodying a resolution passed at the Maori meeting at Maiputu that the Government should notj make laws dealing with Native lands, and that the sittings of the Native Lands Court iv the North Island should entirely cease for the present. The expenditure upon Native schools for 1891 was L15.25L Is lid, and for salaries to teachers, with allowances for removals and other purposes, there was paid L 11.024 13s 6d. The number on the roll of village Native schools is 2231, of which halfcastos are 239, Maoris 1589, and Europeans 403. The annual report upon Native schools was laid upon the table to-day by tho Minister for Education. It shows that at the village schools the average attendance for the year was 1837, while at the four boarding schools there were 74 pupils introduced by the department besides 120 who might be regarded as foundation Scholars.' For the last quarter the attendance at the village schools was 1703, or 933 boys and 765 girls. In the discussion of the Wesleyan Methodist* Church Bill to-day Mr Jackson Palmer made an extraordinary profession of his religions views, first submitting the singular proposition that a man-was guided in his religion according to the church in the village in which he lived. He went on to say : " I was once a Wesleyan, then I became a Presbyterian. I was couflrmed in the Church of England, sir. In another place I joined the Roman Catholics for a considerable time. Then, sir, I uned to attend the meetings of the Christadelphians and Calathumpians." This extreme versatility astonished even the House of Representatives. Mr Mitchelson is urging the Government to bring in a bill to regulate the use of the totalisator and to prevent the abuses to which it is now being subject. SATURDAY, JULY SO. THE TAXATION AMENDMENTS. The bill amending the Land and Income Tax Act will probably be brought down by the Premier at the end of the week. In addition to the concessions which will be given'to debentureholders, the measure will contain some provisious in regard to partnership firms, giving a higher exemption than L3OO in a case where there are partners engaged in .one business. The other provisions of the bill will be chiefly technical amendments of tho act passed last year. , THE CIVIL SERVICE BILL. Thero was a rumour that the Government did not intend to proceed with this' bill, but the Premier tolls mo that that statement is without foundation. The bill will be carried forward and passed into law if it be possible to do so before the session ends. Mr Ballance says that the civil service generally arc in favour of the msasure, the chief feature of which is the pro-

posal for an insurance scheme. The labour peoplo are opposeil to it, because it does not include under its provisions all workers in the public seivice — such as railway employes, police, and so on. The Government, however, will be prepared to hear suggestions for the benefit of the bill, and make modifications and amendments if they can, so that it may be as satisfactory as possible. JOTTINGS. The question whether insurance companies shall be allowed to give security instead of cash under the proposal for a deposit in the Public Trust Office will be considered by the Cabinet before the bill ou the subject is brought down. Mr Ballauce says that the colony cannot afford the L 25,000 required for the Chicago Exhibition. Mr Jackson Palmer has introduced a bill to amend the law of divorce. The bill proposes that divorce may be granted on the following grounds : — 1. Th-it respondent is incurably insane, and has been in an asylum for three years continuously immediately before the presentation of the petition. 2. Desertion without sufficient cause for seven years continuously. 3. Having lived separately for seven 3'ears uuder a deed of separation. 4. Imprisonment for seven years. 5. Adultery without cruelty. It is also provided by the bill th-it the court can suspend the decree or dismiss the plea if the petitioner's conduct was the cause of the application for divorce. Power is given to the court to forbid the publication of evidence, and neither party can marry again until three months have elapsed. "The financial debate has descended to a personal wrangle, but no member of my party has indulged or will indulge in personalities." — Mr Richard Reeves, at the opening of his speech. •• The leader of the Opposition reminds me of a dyspeptic rooster, pecking here and there?" — Mr Richard Reeves five minutes later. " The member for Clutha should browse on his natural food, the thistle."— Mr Richard Reeves, later still. — Post. MONDAY, AUGUST 1. THE OTAGO CENTRAL RAILWAY. The deputation to the Premier and Minister for Public Works on Saturday on the subject of the Otago Central railway was short and businesslike ; but there was some slight difference of opinion, not as to the object ia view — which was to get as much of the railway as possible — but as to the mothod ot procedure. Mr Fergus talked about Lake Hawea as the terminus. Mr Fish was for the, rejected bill of 1889, to construct the line t<> Eweburn by borrowing on the security of the run rents, as proposed by the late Sir 11. Atkinson. Mr Scobie Mackenzie considered the line should bo completed at once to Hyde (the formation being largely made to within a few miles of that place), and opened for traffic there while it was being carried on to Ewebuxn, uiid that from Eweburn it should be taken onwards as the financial position of the colony would permit. In other words, Mr Fergus was for grappling with the whole original scheme in the beliol that the rents along the line would increase with the expenditure ; while Mr Mackenzie would concentrate every effort to get the line to the plain so that it could bo of immediate use ; and then proceed tentatively as money permitted. His object was to avoid rousing the cupidity of the rest of the colony, and pluuging into a big borrowing scheme just as the colony was beginning to recover itself. I think that this latter view will commend itself to tho House. I lind that already many northern members are determined that they shall get penny for penny for everything the southerners get. Tho same feeling is prevalent in other poitions of the colony. In short, it is pritty well recognised that a big scheme means a big loan, and that the backs of all the other momhei h would be up. 1 hear that Mrßolleston and others think the agitation is scarcely calculated to help either the paity or the' colony at the present time. Mr Seddon said it would take L 50.000 to complete the line to Hyde, and L 150,000 more to take it to Eweburn, and as there is only a problematical L 200 ,000 to construct public works of all kinds for the whole colony many think Otago would do well to get the iine constructed and opened at once to Hyde. Eweburn would then be tho next move. Upon what seems good authority, I hoar that the Government will probably refuse to grant the rcpii Ft of the. Otago deputation for the allccatioi t.f 1i15,0C0 annually from the local land ik\<!> 3 touatils the prosecution of the Olago (V.i i,ul railway ; but they will offer to place' L 0 [}j0 ou Ibis year's Public Works EstimuUs for this work, and that this will mosb likely be accepted by Otago members as an instalment for the present year. TUESDAY, AUGUST 2. The Legislative Council met at 2.30. TESTAMENTARY TRUSTS. The Hon. Sir P. A. BUCKLEY, in moving the committal of the Testamentary Trusts Restriction Bill, said he had prepared a number of amendments which, he thought, would have the effect of meeting the objections urged by the Statutes Revision Committee, and he hoped the bill would now be committed. The Hon. Dr POLLEN regretted that illness had prevented him from being present in the Council when the bill was read a second time, for he should have opposed the motion. The bill did not represent the feeliugs of the people of the colony upon this question. He quite concurred with the finding of the Statutes Revision Committee. The bill dealt in dynamite for the bursting up of estates by the maubais svjet of a family. It was not, he thought, worth while for the State to burst up, or to attempt to destroy, the homes of families, which he believed would be the effect of the bill. Homes which many loving heads of families had spent their lives in making for their dear little ones would be broken up in order to supply the prodigal of the family with means which, when dissipated, would be the signal for his again consorting with the swine and participating once more with them in their husks. The Colonial Secretary only a day or two ago declared himself to be a Home Ruler to the backbone, and yet here h? came down and endeavoured to strike a deadly blow at the very heart of true home rule. He believed that if the bill were passed it would send elder daughters interested in an estate to swell the ranks of the Tailoresses' Unions, whilst the younger children would become recipients of charity from benevolent societies. He moved as an amendment that the report of the Statutes Revision Committee be adopted. The Hon. W. D. STEWART referred to the Code Napoleon and the law of succession of the State of Louisiana, wh'ch made it compulsory upon the father of a family to leave his property in equal proportions to his children, and prevented him from using caprice in the matter. He also quoted a number of authorities with a view to show that a man having a family should be encouraged to leave an equitable -will ;n favour of all his immediate survivors. He objected to estates being broken up immediately upon the d<_ath of the head of a fismi'y, merely to benefit the oii'ir children at th» v ■ :ipense of the helpless younger members ( f tho family. He regretted this bill had ever Leeu

seriously considered by the present Government, as he believed it was a measure which would create a widespread feeling of insecurity amongst persons who were striving to assist their families. He should support the amendment of Dr Pollen. The Hon. Mr OLIVER supported the amendment, and poiuted out bhat the father of a family was the best judge as to how his property should be loft. It might be the elder son was not fib to bo entrusted with uncontrolled wealth ; and again, it mighb be that the younger branches might not be educated ; or, again, the time might not be opportune in which to dispose of the property. He believed that if the Council passed retrospective measures they would be doing a wrong. The motion of the Colonial Secretary — thnt the bill be committed — was lost by 12 to 5. The following is the division list : — Ayes. — Messrs Buckley, Dignau, Walker, Wahawaha, Whitmore. Noks. — Messrs Barnicoat, Grace, Holmes, Johnston, M'Lean, Oliver, Pollen, Reynolds, Scotland, Stewart, Swanson, Williams. The bill was thus virtually lost. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. In the House of Representatives the Wesleyau Methodist Church Property Apt Amendment Bill was passed, after considerable discussion on the question of limiting the term of ministers in any one district to five years. The rest of the afternoon sitting was taken up in replying to questions. In the evening the fiuancial debate was resumed, Messrs Buckland, Mackintosh, and Valentine taking p-irt. ItEPLIES TO QUESTIONS. Replying to Mr Joyce, The Hon. R. J. SEDDON said it was correct that the torpedo boats at Port Chalmers and Lyttelton had been dismantled and brought to Wellington, but until th? Government received the general report of the commandant it was not the intention of the Government to act upon auy suggestion that had been made. Replying to Mr Mitchelson, Tho Hon. Mr BALLANCE said the Government had not sufficient information at their disposal to bring _in a bill to regulate the use of the totalisatorj but he thought the matter rested with metropolitan clubs. Hej.lyiug to Mr Mitchelson, The Hon. Mr BALLANCE said if metropolitan clubs framed regulations for conducting the use of the totalisator, the Government would be prepared to give any recommendations they made every consideration. Tho House rose at 5.30. BIBLE IN SCHOOLS. • To-day a meeting was held of members of both Houses who wore in favour of Biblo reading in State schools, wibh a conscience clause. The Hon. J. Barnicoat presided, and a resolution was unanimously carried that the Hon. Downie Stewart be requested to introduce in the Legislative --Council a bill embodying the views of the meeting. Mr Stewart consented to do so, and gave notice in the Council to-day that he would move to introduce a bill tomorrow. JOTTINGS. Another fund is to be " scooped up " by the Public Trust Office, if Mr Seddon has his own way. He purposes that the trustees of the Kaitangata relief fund shall be discharged, and that the fund shall be vested in the Public Trustee as a general mining accident fund. The bill introduced to effect this change provides, further, that the sums allotted to the prt-Sient beneficiaries shall still be paid, bub that the residue of tho fund shall accumulate at compound interest for the relief of widows, orphans, and dependents of miners who may be killed in mining accidents in the colony, or for the relief of miners permanently disabled by mining accidents. Mr Jackson Palmer presented a petition to-day for the patentee and manufacturer of Hitchens' blood restorer, carrying on business at Auckland, asking for a reward for curing a Chinaman of leprosy. Sir G. Grey arrived late to-night, and was very cordially received by members on both sides. Tho Local Bills Committee to-day reported that the Otago Harbour Board Empowering Bill should be allowed to proceed without amendment. A similar recommendation was made respecting the Kaitaugata Relief Fund Transfer Bill and Dempsey Trust Bill.