PARLIAMENT.

New Zealand Herald, Volume XXXI, Issue 9635, 6 October 1894, Page 6

PARLIAMENT.

,— . ♦ . — LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL. : Friday. The Council met at 2.30 p.m.

LAND FOR SETTLEMENTS. It was decided to insist on the Council's amendments in the Land for Settlements Bill.

ANDANCK TO SETTLERS.

The debate upon the second reading of the Government Advances to Settlers Billto which Mr. Stevens had moved an amendment that the Bill be read a second time thab day six months— resumed by Mr. Bowen. He said he felt assured if the Bill became law it would have the effecb of making money dearer so far as New Zealand was concerned. He also objected to the Bill because the electors bad nob expressed an opinion on it, and because the borrowing powers it conferred on the Government would lower the credit of the colony at home. Mr. Kelly said he thought Mr. Stevens had taken too gloomy a view of the affairs Of the colony. Things might be bad the South Island., but in the North Island business was prosperous. He strongly supported the Bill, being of opinion the present was the most opportune time to aadisb farmers by a scheme of this kind. Mr. Oliver contended that the margin proposed in the Bill was too small, and the provision for assurance fund was nob sufficient to meeb the losses that were sure to ensue. The Bill would create a large number of State debtors, many of whom would never be able to disentangle themselves. He altogether objected to State Socialism as proposed to be initiated under the Bill, and said so soon as the energy of the individual was merged in the State so soon would the decadence of the Empire be brought about. Mr. Montgomery denied that the Bill would make money dearer. He hoped the Council would not throw out a Bill which the people at large were desirous should become law. He objected to the gloomy pictures regarding the state of the colony. The country was daily increasing in prosperity, and people were surmounting the difficulties which stood in their path. Mr. McLean thought there was much to be said both in favour and against the Bill, and therefore he should nob vote for the amendment. The Bill did nob contain any new principle, as the State was already lending money, both from the Government Lite Insurance Department and the Public Trust Office. He denied that the banks were charging exorbitant rates of interest, and said they were lending I money at 6 per cent. Mr. Morris did not think the Bill would do very much harm, and he should support the second reading. Mr. Jennings supported the Bill, and defended the Government from the accusation that they were destroying the selfreliance policy of the late Premier, Mr. BaDance. He objected to the proposal to lend money up to two-thirds of the value Of the land, as being too high. He regretted the pessimistic view of the state of the colony taken by Mr. Bowen, a view which be trusted and believed was nob entertained by many people in New Zealand. Mr. Stewart said there had been no more disastrous business in the colony during the last fifteen years than moneylending, and therefore he objected to the statement of the Colonial Secretary thab the Bill had been brought in with a view to pnb a stop to the extortion of moneylenders. The debate was interrupted by the dinner adjournment. The Council resumed at 7.30 p.m. Mr. Stewart continued speaking against the Government Advances to Settlers Bill. He said what the country wanted was restoration of public confidence and the means to induce capitalists to immigrate with the view to enter upon agricultural pursuits. If there was no loss to the State by the proposed lending, there certainly would not be any profit. Mr. Kerb pointed out that manufacturers, by reason of the protective tariff, and the timber industry, by being granted railway facilities, were being assisted by the State, and he failed to see why objection should be raised to farmers also being assisted by the State. He denied thab borrowers under the Bill would become the slaves of the State, but even supposing this proved to be true, it would certainly be better that farmers should be the slaves of the State than slaves of money-lenders. Why, he regarded the Bill as a measure for wholesale buying and selling of money by the State, and believing this he would vote against the second reading. The Bill was nob required, because money on anything like good security could be obtained at 4J per cent, from private lenders in Sydney, and in New Zealand at 5J per cent. Mr. McGregor spoke strongly against the Bill, which would create a class of shufflers, and a class of persons who would seek either repudiation or reduction of their interest. It was the purest sophistry to say that this Bill followed the example of the Public Trust and Government Life Offices. There was no saying where this scheme would end, for the lending of three millions would merely prove the sprinkling of water upon thirsty ground. Mr. McCpllough, in supporting the Bill, said he considered the borrowing scheme of the Government would nob add to the indebtedness of the State. Mr. Bolt strongly supported the scheme, which he regarded as much a social necessity, to be undertaken by the Government, as Government railways, Government Life Insurance Department, and the Public Trust Office. lb was better for the workers to serve the Government than to be in the j clutches of lending syndicates. Mr. Bonar thought the Bill should have a fair trial, and he would support it, at any rate, as far as the third reading stage. In the course of his reply, Sir P. Br/CKT.EY repeated thab one of the principal reasons why the Government had brought in this Bill was in consequence of the almost insupportable burdens in the shape of interest private institutions had charged small farmers. The Council then went to a division, with the result that Mr. Stevens' amendment amendment was rejected by 13 to 14, and the second reading wa9 agreed to. The division list was as follows :—For the amendment (13): Messrs. Reynolds, Stewart, Williams, Barnicoat, Swanson, Pharazyn, McGregor, Acland, Stevens, Ormond, Bowen, Whyte, Peacock. Agaihst the amendment (14) : Messrs. Baillie, Whitmore, Bonar, McCullough, Kerr, Kelly, Jenkinson, Tairoa, Feldwick, Rigg, Dignan, McLean, Montgomery, Buckley. Pairs : — For the amendment : Messrs. Shrimski, Oliver, Holmes, Grace. Against the amendment: Messrs. Bolt, Jennings, Morris, Kenny. At ten p.m. the Council adjourned till Monday at 2.30 p.m.

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES.

Friday. The House tneb at 2.30 p.m.

NATURALISATION OF CHINAMEN. Mr. G. W. Russell gave notice to ask whether the Government would bring in A ■horb Bill to prevent the wholesale naturalisation of Chinamen now going on in the cclony.

THE CONSOLS BILL.

The Consols Bill was received from the £«gißlafcive Council with amendments. The' Speaker said he considered the amendment made by the Council in clause 4 of the Bill, reducing the term of re-pay-ment from 40 years to 20 years, was an infringement of the privileges of the House. The Council, he thought, had no power to make an amendment of that kind. Mr. Ward moved that the House disagree with the amendments made by the Council in clause 4, and that a committee be apanted to draw up reasons for disagreeing, e said the Governor's Message would be brought down later on, reducing the amount under the Bill to half a-raillion, extending over a period of two years. The motion was agreed to. HATIVK LAND CODBT BILL. The Native Land Courb Bill was further considered in Committee. Clause 135, dealings with native lands prohibited. ' ■ Mr. Seddon moved to amend the clause to the effect that except as provided for in part 4 of division 2 of this Acb it shall nob be lawful for any person, other than a person acting on behalf of the Crown, to acquire any native land. A lengthy discussion ensued, several members objecting to the Crown having the pre-emptive right of purchase of native land. -•..;> ' Captain Russell strongly objected bo the pre-emptive right. ; Mr. Seddon -urged, ib tltfM be much * fetter for the natives themselves and the

colony that the whole of the native land transactions should go through the Government. In several native districts he found the natives wished to deal through the Government. Mr. Skddon's amendment was eventually carried on the voices. The House rose at 5.30. The House resumed at 7.30 in committee on the Native Land Court Bill, clause 135 relating to pre-emptive* right being still under discussion. On the motion of Mr. Parata a proviso was inserted to the effect that nothing in the Act should prevent leasing of land in the Middle Island. Clause as amended was added to the Bill by 34 to 19. The remaining clauses passed without material amendment. Several new clauses were added to the j Bill, and the schedules were passed without alteration. LICENSING BILL. At 1.25 a.m. the House went into committee on the Licensing Bill. Captain Russell protested apainst going on with a Bill of this kind at this hour. Mr. Skddon suggested they might go on till three o'clock at any rate. Mr. Cabncross moved that the Chair* man leave the chair on the Bill. After some discussion this was lost on the voices. Mr. Graham then moved to report progress, which was being discussed when the telegraph office closed at two a.m.