MR.BALLANCE AND THE WANGANUI NATIVES.

New Zealand Herald, Volume XXII, Issue 7222, 10 January 1885, Page 5

MR.BALLANCE AND THE WANGANUI NATIVES.

[BY TELEGRAPH.—PRESS ASSOCIATION.]

Wellington, Friday. The Native Minister, tbe Hon. Mr. Ballance» left Wangf.nui for Ranana on Tuesday morning at ten o'clock. Accompanying him were Mr. W. G. Butler (Private Secretary and Interpreter), and Mr. T. W. Lewis (Under-Secretary for Native Affairs). Tho trip up was a very pleasant one, and at all the settlements at which a stay was made all the natives showed that they greatly appreciated the honour of a visit from the Native Minister. On arriving at Ranana the entire population turned out to do him honour, and three volleys were fired by Kemp's men. Hakas and other demonstrations of welcome were also given. A triumphal arch had been erected, and the guest was escorted to the arch. Major Kemp, on behalf of the native committee and people, presented an address of welcome to him. i hey were, he said, very thankful for this his first coming amongst them, and they welcomed him as one of Her Majesty's Ministers, recognising, as they did, that the submission tendered in the Treaty of Waitangi, in 1840, was still binding on chem. Mr. Ballance, in returning thanks, said he recognised their loyalty to the Queen, also their good feelings towards himself, tie knew they had always been loyal, and knowing that, he had much pleasure in accepting the invitation to attend the meeting. He was told that no Native Minister had visited the people of the Wanganui River before, and he recognised that as the Government of which he was a member had just taken office, it was his duty to see the natives, and talk over with them the affairs common' to the welfare of both races. He came as a friend and as a Miuister of the Crown, and would have the pleasure and privilege of speaking to them in both capacities. Tho meeting did not commence properly until Thursday morning, by which time there must have been not less than 5000 persons present. Major Kemp opened tho proceedings. He said that Mr. Ballance was the first Minister who had accepted an invitation to come amongst them. The subjects for discussion had not been mentioned in the invitation. They were eight in number, and would be introduced by others. He had always taught the Wanganui people to aim at the ends sought by rich Europeans, but now had changed his mind, and thought it best that vhe people should act in accordance with law. He thought all lands should be • sub-divided, the title of each person being ascertained. Not that he wished to prevent sales or leases, but he considered thfts if it was intended to sell land it should be cut up into small blocks and sold to private individuals, because it was population that would bring prosperity to the Island. Previous Governments had assisted speculators to obtain large blocks of land, from 10,000 to 20,000 acres each. The result of this was that they could go away and draw the rent. Companies were equally bad, and he thought they should negotiate with the Government, as they were the most responsible power in New Zealand, and the guardians of great and small. Referring to the practices of previous Native Ministers, he said they had confined their attention to the towns, and when they wished to see the Ministers they had to go to the towns, where he was always too much engaged to give his attention to the Maoris. He did not blame any parti* cular Minister.

" Poari Kurimate, the Chairman of the native committee, followed.' He read the programme for the meeting, which consisted of the following items :—(1) The consideration of the exterior boundary of the property of the Wanganui people, which required to be confirmed by Parliament; (2) they wished the native committee to be confined to the Wanganui district only ; (3) they had agreed to allow a steamer to be put ou the Wanganui River; (4) all- surveys of land belonging to them, the committees would, he said, deal ; with; (5) and (6) leases and sales of lands would also be dealt with by the committees ; (7) the committees would also deal with the question of the rail way where it went through land held under Maori title; ,(S) tha committees would deal with the questions of surveys, Northern lands, and the boundaries of their tribes. The Native Minister then addressed the meeting, speaking for exactly an hour. He again expressed tht pleasure it gave him to be present, and Btatad he hoped such visits would be repeated in future. The wants of the native people would thus be ascertained. He recognised how difficult it was for the people to assemble in large towns, away from their settlements, to wait on Ministers. It therefore gave him special pleasure to be there, and he might add the Premier of the colony would himself have liked to be there with him, but the pressure of public business was too great. He could assure them that Mr. Stout took as keen an interest in the welfare ot the native race as he did, and the Government were anxious to establish and maintain good relations with the whole of the native people. They felt that this could only be done by taking them into their confidence, for they knew that no one was so capable of understanding what was best for the people as were the people themselves. It was, however, necessary that in the enactment of laws for their welfare they should receive the assistance of the Government. The Government wished them to understand that when laws were made they were not made for one race, but for the people as a whole. He was pleased to hear the sentiments expressed by Major Kemp with regard to the disposal of native land, the more so as these sentiments had long been his own. It was right that the land should be administered and disposed of for the benefit of the people, and the owners of the land. A monopoly of the land, while benefiting a few, was injurious to the people of both races. It was true that increased population meant increased prosperity, but it was essential that lands should not be held by a few. In some countries they found that, though there was a large population, the land was held by a few persons, and the consequence was that a large portion of the people were pauperised. He would say that the Government desired that the people themselves should join with the Government in administrating their lands. Proceeding to deal with questi ns one and two, Mr. Ballance said he took i) that these were in reality one subject. He thought when the district had been defined the committee should confine its attention and duties to that district. He agreed with Poare as to the necessity of having the boundaries revised, as it was absurd that Otaki natives, who had no interest in their lands and affairs should be on the committee for the Wanganui District. He had power under the law to make the necessary revision, and he would take steps to have the new district established ou his return to Wellington. (Loud applause.) He asked them to settle the boundaries of the district amongst themselves. As to the power given to the Native Committees, that was a large question, and would have to be carefully considered by the Government. He thought the committees might do a great deal in the way of ascertainment of titles to land. He had often felt the great loss and inconvenience to which the native people were put by Land Courts being hold only in large centres of population, and he had, therefore, by representations made to the Judges, urged that Courts should move about, and be held near the lands, the titles of which were being investigated. (Applause.) As it was possible that sometimes the committees might be interested in the titles under investigation, it was right there should be an appeal possible, and this purpose the Land Court would answer, and the Court would give legal Sanction to the decisions of tho committees. Referring to subject 3, Mr. Ballauce said the question of a steamer was not one for the Government, but for private individuals, and he was glad to say that a company was likely to be formed at Wanganui. The difficulties in the river were not great, and he thought it likely that the Government would come to their assistance in the way of improving the river. The opening up of the river would greatly increase the value of their lands, and make it a highway for the people in the interior, He agreed that the committees should have some control of the surveys of native lands, but it would be necessary for the Govern, ment to find the money, to be refunded out of the proceeds of the land. In reference to questions 5 and 6, he considered that tho people should have the principal control in the leasing and selling of their lands. He then explained the Act passed last session affecting lands through which the railway was to pass, about which he wanted to remove a false impression abroad amongst natives, that the Government intended to take land five miles on each side of thr iine, while they had simply stopped any private individual from touching land, and thus saved the land to

the owners. The iilausts whioh dealt with lit) means of settling tho laud had been I uIC over until the objects had been explain d to the native people. What the Government proposed now was that when the title '.it a block of laud hail baen ascertained, the owners of that block should have the pc wer of dealing- wi ! ;b it. At, prwu-S where there were only ten names on a grant, and it these were 100 owners, these too often sold the land, and used the proceeds for their own. purposes. But the Government would give the whole 100 a voice in tho disposal of the laud. The owners would meet and elect a committee, which would remain in existonce for say two years, at the end of which a fresh committeo was to be eleoted. In order that the lands might be disposed of in the best manner, Bjards would bo tormed, each to consist of three members—one to be appointod by the Government, and two to be elected by the natives. Money would bo spent for roads and surveys on blocks for sale in accordance with the decisions of the Boards, tho refund to be made to the Government out of the proceeds. After explaining the advantages of leasing the land, Mr. Ballance spoke about the railway, which, ho said, the natives should be glad to welcome, as It would enhance the value of their lands enormously. He thanked Komp and Paorou for assisting the surveyors. Respecting the laud taken for the railways, h» assured the owners that the Government wanted only two chains or so in width along tho route, that it would be paid for, and that none would be taken without payment, unless they chose to make it a present to the Government. The Government intended affording the natives the opportunity of taking small contracts on the line when commenced at Wanganui, Referring to the West Coast Peace Preservation Act, Mr. Ballance said it was not the intention of the Government to revive it, as they did not object to the West Coast natives passing up and down, and holding meetings, provided they kept within the bounds of the law. If they did not, the Government were powerful enough to maintain law aud order. Tawhiao's trip home, and his petitions to Lord Derby were allowed, to show the natives that it was useless going to England for redress, an the petitions had been sent back to the Governor, and then referred to the Native Minister. With regard to gold prospecting, he had come to the conclusion that it was not a matter so much for the Government as for the natives themselves, and in future he would refer applicants to the committee. In concluding his speech, ho said that the Government intended to legislate for the benefit of the people of both races, and not be influenced by the land sharks. It was his intention to visit the people in various parts of the Island, "'Hen all subjects affecting the welfare of the people would no doubt bo discussed. He resumed his seat amidst loud applause. Some of the chiefs then spoke, all expressing satisfaction 7/ith the remarks of the Native Minister ; and Kemp, in addition to this, requested that a road should be made from Ranana to Murimotu, so that produce, instead of going to Napier, would go to Ranana, and thence by steamer to Wanganui. Mr. Ballance promised to lay the matter before his colleague, the Minister of Public Works. , The greater part of the korero was over on the evening of Thursday.