HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

New Zealand Times, Volume XXXIII, Issue 7871, 5 August 1911, Page 6

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

ADDRESS-IN-REPLY CONCLUDED. MENTAL DEFECTIVES BILL. The House of Representatives met at 2.30 p.m. Tho various select committees wore set up, the only change made being the substitution of Mr Fisher for Mr Wright on tho Printing and Debates Committee. 1 ADDRESS-IN-EEPLY HUMOROUS MR HOGG. Mr A. W. Hogg (Masterton), continuing the Add ices- in-Rep Iy deba said that tho speech was as bare as a plateglass window. There was nothing to catch hold of. It was a bald-headed epitome of State news. Soaring above the matters in the speech ho desired to speak of tho Rimutaka deviation. (Laughter.) It was a wild, bleak incline, and after travelling through its numerous tunnels ho ofton wondered that ho did not emerge on tho top transformed into something like bacon. It was a Tory railway, built for party purposes, and the' incline alone had cost a million sterling, and the maintenance cost *£20,000 annually. Ten years ago ho hod induced the Government to survey suitable deviations, and notwithstanding the urgency of the work nothing had been dons. The staunch Government eiipporieiu were being starved, and Mr Massey rushed ■'in with His honeyed prom ties of railway deviations to catch tho weak-kneed electors. He had no doubt Mr Maseey would gain a certain amount of support by his promises, for he (Mr Hogg) had letters from good Liberals who had become tired of tho unfulfilled promiser? of tho Government. Ho intended, that Ministers should see these letters. If the two millions given for a Dreadnought in a moment of panic caused by a flagrant Tory falsehood had been spent on necessary public works, it would, have changed the face of New Zealand. HIS RESIGNATION. Mr Fisher- You were in tho Cabinet that gave the Dreadnought. Why t didn't you resign? , . T Mr Hogg: X resigned early enough. 1 did so because I did not agree with the I Ministry as to the method of carrying on tho public works, and ae to the necessity for dealing with the monopolist and opening up land for settlement and the necessity for handling our own finances, and establishing a paper currency such as they have in Australia now, and such as wo will have to follow soon. Mr Fisher s You should have resigned on the Dreadnought issue. Mr Hogg: No; I would do the same thing again if I thought England was in a hole and required assistance. Bat X am confident now there was no necessity for the Dreadnought. Wc were misled. Mr J- Allen: Who misled you? Mr Hogg: I cannot tell you. A base falsehood was flashed over the wires. It was one of those Tory lies so difficult to fathom. ' development: Mr T. Y. Soddon (Westland) congratulated the \Speaker and Acting-Prime Minister on their Coronation honours. He was gratified to know that South Westland, once regarded as neglected, had had a good deal of attention paid to-it, and several of the rivers had been, bridged. The Hokitika-Ross railway line was paying handsomely, and was probably one of the four most prontablo tines in New Zealand. He went on to refer to the desirability of more widely advertising the tourist beauties of the West Coast, and the need for inquiring closely into its water-power possibilities. He was glad to see that the Government was asserting itself to encourage mining. MORE ABOUT MOKAU. Mr W. T. Jennings (Taumarmmi). replying on the debate, dealt at length with tho Mokau land case. Years ago he had urged the settlement of tho land, and Mr Scddon had referred him to Mr Barron, who had said that no Government would touch tho matter, as the titles were so hopelessly mixed. He was sorry for Mr Jones, but when he stated that, he had been offered .£160,000 for the property ho was talking fudge. Mr Massey; I saw a cablegram offering £IOO,OOO. Mr Jennings: X do not care what you saw. If this offer was made, why did not those making the offer bid for the property when it was put up four years ago at New Plymouth/ Why did they, not offer to pay off tho £l-4,000 owing to the Flowers estate to allow the development of the land to go on. J Those who had bought tho property had paid double the amount that Mr Okey had said the natives would accept, and of the whole area of 53,000 acres tho purchasers would have no rights over an area of 14,000 until the leases expired thirty years hence. > The two Opposition papers in Taranaki had said that Mr Massey had shown a great lack of knowledge of the matter, and •that the settlement of tho lands was in tho best interests of North Taranaki and South Auckland. Tho motion to present his Excellency with a respectful Address-in-Reply was carried, and tho Speaker and actingPrime Minister were deputed to convey the message. MENTAL DEFECTIVES TO REPEAL OUT-OF-DATE LEGISLATION. The Hon. George Fowlds moved the second reading of tho Mental Defectives Bill, which he stated was ir.lomlcd to repeal the out-of-date legislation included. in the consolidating Act of DOS. Tho necessity for changes in the Act had been very fully borne in upon him, and the report of the English commission on tlie care of tho feeble-minded had come at an opportune time to supx>ort these changes. Tho State, in the new Bill, undertook to extend its caro and control over tho various classes of' mentally defective persons. So long as tho detaining of tho mentally defective person was for the benefit of that individual, their relatives should contribute towards their support. Tho Minister quoted from portions of the English commission's report, and pointed out that it covered the important question of the fertility of the unfit. Tho report stated that in tho case of feeble-minded persons there was a larger birthrate than normal, and although this was combined with a high dcatlirate, tho latter was not high enough to -prevent a considerable survival of mentally defective per* l

sous who would transmit tho defect. The evidence strongly supported putting mentally detective persons jnto institutions where they would ny under control and usefully employed. Tho Bill contained a most important provision that each caso must Ik* reported upon yearly in, order to determine whether further detention was necessary. A notable departure was made by allowing persons "on tno bor-der-line” to place themselves under care, and perhaps bo restored to health without having to undergo tho ordeal of securing a magistrate's order. Tho Bill woufd be a great improvement on existing legislation.

ROYAL COMMISSION SUGGESTED. Mr W. F. Massey, leader of the Opposition, stated that there could bo uu possible objection to a consolidating measure, and it would not bo regarded from a party point of view. If the statements published regarding the overcrowding ot Auckland mental hospital were correct it was nothing loss than a public scandal. He had never road anything worse or anything so bad of any public institution in thy Dominion, it was evident that the Auckland mental hospital wa-s ’ grossly overcrowded in a manner dangerous to tho health and safety ot patients and attendants. If ever there was a caso for a Royal Commission this \was suroly one, and tho House should, insist upon the appointment being made without delay, it should be composed of experienced men, medical officers if possible. He did not think the conditions at Auckland wero tho fault of the Inspector-General, who, ho believed, was really overworked. Tho department .was probably to blame, for the Minister had visited the institution a little while ago and seen for himself tho state of affairs, but nothing seemed to have been done. Tho Hon. G. Fowlds: I took steps to get it remedied as quickly as possible. Mr Massey added that he did not say the Minister was to blame, but that there was something very wrong with tho administration of tho department. Dealing with the general question involved in the Bill he remarked that thisclass of people was often grossly neglected. There must be an. improvement in the system oi classification of patients, and there should certainly bo separate institutions for the treatment of patients who wero* chiefly suffering from senile decay. - Mr G. M. Thomson (Dunedin North) urged tho House not to pass judgment on the Auckland caso too hurriedly, as it was possible that the reports might be exagge rated. He did not quite agree with .Mr suggestion for a Royal Commission, except m so far as to gain .information as to the necessity for extending " tho accommodation. Ho did not think they required more than a careful examination of existing institutions. It was necessary to provide for mentally defective childi v \i even more than for any other class, for by so doing they would* in time reduce the number of defective adults. In connection with tho proposals for dealing with defective girls he thought the House would have to be careful not to inflict any injustice. Ho would support the second reading. CONTROL OF THE INTERMITTENTLY INSANE. Tho member for Wellington Central, Mr F, M. B. Fisher, stressed the necessity for some form of State intervention to prevent mental defectives roaming at largo and reproducing their kind. In one case winch had come under his notice recently a man who had been, in and out of asylums for many years became tii© father of ten children, every one of whom was mentally defective and had to be taken charge of by the State. He suggested to tho Minister the advisability of referring the BUI to a committee. which should have power to call expert medical evidence and advise as to tho best methods of controlling intermittently insane persons. The Minister deserved credit for bringing the Bill down, but it might well go further. Mi: W. H. Field (Otaka) said it was very desirable to have something in the form of a halfway house, where persons in tho incipient stages could be placed and have every chance of being cured The Bill made an attempt to meet this ueed, but did not go far enough in the direction of insisting upon notification in the early stages. However, if given a fair chance it should ensure a fail hop© of decrease in the dread disease. It was necessary to improve the working conditions of tho attendants if the best results were to be attained, and ho hoped the Minister would give this aspect of the question his careful conThe attendants now felt that they were not fairly treated. fir E. H. Taylor (Thames) congratulated tho Minister upon the introduction of tho, Bill, and especially on the proposal for classification. Tho boarding-out' system spoken of in the Bill would need the most careful supervision possible, lie hoped the Minister would take steps to draw public attention to tho necessity of treatment in tho incipient stages of the disease. OMINOUS FIGURES. Mr. G. Laurensoii (Lyttelton) congratulated the Minister upon having added another to the list of Bills he had introduced which had made for better and more humane treatment of those ,in trouble, sickness or mental distress. He hoped tho Bill would become law after being improved iii certain directions. Tho number of insane people in the community had increased at a phenomenal rate of late years. When he reached New Zealand thirty-four years ago there were 748 insane people in New Zealand, or one in every 530 of tho population, while to-day the proportion was one in 250. This .meant that the rate of insanity had doubled in a little over thirty years. These were ominous figures. The number of patients who recovered thirtyfour years ago was in tho proportion of 57.5 G per cent.; to-day it was 48.74 per cent.

The Hon. G. Fowlds: You see, there is an accumulation going on every year. Mr Laurenson: X admit .that, but it does not seem very satisfactory thatithe percentage of recoveries should steadily decrease.

The Hon. G. Fowlds: It’s inevitable in a new country, because you are always getting a larger residue in tho institutions.

Mr Lauren son pointed to the fact that hereditary influences wero the cause of the greatest proportion of insanity, and said that -when the community became wise and strong enough it would be able to abolish this altogether. At present the country did not spend enough on its mental asylums. Mr J. Hanan (Invercargill) complained that in dealing with lunatics and social derelicts the community began at the wrong end. This Bill was a practical step towards a great reform. He particularly approved tho proposed establishment of -institutions for the care of feebleminded children.

Mr E. H. Clark (Chalmers) offered the suggestion that the Eugenics Societies might bo empowered to visit and report upon cases of feeble-mindedness. He welcomed the Bill. Mr G. Witty (Riccarton) agreed that it was tho duty of Parliament to do all it could to improve the system under which the mentally afflicted were detained. He did not think the Royal Commission suggested by Mr Massey was at all necessary. , ' Mr J. Bollard (Eden) expressed the opinion that the newspaper statements regarding the Auckland asylum were grossly exaggerated. Dr Te Rangihiroa (Northern Maori) said that tho community could not ho too careful to prevent the intermarriage of mental defectives and the production by them of offspring. Ho agreed that special provision should be made for the treatment of aged patients suffering mainly from senile decay. Mr D. McLaren (Wellington East) welcomed tho Bill. He said that tho industrial strain on many of the workers should bo considered in the prevention of insanity, and ho urged the Minister to soo that the attendants were worked for roaspnablo hours. Mr T. R. Y. Seddon (Westland) suggested that members interested should have been invited to attend the deputation to the Minister. He congratulated the Minister on his effort to cope with a difficult problem, but he urged tho need