WAR PENSIONS BILL

New Zealand Times, Volume XL, Issue 9095, 14 July 1915, Page 10

WAR PENSIONS BILL

THE DISABLEMENT ALLOWANCES,

This Bill was considered in committee. Sir Joseph Ward suggested that before the adoption of the second schedule it should be referred to the Defence Committee. ~ , , Mx Allen said he would have no objection to his course. He mentioned that the Imperial proposal in case of total disablement was a minimum of 16s 6d a week for married men vithout children and 14s for unmarried men, the maximum being 235. On clause 1, Mr J. A. Hanan (Inver* cargill) strongly urged 'that the mminum allowance in case of disablement dioilld be increased from 25s to £2 per week, also that the allowance per child should bo raised from ss. , He also suggested that women should be placed on the local boards. Mr J. McCombs (Lyttelton) supported an increase. He thought that actuarial estimate quoted by the Minister for Defence was an exaggeration. According to Hr. McNab the increase to

.£2 would mean an extra expenditure of .£90,000 per annum, but this would only mean Is 7d per head of the population or 8s per family—less than a paltry dog tax. He protested against the omission of a definite provision for nurses, who were left to receive gratuities at the discretion of the board. Tho allowance for families meant that only lOd a day was allowed to feed and cloth a Ch )Ir - L. M. Isitt (Christchurch North, was sure that no elector wanted to see undue economy exercised in regard to pensions to soldiers. What sort of a living would the poor wretches have who were doomed to exist- on a pittance as was proposed? BETTER BE SHOT. Mr J. T. ,M. Hornsby (Wairarapa) <

"Better for them to be shot.” Mr Isitt honestly believed tL«t many a man would be induced to put «* bullet through his head rather'than wager on to life with such a pension. Way. £4.183.000 was spent annually on racing. Liquor and racing together accounted for eight and a-half millions. Mr U. Buick (Palmerston): How much on tobacco?” Mr Isitt: “Nearly as much: but I will say this to the member for Palmerston -. Tf you will give up your liquor 1 will give up my pipe to-morrow.’ ’’ (Hear, ll<? R. Fletcher (Wellington Central) considered that if Parliament went the length of £2 10s a week the public would raise no objection. The matter was essentially one for generous consideration. Mr W. A. Veitch (Wanganui) thought it ridiculous to quote Imperial precedents on a subject of this kind. With the increasing wealth of New Zealand it ooul-,1 easily afford to set a now example. In view of the general sympathy that was felt for the soldiers there should not be the slightest hesitation in fixing the minimum amount at £2. Air K. A. Wright (Wellington Suburbs), hoped that the Defence Committee would raise . the minimum to £2. He cordially agreed with members of the Opposition on this matter. _ Some of these men might lose their sight ajid their position could be readily imagined. If he were given the option of being insane or blind he . would choose the {firmer. If necessary he would levy a special tax on members of Parliament. Mr P. C- Webb (Grey) was of the opinion that both the sohedu.es of .the bilk should be referred to a sp-o.al committee of the House set rip for the purpose. Ho was strongly of the opinion that the provision for unites was inadequate. Sneaking on behalf of the workers of the Dum.nion he could say that not a single worker would begrudge a disabled so.dier £2 a week, even if wages had to be-taxed to prcv.de the money. Dr A. K. Newman (Welling .on East) agreed that £2 a week was little enough for incapacitated men. While Parliament was atmut tins bnsme® it ought-to do tfie thing decently. (Hear, hear.) He hoped that nurses would be put upon a proper basis. Because a human tiring was a woman why should she be asked to risk her life and health without -having any adequate idea of what the State p.opos.nl to do for her ? He thought that' it would be necessary after the war to establish institutions for the care of many of tho disabled men.

Mr G, Witty (Riocarton) said that'the bill was in the right direction, but did not go nearly far enough. Messrs T. A. H. Field (Nelson), G. W. Forbes (Hurunui), and R. P. Hudson (Motueka) spoke in the same, direction. OCCUPATION MORE IMPORTANT ' THAN PENSION. The Hon J. Allen said that so far as disabled men were concerned the pension was not the omy thinj the (Goveinment CuUlcl give. Occupation mig-m. be tounu tor them by the Siate—oven for the blind —and occupation was leairy mure imp-tit-aut than 'cho pension. It wo© unjust for honourable members to criticise, the p.ovisions for nuiees. No .other country nad provided for nu,ses at a.l. It was difficult to place dennice amounts tor nurses in a schedule, but members could be satisfied that a nurse who suffered through giving her services would be provided for in the same way as a soldier.

iur J. Payne (Grey Eyum; saw caat the men should be adequately provided for in the bill and anything else that might be done' for them would bt( a matter for future consideration. Mr W. D. S. MacDonald (Bay of P’enty) said that the Dominion; should depend upon no precedent. It should go on its own, and-do its duty by its own men. He thought that if a man was capable of doing any work at nil he . could not be Classed as totally disabled. He thought there was a danger that if a man got a little light work after the wah he would not be given the maximum pension. ’ In the course of further discussion Mr McCombs (Lyttelton), Air Glover (Auckland Central), and' Mr Coates (Kaipara) stated their desire to see the pensions and allowances made more generous in some directions. AN ENEMY IN THE FOLD.

Air Vigor Brown (Napier) asked if the sons of unnaturahsed aliens were going to benefit under the bill. Some men falling in this classification had gone to the from. . The. Alinister said the Pensions Board had wide powers of discretion. Air Afander (Marsden) said the totally disabled man was entitled to more than 25s a week. He did not know how many disabled men there would he. The Alinister: "We estimate 6000 men, 12 per cent, on a torce of 50.000 men. That includes partial disablement." Mr Poole (Auckland West) suggested the 'need of an extra schedule providing the rates of pension for .various grades of disablement, as in the case of the Workers’ Compensation. Act.

The Hon. A. T. Ngate (Eastern Alaori) -said that the feeling of the House clearly was in favour of an improvement of both the schedules. The Alinister had agreed already to send one schedule back to the Secret Defence Committee for further consideration and it seemed desirable that both the schedules should be, discussed again by the committee, Mr J. C. Hanan (Invercargill) considered that there should be a woman on the Central Board as well as each of the local committees.

Mr J. Cradgio (Timnru) said that in, the whole of his Parliamentary experience he had never seen the House so unanimous. Everyone was agreed that the bill was a good one, hat it was also the universal opinion, that there should be some increase in certain, of the proposed pensions.

Mr G. W. -Russell (Aron)' urged that both schedules saould he referred to the oommittee. Ho had never seen such concurrence of feeling on both sides in favour of more generous treatment than was provided in the bill. It was clearly a case in which some concession should be made bv the Minister. "AN EXAMPLE TO THE WORLD."

DrE. MoNab' (Hawke’s Bay) said he had so far supported the bill as it stood, but he could not help feeling now that there was something in what the member for Avon said. He had thought that it would be best to postpone the final form of the bill until nest session when a better idea could be obtained of what the cost of pensions would be, but after the discussion that had taken place he would join in urging that the Defence Committee might just as well have the chance of considering both schedules. He thought, on due _ reflection. It might be just as well, seeing the general feeling in the, House, to increase .the minimum to £2. Let an example.be given to the world. '

, Mr J. B. Hino (Stratford) thought, there should be in : extending the liberality so generously urged. Mr Allen thereupon agreed to the remission of both schedules to the Defence Committee. , The clause was agreed to.

Subsequent clauses were pas-led. with technical amendments.

On clause 5, "Maximum rates of pension in case of death,” Mr W. A. Veitch (Wanganui) suggested that a weakness of the wording was the use of the phrase “not exceeding.” As it read the clause meant that the schedules gave maximum amounts below which the board could go if they liked. Mr G. J. Anderson (Mataura) agreed that the phraseology of this clause was not sufficiently definite. Air Allen explained that tho clause had been very carefully considered, and had to be read in conjunction with clause 12. The clause was agreed to with a verbal alteration, which the Minister said made it more liberal of interpretation. The following clauses were adopted with some Alinisterial alterations to make them more clear.

A new clause was added providing for the appointment of such local ndvisory committees as the Alinister might think; fit. Progress was reported when the schedules were reached, and on the House resuming these were referred to the Defence Committee.

At twenty minutes after midnight the House adjourned until this afternoon.