DR LISTON’S CASE

Otago Daily Times, Issue 18543, 2 May 1922, Page 5

DR LISTON’S CASE

CHARGE OF MAKING SEDITIOUS utterances. COMMITTED FOB TRIAL, (Fes United Press .Association.) AUCKLAND, May 1. At. the City,'Police Uourt, before Mr J. W. -Poyntoh,- -S.M<j • James- M. Liston, Roman "Catholic. Coadjutor "Bishop, was called. to answer a change that he made seditious, utterances in' a 'speech at the •Town* Hall on: March.’ 17. Defendant was ■represented by Mr Conlan.' •■' Sir *V. -R. Mereditß appeared far the 'Crb’wnl' • ' ' _ . ; The "charge agairstr-pr Liston, made on /the information of" .Reginald Ward, _ detective sergCant,- Auckland’ is that in the •preson.ee of-a ladfe'-audience of'people at a 'grand Trish concert, held at the Town Hall, ' A uckHuid, on March 17. he did utter certain seditious Words—td wit: ‘‘•Friends of Ireland, it is very fitting I should he speaking to vow this night, ae ray descent and the rank I Hold in the Church give me ; the right to speak. My parents were driven •from their country '-in which they were bom, and in- which they would have been content to live;- Why Were • they driven out?'-Because their foreign masters (meaning the - Government of- the- United Kingdom) did not want - lush 'men and women peopling their" own land, but wanted to use it as a cattle ranch for snobs of the Empire. so may father and my -little - Irish mother and thousands -of others had to go. They came to this country jvith .their memory kept-sacred of their privation* and -wroupt. They have laft to u» the sacred traditions of their sorrow- I am a native of .Nowu-Zealand._ I love, my country much. Wail, jzc every land children of Ireland this dav .are gathered by the same common and •holy impulse - to rejoice that at long last ..they have won some measure of freedom and to hope for. complete deliverance from the house oL bondage. We lived in the hope only, and some good end true men that" hope, very forlorn- I do not say for one jpomeht that Ireland hae got all she asked Tor and all'that her sons died for; but- she has got the first instalment o* her freedom, arid is determined to have tho whole of it T s»y. that because the omnipotent Hand of God made Ireland a nation, and while the--grass, grow* and water flows -there will be plenty to fight and even die that God’s desire# may be realised on the star-.rjpf the World’s history. Ireland has played, many'..parts. Her sons have given the best of, their - talent* te. tho countries which have received 1 them. Above ;all, Ireland has been the {milder of Empires, not for herself, but for others,, pot , for filthy lucre, but. for God’s cause—honour and freedom. Many, ore thinking that difficulties in, the face of the Irish Free State are almost, insuperable- I. think that wellwishets should not be.' dismayed- Ireland has gone through the- worst of her trials- she fiat repeatedly been declared dead and done for. and completely defective, but she is still ..there-' -There are also difficulties ahead, but why shctld ,we fear them? There i$ a mighty Empire, and it still claims to be the greatest one. It also has its difficulties, and -tts rulers hope to overcome'' those' diffluultlbe. If they hope to do this, why-.should hot thp rulers of our little Empire be able to,.meet these difficulties ? - ! “It seems to tee providential (hat, when' Ireland was faced with difficulties, the rnan who has carried us so far, and enabled us to win, is there to see'that .the rulers are not duped by Bnjriandy We must pot forget the martyrs who,died in the fighting of 1916, that- glorious Easter (referring to the insurrection in' Dublin on April 24,1916, and succeeding days). I have here a list of the men and women who ftere proud to die for their country, Some 'were 'shot’; soma, were hanged; some died ip-the hunger strike, murdered by foreign troops (meaning thereby, soldiers of the ■"British Empire), " We cannot forget these men arid women, but in order that qur dream about Ireland may come true, while we cannot forget we can My last thought is that we should say to Ireland as The enters a period of renewed prosperity and glory : ‘God prosper you in all ways, protect you, qnd His everlasting arms enfold you-! 1 ” or words to like, effect being" ap indictable offence, Mr Meredith said that fortimately charges of the kind were few in this country. It was seldom necessary to take down this weapon from the armoury' of Government defence. The speech wat made when the Irish difficulty was in the melting pot, and was exercising the public mind; consequently this had some bearing on the effect and importance of the' words uttered on such an occasion. There was also tho fact that Ur Liston had * position that gave a weight to his words and bearing that would not be given if uttered by a‘person of little or no responsibility._ ‘ ' Frank Bailer, usher, .gave evidence that he remembered the Bishop saying 1 that his father .and mother and many others were driven by thdr foreign "masters '■ from the land they loved, as the country was wanted to be used as oattle ranches for the snobs of England. Referring to Easter.of 1916 ,+he bishoo' said: “So many people' had been murdered by foreign troops. We must -not forget these? people, their memory will live for ever in the hearts of irishman.*’ , Robert Beswiok, customs' officer, gave '.evidence to, the effect-that the retearks that impressed him most were. thoser'witli reference to the Bishop’s father and mother. “That Irishmen had received thfe first instalment of their freedom, and were determined to* have'the whole of itT that tho rulers of our little Empire who beat that great Empire, and should be able to get over its difficulties ; that they tetiSt “riot forgot the martyrs who died in 1916—155 men and women, including three; priests, who were proud to die for their cSuntry. Some were shot, some were hanged,' some, died in the hunger-strike murdered by. foreign troops.” . " Gordon Stanbrook, reporter On the Herald, gave evidence that" he took a. Ibng-hand note of tho'bishop’s speech, anil destroyed his notes after the--report was written. The report was written in the first person. He was not quite sure of the plirase about the ‘‘dismemberment of Ireland,” but was certain that the bishop used a phrase indicating that Ireland had been dismembered. The bishop also referred to several defeats of England. He (witness) did hot remember •the actual weirds used. In his reference to Easter of 1916 the bishop Used the-phrase “murdered by foreign troops.” as well, as a reference to, the hunger Strike. Witness could not remember every word said, but he remembered certain passages, such as the reference to the- cattle ranch and the house of bondage. The words “murdered by foreign troops” were verbatim. He took this to refer to the troops brought' in from England to suppress' the rebellion of Easier Monday, 1916. A returned soldier, George Broadley, said he clearly heard all the' bishop "said. Ho quoted from the speech, and considered the press reports pretty accurate, - Graham Bourke Bell, a draughtsman, gave sjmilor evidence. Stanley A. Greenhough, a clerk,', who was an usher at the coricert, said he heard the first part 'of the speech, in which reference was made, he said, to the homes of the Irish people being used as cattle ranches -for the snobs of the Empire. After hearing more of the sneech he had had enough and walked out. Mr Meredith: How do you mean “had enough”? Witness: I was full up of it. Mr Conlan said that when first approached 4q defend his lordship he'.felt extremely diffident '■ because of the position he had recently filled in the community, but strong ■ag were his feelings of loyalty to the Empire he knew the feelings of Dr Liston were no less loyal. • Then when he came to peruse the reported statements, and knowing what his lordship’s feelings toward this country Were, he could find ih tho report no seditious' Words or no seditious intent. He referred to the right of free speech as on'e of the finest, privileges •of the nation, and said that perhaps the reason of this right was that those who ruled our destiny considered it much,better that men should ' speak . their own "minds rtnd not bottle their views up. In the House of Commons, replying to a question as to whether steps would -be taken to punish those who made seditious tpeeches ,in Hyde Park, the Home Secretary (Mr E. Shortt) said so long as there was no breach of the peace • caused and speeches did not advocate any direct violence, there was no need to take any notice of them. He also said that to some extent' Hyde Park", had come to be recognised as a safety valve of London. “May I also suggest, said Mr Gonlon. “that on a night like this March 17 speakers might possibly say words they would not use at other times or on Other occasions. 1 submit' it might be regarded as a safety valve of the Irish th speak their own minds and pet it over. ' In order that a person might be convicted of making a seditious utterance two ' ingredients bad to be proved: First, that the words must be seditious, and second, that there must be seditious intent. There was not the slightest sign of any disturbance on the present" occasion. and one must assume the audience simply went quietly home. Counsel said criminal intention on the part of accused had to be shown. Nothing was further from the mind v of his lordship than to

commit a crime. ' BpecfaJ4 -dfaS&dmSsU might appeal to the magistrate. TbeijHMH was made on the night of St. FehMHj Day. The speech was made by. a twjM who by virtue of his saorad : not break the law, but must do could to uphold it. The wording 6Fgß| speech would not appeal to the peonMW Ireland, who probably would take no.vnH of it. If the magistrate was hold 'that the words were used speaker—was not .adrhitting they werahiaSS it not appeal to him that in TrJ ‘ l ™Wßa| frank statement thd bishop's to bring.iahout die solidarity o( pire. It might be said it waa 'VwtTfdHl duty 'to speak what was in Ilia ii>i(i|)f|HH not bottle it up. There ware womBM infinite pathos in which the bishop raraßM to hit lather and hie little Irish ntepjgj ’ihese lines would probably, to tent, colour certain expressions wiifiJb ~iW|B out later. No words in the speeoh.iaKlßM incited or moved anyone to < words might be considered unpalatable- but, however much ’lto' UMM trate might think that so. oounsri’g||MM he would agree with him that been no great* ill-will or any disturoanM The bishop was speaking with the son of a irnan who had full knowledge o£3fln subject. The people could have strong diverse views and-express them, was no reason why they should friendu over it, , --niSHI Oousisel was quoting a preface obr-SaW Philip Gibbs to a book by Hugh "$9 when Mr Meredith objected, and thenAMH trate ruled that it was irrolevant?^‘'''yfflj Mr Conlan said he hoped the would read the preface, because it 'mM give some idea of what would be mind of Ur Liston when he made IB address.. It might seem that some vtenl were unpalatable, but those -wcftds dm veyed no seditious intent or incitement. \JS| did hope that after having considered words and the law in connection' witMjiy matter _ the magistrate would dome tO conclusion that, notwithstanding' WateSl advisable the stetemente might be, aojijin would hold them to be of seditious int«j|}3s Mr Meredith said his submission weelßaß the iisue was a,very simple one. .TmS| was no contradiction of the evidence He contended that under the aathoMM there could be no doubt the words 'oOpMn tuted a "seditious utterance. Mt'-'CmSk' had suggested that on the grounds of 'expej dienoy the ease should not be sent 1 "-op The magistrate had not to consider fw quesi.cn of expediency. The seoond’ jpOm was that it was an inroad into free speech. This ww hardly a cose bPSi or dispassionate criticism. The about people being murdered,. Jjt troops could not be considered a ence to what happened in Dublin of 1916. The question was one of jSmB go to the jury, and it was not the ftijMwj of this court to usurp that duty K .UriUii the magistrate was satisfied that able qien would not come to a 'the weeds were seditious, the ceed. It was' not necessary should be violence as a result used. The question was whether were likely to cause ill-will among any of his Majesty’s was further suggested that MmAjM should be regarded as the saf^ ; the Irish people, which would rinjtOTMM granting a dispensation to the Irish to cause a lot of trouble. Mr Conlan said he only teeant fact of the speech .being made on rick's Day should be oooeidbreA'-IMgH magistrate in mitigation. . ' y Tho Magistrate said r authorities on the offence of appears temeThat in four ramaottMKßH the speech is seditious. That is, of the Crime# Act. it Is likely bil’Ainw#®* content or- disaffection among histWMmH suhjeots, or to promote and hostility between different IcImBHwB such subjects. It would be imprqprirawl me to comment upon, or attempt tho speech. It might oreiudi6e_jw”kßß in the higher court. Accused mitted for trial, and will be 'rgeaaMgt|| bail in his own recognisance oTjEL^Dg^H