THE LABOUR WORLD.

New Zealand Mail, Issue 1200, 1 March 1895, Page 30

THE LABOUR WORLD.

THE UTOPIA OF THE SOUTH.

AN INTERVIEW WITH THE LABOUR MINISTER OF NEW ZEALAND.

From the Sydney Correspondent of the Westminster Gazette. "A Minister of the Crown who talks about factory hands, servant girls and ■washerwomen as if they were human beings. He Avould be amusing if .he were not so terribly serious." This was the reply I got when I asked an Australian politician what he thought of the Hon W. %. Reeves, the Minister for Labour of New Zealand. The opinions of a politician out of office have generally but little relation to his policy when in power. Although I have met scores of irresponsible politicians who talked Socialism, I had despaired of meeting in the flesh an out-and-out Socialist as a Crown Minister. This is what Mr Reeves professes to be, and this is what he 'is. This week he paid a flying visit to Sydney, and I had a long interview with him at the Grosvenor Hotel. The conversation was singularly interesting. He is a young man, dark, with a firm mouth and dreamy eyes; a barrister, a journalist, a popular poet and the first and only Labour Minister in the British Empire. A few years ago he wrote a " History of Socialism and Communism," which is now out of print. I suggested that he had perhaps modified his views before taking office, and remarked that the articles on " Wealth and Want " which brought forth the Labour Party were written by Sir [Samuel Griffith, who was afterward the most determined opponent of that party. But he replied: " I took office to carry out my ideas." THE GOVERNMENT AND THE UNEMPLOYED. "How," I ask, "did your department come into existence, and what are your duties as Labour Minister ?" " The Department of Labour was formed four years ago," he said, "three months after the Ballance Ministry took office. At first it was a small affair, set up with the object of dealing with an emergency that had arisen through the unemployed. We endeavoured to see whether it was possible to meet those out of work in a new spirit. I thought then, and I think now, that one of the best ways of dealing with congested labour is to promote its circulation. No one can do this as effectually as the State. We have sources of information in everjl corner of the country in regard to the labour market; we can have that information transmitted to the centres free, of charge, .and we can send labour - from place to place almost without cost. As you know, we own the railways and telegraphs in New Zealand." "This, then, was the basis upon which

you set to work ?" "Yes. We established labour offices in the centres of population. We had agents in every district policemen, postmen, telegraph operators,, and so on —-whom I linked to the Labour Department. These agents collect information, which they forward to the head office and to the centres, . and T send the men who are seeking work all over New Zealand. We meet the requirements of-the unemployed in every way. We supply them with tools and tents, and if they must travel by steamboat we advance the fares and make terms with the company. They repay U 3 when they are in a position to do so. The State itself is, of course, a large employer of labour, and we engage our men through the Government Labour Bureau. THE LABOUR BUREAU AT WORK. "Dealing with the unemployed is only one of the duties of the Labour Department," he added. " It has charge of the administration of the Factory Act, which is somewhat similar to the English, only more advanced—for instance, the factory age in New Zealand is 14, in England it is 11; of the Shop Hours Act, which provides for a weekly half-holiday, regulates the hours of labour for women and children, attends to the sanitary condition of shops, compels the shopkeeper to provide, and renders him liable to a penalty if he objects to the use of, seats for those in his employ; the Truck Act, which provides that all workmen's wages are to be paid in money and not in kind. Our department also collects labour statistics, regarding the number of men in the Colony in and out of work, on the lines of the Labour Bureau of England. We publish also a Labour journal or magazine, which not only contains information about the labour market, but all news on industrial matters and opinions on everything affecting the labour problem in every part of the world. We give both sides of the question, and although we have been attacked on the ground that the State should not publish a magazine, our journal, which is sold at 2d, has been a complete success. All labour disputes, grievances felt and expressed by the working classes, and legislation touching labour, come under my notice and consideration, and are dealt with by the Labour Department." HOW THEY PREVENT STRIKES. " Do you mean to say that you have solved the strike problem ? " " We have passed the only compulsory Conciliation and Arbitration Act in the world. It provides for local conciliation boards on the'English model, but with a right of appeal to a central arbitration court, presided over by a judge of the Supreme Court and two assessors, who must examine into the dispute. That court has power to summon witnesses, and its decision is binding at law. A strike while the matter is under reference to the court is forbidden. This Act was passed with the unanimous support of all the trades unions of Now Zealand." It will be impossible for years to pass an ■ Act like this in the Australian colonies. In tfye meantime millions will be lost in industrial wars.. SOCIALISTIC LEGISLATION, AND ITS EFFECTS. "It has been my duty," Mr Reeves continued, " to pass an Employers' Liability Bill somewhat similar to Mr Asquith's

English measure—a Bill abolishing the old English conspiracy laws relating to trades unions, under which so many men have lately been imprisoned in New South Wales and in Queensland ; a Bill reforming the Common Law doctrine with regard to industrial conspiracy ; a Seaman's Act, providing for the better accommodation of sailors, modifying the penalties for seamen's offences, providing for a better inspection of life-saving appliances, preventing undue deck-loading, &c. .Roughly speaking, that is my work as Minister for Labour. In addition to the army of Civil servants linked with my department, I have some special inspectors, including a lady of wide experience and great ability, Mrs Grace Neill." I remarked that the department must be a heavy drain on the Treasury. Mr Reeves, however, assured me that it is practically self-supporting. The Civil Servants have only to perform a little extra work. For the rest, the fees paid under the Factory Act (every factory must be registered) more than repay the cost of the inspection. HAS CAPITAL BEEN CRIPPLED ? " But legislation of this description," I said, " must surely drive capital out of New Zealand."

Mr Reeves laughed heartily. " That is a common delusion," he answered. " The fact is, less capital has been driven from New Zealand during the past few years than from any of the Australian colonies. You have had no labour legislation to speak of in Australia, and yet the people who withdrew their capital were the investors in the New Zealand branches of the Australian banks. The bank panic swept over every one of the colonies on the Australian Continent, but it did not touch New Zealand. Not one of our banks suspended payment. Since the crisis the Bank of New Zealand has been in trouble from causes of old standing, causes which were at work long before our socialistic legislation. No; the real cry has been against our land taxation. Why, the present leader of the Opposition, Captain Russell, has given me valuable and generous support in my labour legislation." THE PAUPER AND THE. CRIPPLE. " Are you the author of the Immigrants Bill ?" " I am." "And so you intend to exclude cripples and every man who hasn't got in his pocket ?"

"I know how the measure has been criticised. Have you read it ? Do you not see that some Act for the exclusion of undesirable immigrants will have to be passed in New Zealand, and in every other , socialistic colony. For the moment we raise the condition of our people one inch, others will flock in and frustrate our efforts. The Bill will be modified, of course, but it is only an embodiment of the American laws, excluding paupers." THE ENFRANCHISEMENT OF WOMEN AND ITS CONSEQUENCES. After talking on other matters, I asked the Minister for the truth about the enfranchisement of women, and how it Avas working in New Zealand. "It is working quietly and well," Mr Reeves replied. "it is the old story. When great changes are brought about people are astonished to find that the world has not been turned upside down." "Still, women mttst bring about some changes in your political life." " The franchise will improve the social and industrial conditions of women. But its effect will not be seen in an hour, or in a day, or a year. They, must use their power with intelligence and persistence! It is not a Conservative measure. Quite the reverse, for the majority at the last election in favour of the Socialistic and Liberal Party, was unprecedented in New Zealand. In the South (or larger) Island nine-tenths of the candidates were Liberals, belonging to the advanced party." "Are the women likely to vote for the clerical party ?" " No. For instance, two clergymen stood against me, and three or four others —some of them prominent and eloquent men, endeavoured to bring about my defeat. I was returned by a majority of 1000. All the world over the female franchise will have aißadical and .Socialistic effect. Women don't get the best of things in this world. The domestic servant, the needlewoman, and the factory hand have to work as hard as and harder than men, and they get less pay for their work and less consideration for their grievances. They have, therefore, less reason to be satisfied with the world as it is. Being educated now, they will not be contented, with an unjust and lop-sided world. They will try to change it. Even able and intellectual women, the world over, feel fettered and cramped by social and industrial conditions, and all their sympathies are with those who are endeavouring to bring about a change. This desire for change will, 1 think, express itself in the socialistic direction, for women are eminently sympathetic, and their keen sympathies and their lack of robust, hard, physical strength will cause them to feel for the weak and downtrodden, to be in favour of collectivism and altruism as against individualism, and to do their best to raise the poor and suffering." "And I suppose you will take women into the service of the State in New Zealand?"

"Our telephone service is already * manned' by women. It is the favourite employment for women in the Colony. They have also entered largely into the State school service." THE " TIMES," SAMOA AND LORD ROSEBERY. In the course of further conversation I referred to the quarrel of the Times with Lord Rosebery over the reported desire of New Zealand to annex or govern Samoa. Mr Reeves was very emphatic in agreeing with the English Premier. " We never had the slightest intention to interfere in any way with the government of Samoa," he said. " The statements probably arose in this way. The Colonial Treasurer formally intimated that during

| the recess a Minister would visit Samoa ; in the Government yacht. Beyond an expression of friendly feeling towards, and interest in, the islands, the visit meant nothing. The idea of endeavouring forcibly to intermeddle with the affairs of the island would be childish. The telegram in the Times, referred to by Lord Rosebery, was quite unauthorised, and it must have created an impression that we were trying to get hold of the island. Lord Rosebery was right, and I don't take what he said as being in any way an insult to or a reflection upon New Zealand." " Putting that question aside, would you be prepared to govern Samoa ?" " Sooner or later something must be done with the islands," Mr Reeves replied. "We are ready to do what we can, if thought desirable, to make Samoa of some use to the Empire and to the world. But the idea of annexing it never entered our minds."

B afore parting from Mr Reeves, he said: " We regard the West7)iinster Budget as the pleas an test and most newsy weekly in London. I like a paper that has something more than Cockney jokes and fashion-plate art —say ideas and opinions." During the interview the Minister spoke with great earnestness. With the lessons of experience, and perhaps too much of the confidence of youth, he seems to believe that all the dreams of the Socialist will be realised in New Zealand. I left him reading " A Traveller from Altruria." J. Tighe Ryan.