PARLIAMENT OUT OF SESSION.

Lyttelton Times, Volume LXI, Issue 7222, 23 April 1884, Page 4 (Supplement)

PARLIAMENT OUT OF SESSION.

THE PREMIER AT HAWERA.

HAWEEA, April 7.

There was a large meeting to-night to hear the Premier, the Mayor in the chair. Major Atkinson said he did not propose to occupy much time in discussing what was past, because there were many questions awaiting solution of the very greatest importance, upon which tho electors must make up their minds, if that solution was to be satisfactory. When he had last addressed the electors, Mr Montgomery, leader of a section ot the Opposition, had been breathing out threatenings of slaughter against the Government, announcing what he would do in certain cases, and what he would not do in others. When the session began the work of the Government was all_ ready, but he had to complain that during the session the Opposition entirely failed in their duty. There was not one real debate, not one real principle ever discussed properly; but all that the Opposition was apparently bent upon was to catch the Government tripping upon some little point, and, if possible, get a snap vote against them. It was a matter of great regret that there was not an Opposition capable of doing its duty to the country. After the terrible picture which had been drawn of the state of the country, it was only reasonable that he should give some account of THE FINANCES.

There would be a deficit upon the operations of the last financial year. Possibly, it might amount to £170,000. This appeared to frighten a great many persons. No doubt, it was to ha regretted, but to talk of it as a serious matter, in the way in which the critics of tha Government talked of it, seemed to _ him to he entirely a misapprehension of the meaning of the present position of the Colony. The deficit did not equal the amount of the Property tax which was remitted the year before last, together with tbe cost of the Armed Constabulary, which in that year, for the first time, was thrown upon the Consolidated Revenue. But he justified his action in remitting that taxation on the ground that it was the duty of the Treasurer to take from the people in any one year no more than was absolutely required. There was no doubt that the very considerable falling off in the price of wool had contributed largely to the deficit which had occurred. Customs had not come up to the estimate by about £120,000. The net receipts from railways were £BO,OOO short. Postal was £20,000 short; stamps had reached the estimate. The falling off need not disturb the colonists, but if they were wise they would look the question of ways and means in the face. The deficiency in Customs was partly owing to savings on the part of the people. The loss on wool amounted to something like £400,000, because all the expenses had to come out of the reduced amount received. The £400,000 represented income and profit absolutely lost, and no doubt had a depressing effect upon the Customs. If wool had not fallen, the Customs revenue would have reached the estimate. The frozen meat trade had made up the loss to some extent, but it had increased the value of flocks rather than added to the revenue for the year; it was added to capital rather than income. The falling off in railways had arisen because the tariff was undoubtedly too low. The increase in expenditure owing to deterioration had not yet reached its maximum, nor would it do so for nearly two years. The net receipts were less than expected by £60,000, while the expenses had exceeded the estimate by £20,000. As to the direction in which savings could be made, there was first

THE CIVIL BEEVICE. Last session Government promised reform, and that had engaged their attention for months. The expenditure on the Civil Service was high, owing to the population of the Colony being scattered, and there being a necessity for four or five governing centres, and the people being desirous of having conveniences at their doors. Colonists must consider whether they would give up certain conveniences, or submit to further taxation. Excluding the railways, the expenditure on salaries, wages, and certain departmental expenses, amounted to about .£460,000, - and the three departments of Justice, Customs, and Post and Telegraph, amounted to .£237,000. It would be seen that there was not much margin left for reduction of expenditure. The Customs at the present time were collected more cheaply than the English Customs, and no appreciable reduction was possible in that department. Neither was there in Post and Telegraphs. As to the Justice department, there might be a reasonable increase in fees, so that at present it should not cost the State .£20,000 a year to enable traders to collect their debts. As to the service generally it,was at the present time on the whole efficient, and contained many men who would be a credit to any service in the world. The scheme of Government was, however, shortly this; To reduce Under-Sec-retaries to a definite number, to be fixed by law, about eight, and group the departments under them; no fresh department to be created without the express consent of Parliament. The clerks in the service would be divided into grades, each grade to have its maximum and minimum salaries, all persons to enter as cadets after under going competitive {examination, and advance from one grade to another, to bo decided on, after examination, as to the person's fitness for the particular office. This would ensure a cheap and efficient service, and make it thoroughly contented. There must be pensions and retiring allowances. There was a great objection to pensions as regulated under the old system, but there was a great difficulty, and it was making itself felt in the railway service owing to the impossibility of getting rid of men who had faithfully done their duty, but were past service. There was also a difficulty in providing promotion. The result was that abler men sought employment for their abilities outside the service. He hoped the House would consent to the < scheme to compel civil servants to , make contributions to a fund which would make provision for

them when they should become unfit for work, tho same as was done in the Indian Civil Service with such great advantage to the service and the public. Tho Aimed Constabulary might bo reduced to 500 men, but it would not be safe below that. As to the question of Charitable Aid and Hospitals, something would have to be done. It would be a fatal mistake to institute anything like a poor-law, to levy rates in different districts for the purpose of maintaining the poor and infirm. It was now costing something like .£IOO,OOO for Charitable Aid and Hospitals, perhaps more. He favoured the idea of Hospitals being supported as of old, partly by the General Government and partly by the district. Local control was wanted, but even that was not always sufficient. He wanted to see nn end put to the system of referring everything to Government; and if the electors would only take this matter up, a large sum might be saved, and they would once more evoke that spirit of charity which was of the greatest importance. With regard tc charitable aid, and the support of the old and widows who had been left by their husbands, that for the present must he administered by the General Government, not by benevolent societies, whose work should be that of giving temporary assistance to these who wanted aid for the time being from their neighbours, rather than permanent assistance from the Government. Something like ,£50,000 a-year might be saved by reforming the hospital and charitable aid system, and the people of the Colony would be all the better for it. EDUCATION SYSTEM. As to the education system, the people of the country were proud of it, but it cost a great deal. The coat of primary education was £384,000, of which £21,000 came from reserves and the balance from the Consolidated Fund. The cost of secondaryschools, excluding fees, was £26,000, of which £22,500 came from reserves and £3500 from the Consolidated Revenue ; and Colleges and Universities coat also £26,000, of which £BOOO came from the Consolidated Revenue and £IB,OOO from the reserves. So that the total cost of education from the Consolidated Fund was £384,000, and that was exclusive of interest on money spent in buildings. Since 1876 £600,000 had been spent on buildings, yet the necessities of the position had not been overtaken, for in some districts there was not sufficient sitting-room for the children, and the applications from the School Boards amounted to three times the money at the disposal of Government. If the interest on this £600,000 and an allowance for depreciation for buildings (another £30,000) were added, it would he seen that the expenditure on education was something like £400,000 a year, without making any provision for new buildings, on which £50,000 was spent last year, £82,000 the previous year, and in respect of which there were now demands for £150,000 to meet what were termed by the Boards necessary requirements. The education given was not more than was demanded by the people of the country, and he saw ne way of reducing expenditure so long as the present demands were kept up. To give the education given at present, whether it was given through private people or through the State, could not be done for less. The only opening he saw for reducing expenditure was by withdrawing the extra grant of 5s to the Boards, but that would only be some £15,000 or £16,000 a year, and the difficulty was that probably the first schools which would have to suffer would be the small country schools; and it would be unwise to do anything which would prevent people who went out to cultivate the land obtaining a reasonable education for their children. The amount set apart for educational buildings out of the last three million loan was exhausted, and he did not think that the House would borrow more money for such a purpose. The question was whether the money for building more schools should be borrowed, raised by general taxation, or by local rates. He thought that one of the two latter courses would have to he adopted. If the school age of children were raised from five to seven, there would he a saving of something like £50,000 a year, but this would fall principally upon the small country schools. It might be worthy of consideration whether there should not be a difference of treatment as between the larger centres of population and country districts. Speaking for himself, but not for the Government, he must say he was not satisfied with the present system, but he knew he was in a minority, and that tho electors of the Colony were determined to maintain the present system as it was, cost what it would.

The charge for interest and sinking fund on loans was between £1,500,000 and £1,000,000 a year. During last year, by the conversion of loans, £30,000 a year had been saved, and as the (Imperial Government did not require further payment of sinking fund on the guaranteed loan of 1856, another £IO,OOO had been saved, in all £40,000, just the amount payable in respect of the last £1,000,000 loan.

INCREASED RAILWAY RATES. He then referred to the increase of railway rates, and defended the action, of Government. The rates were reduced some time ago as an experiment, the revenue at that time from other sources being elastic, but the experiment had not proved a success. In the Home Country a slight reduction of fares added another class to the travelling public, and increased revenue was the result, but experience had shown that the population of New Zealand was not yet sufficiently large for the same thing to bo experienced here. The rates had therefore to be increased again, the Government being driven to this course by the circumstance that, white month by month there was a loss on the lines, other revenue was also falling. The railways were not returning 2 per cent, and if the low rates had been continued there would have been £50,000 to £60,000 more of a deficiency to make up. Government had power to raise the rates, and ho ventured to say that Parliament and the country would say that Government had only acted right in doing as they had done. The country, ho believed, was determined the lines should pay so long as the tariff was not made burdensome. The Canterbury people had made the mistake of persuading themselves, or allowing themselves to bo persuaded, that the lines

were local property, for that was the point which underlay tho whole of the agitation. Apply that to the Post Offices and Telegraph Offices and Justice Department and the result would be a splitting up of the Colony into little districts, weak districts being allowed to do the best they could, while strong ones grow stronger. What was the Public Works system for if not to open up weak parts of the Colony. Strong ones did not require such assistance. If it was argued that directly a district was populous enough to make the railways pay 4 or 5 per cent, all profit above that was to go into the pockets of the people in that district, then it must be acknowledged that New Zealand people were not prepared to do their duty as colonists, but were inerely striving to secure particular benefits to each of their own little districts. This was another repetition of the old claim that the Land Fund belonged to the people of particular districts, rather than to the people of Now Zealand. He held that the railways of New Zealand belonged to the people of New Zealand, and that the profits were to go into the pockets of the people of New Zealand rather ban into those of people residing in particular districts. If the farmers of Canterbury ten, or even six, years ago had been told that their grain would be carried at the rates now charged, they would have been perfectly contented. In the old Provincial days the charge for carrying a ton of wheat 30 miles was 8s 3d, whereas at the present time it was 7s Bd. Was not that a low and reasonable rate P Under the rates before the recent increase there was no profit to the Government. There might be if the grain traffic had lasted all the year round. The traffic was peculiar, for it was confined to three months in the year, and very heavy expense was necessary to meet the requirements of the farmers at that particular time. He and the other members of the Government had gone into the matter as carefully as possible, and he was certain the Colony would not make much out of the grain traffic, even at the increased rates. The amount of increased revenue from class E, which included grain, was £4p,000, while other classes made up the increase to £IIO,OOO. Tho railway revenue during the current year would be but three per .cent on the cost of the railways, and the money to build them cost about five per cent. He ventured to say that the electors of the Colony would not be satisfied with less revenue from the lines than 3 per cent. As to a non-political Board, it might be necessary, if Government were'liahle to he turned out of office because they framed a tariff which would make the lines yield four per cent upon their cost. If a non-political Board were set up, he ventured to think that the direction given to it would be that the lines should be made to pay so much per cent, and that the Board, acting like a Company, would not fix differential rates to suit particular parts of the Colony, but would get their revenue from wherever it might be obtained. He sympathised with the Canterbury farmers under their present circumstances, but he was convinced that when they came to look at the question fairly, and to compare the amount payable by them with that charged Tor all other goods, they must admit that the charge was reasonable, and had not been imposed in any arbitrary spirit. Mr Montgomery had told the people that this was class taxation, but if he dared to put that view before the House in a resolution, it would be negatived by a very large majority. Having directed attention to those matters in which there might be a saving of expenditure or additions to revenue, he wbuld point out that everything rested with the people themselves. Democratic countries were not usually economical countries. Members of the House would talk by the hour about the desirability of reductions in every possible direction, but the moment you put your finger on a policeman, you were told that the country was going to be ruined. It all rested with the people. They must tell their members what they would have, and what they would not have. In season and out of season, he had preached that the responsibility rested with the electors, but he could not get them to believe it. As the Parliament so the Government. If the people insisted upon their members studying economy, economy would be studied. He had said that there was, in the deficit, nothing to frighten or dispirit the people. He had come to the conclusion that there was

NO BEAL DEPRESSION, that the Colony was perfectly sound, and that the spending power of the people had not been seriously diminished. There was no doubt that there was severe commercial depression. The Customs returns showed that on luxuries, such as spirits, tobacco, and English ale the falling off was about 3 per cent, whereas the falling off on necessaries of life was about 10 per cent, from which he drew the conclusion that the people had become less wasteful in the necessities of life, but that there had been no serious diminution in the spending power. The deposits in the Savings Banks had fallen off by £75,000, as compared with the previous year; but, on the other hand, the deposits in other banks had increased by £300,000, although the Government deposits had decreased during that time by £140,000, so that it would seem that the people had not to draw upon their savings. He spoke in a general way, being aware that many influences affected these calculations. Ho also pointed to the fact that there was little or no diminution in building in the country, that fresh lands were being taken up for cultivation, that large sums were being spent on amusement, especially horse-racing, which seemed to indicate that when people wanted to spend money there was always plenty of spare cash to, bo found. The payors of Property tax had increased by 2400, as compared with the previous valuation; still the fact remained that there was a great deal of commercial depression which ho set down to over-trading, over-importation, and a tendency on the part of persons to take up more land than they could profitably use. In reference to the private indebtedness of the Colony, he pointed out that while the mortirages amounted to £30,000,000, of which £15,000,000 was advanced by Colonials, the value of real property in the Colony was £100,000,000.

and the mortgages were therefore about 30 per cent of the value of the property as against nearly 60 per cent in Great Britain. He thought the position of the Colony was not so terrible as was represented by that class of persons who cried “ Wolf ! wolf ! ” ELECTORAL LAW AND LAND TENURE. As to tho policy of the Government, he had already pointed out what they were doing in regard to the Civil Service. In respect to the question of electoral law, he might state, without going into details. Government had come to the conclusion that the larger towns should at any rate be consolidated into single electorates. The reason for that was that small electorates were more likely to be led away by mere local consideration, and •he believed that the step proposed by Government would be taken with the entire approval of the different divisions of towns, and would give more general satisfaction than the present system. In towns it was recognised that the electoral rolls were in a very unsatisfactory condition, and proposals would he made to Parliament to secure the periodical purging of these rolls, and to make better provision for striking off the names of those persons who were not entitled to be on them. With reference to the land policy of Government, it had been their endeavour to see whether a better title could not he found than that of the ordinary freehold tenure. All who had considered the question, knew that it was agitating the minds of men in almost all communities. In the Old Country it had been necessary to limit the power of contract between landlord and tenant, and when once yon had got to that it was only a question of degree, and not of principle, as to the right of the State to interfere in freehold title. Government, with the approval of Parliament, had been trying the experiment of perpetual leasing, as well as that of deferred payment, but of course the deferred payment system was practically only a deferred freehold, and, as far as he was able to judge, freehold tenure was not giving satisfaction: at any rate, in the old countries, where population was thick. What woujd be the ultimate tenure, it was impossible* to say. Land would not be cultivated unless the cultivator had an absolute title. He must secure tbe whole of his work on the land, and he must have such a tenure that he could not he dispossessed so long as he was doing his duty by the land. Sentiment had a good deal to do the matter, and there must be very careful consideration before a determination was, or could be, come to. There had been a very violent wrench in Ireland, when the Settled Estates Act of 1846 had been passed, and when the Irish Land Act had been passed a few years ago. There was no desire to have such a violent wrench here, but seeing that there was such a large portion of the Crown lands which they could yet deal with as they pleased, they would be wise to see whether a title could not be found which would give more generalsatisfaotionthan afreehold. Nothing rash need be done, but let them proceed as Englishmen, always by reasonable experiment, and then presently they might be able to come to some conclusion, which would be satisfactory to every one. A very great deal had been done in the way of settlement within the last three or four years, upwards of 11,000 persons having taken up land in the country, a very satisfactory result, he thought, of the land system, which the Minister of Lands had been giving such attention to. The pastoral Crown lands were yielding a very good rent indeed. There would he no difficulty at all in selling them to-morrow, for they were much appreciated, hut Government had come to the. conclusion that it would he a great mistake to part with another acre of pastoral land, and they would ask Parliament to prohibit the sale of any more. If a better tenure were given, larger rents would be received, and by that means a very grateful addition to the revenue would accrue, and the taxation of the people be relieved.

NATIVE POLICY. As to the Native policy, there were some politicians and some newspapers that were perpetually telling the Colony that there was no such thing as a Native difficulty. Government had greatly succeeded in removing that difficulty, it was true, but very little mismanagement would would create a fresh difficulty. Certain politicians represented that if they dismissed the Constabulary and let the Natives alone things would be perfectly safe and the whole country greatly advantaged, but he replied that any shrinking from firmness and justice would bring on difficulties again. A great deal of our difficulty with the Natives arose from their fear, on the one hand, of losing their land, and, on the other, of their desire to be the dominant power in particular parts. Government believed that the present way of dealing with Native lands was most unsatisfactory ; that it had altogether failed in the object which Parliament had in view whenit threw open Native land to general purchase; and Government thought the only solution of the difficulty would be for the Crown to resume the pre-emptive right, and they would ask Parliament to resume the right under certain conditions of which the Native Minister would speak before very long. The general idea was that the Natives should be permitted to sell thoir land through the officers of Government who sell the Crown lands generally, or that they should be allowed to sell land to Government direct, but that payment should not all be made in cash, but that some of it should be deferred. This would ho n groat revolution in the North Island, and was a matter on which parties might fall. It seemed to him the only means by which they could get rid of the difficulty, and at the same time get the North Island rapidly settled.

PUBLIC WORKS. As to Public Works and Immigration, the question was whether there was to be further borrowing. That was a question which Government at present had not considered, and on which, at the present time, ho was not prepared to express an opinion, and for this reason—there was still another million to be raised, and it was impossible to say what would be the position when that was Spent, or what the requirements of the Colony, Looking at the fact that the three million loan was not intended to complete all the

•works in hand, it seemed to him that further borrowing at some time would be necessary, but before they borrowed further they should look very carefully into the necessity for it, well consider the means of paying interest, and also carefully tic up the money for particular works. The difficulty Government had was to withstand pressure for expenditure. A coming difficulty was the means of keeping up expenditure on open lines. If money was not to be borrowed for this purpose how was station accommodation to be increased or rolling stock obtained ? In connection with public works, there was the main trunk line to Auckland. Its importance could not be exaggerated, and Government hoped to be able to make representations to Parliament with a view to its being pushed on as rapidly as possible. The Minister of Public Works would personally inspect the proposed routes. At present, no Minister had made up his mind on the subject, for as in duty bound they were simply anxious to find which would be the best line for the country generally. As to the deficit. Government felt the time had gone by for adding a deficit to the permanent debt of the Colony, and some provision would have to be made to meet the deficit of which he had spoken. the eedbeation question. On the question of Federation, he pointed out that the French Government were laying claim to pretty well all the islands in the South between New Zealand and Panama, and had only recently claimed an island named Eapa, which had a wonderful harbour, and lay right in the path of steamers from Panama to New Zealand. The Panama Canal would be finished in a few years, and the question was. Was the high road to the old world to be at tbe mercy of a foreign nation ? The difficulty was that the Imperial Government would listen to nothing hut the united voice of Australasia. What, then, were the colonists to do ? The Canadian Federation was impossible, but was it not desirable for colonists to federate, in order to prevent these islands being seized and populated with French criminals ? It was said that New Zealand should manage its own business, instead of going in for Federation—but he claimed that it was their business to see to this matter, and as wise men, they should direct their attention to this important question. If New Zealand did not join the Australian Colonies, there would be Australian Federation, and New Zealand would have nothing to say in the control of islands in which she was seriously interested.

He next referred to the policy of the Opposition ; and said that although Mr Montgomery was to speak on Thursday evening, the Colony would be none the wiser, for undoubtedly the real power in the Opposition was Sir G. Grey. Solar as he could make out, the policy of the Opposition was expressed in the cry of what advantages the Colony would get if the Opposition were entrusted with power. He ridiculed Mr Macandrew’s idea of a united Colony with financial separation, and said it was impossible to devise a practicable scheme which would be fair to both Islands. The same idea was expressed in Mr Montgomery’s defeated motion of last session, during the discussion on which he (Major Atkinson) had pointed out there was no finality in the proposal, because if it were carried it would at once be proposed to divide the Colony up into smaller divisions. The proposal implied distrust of the people, because, at the present time, under existing legislation, the people of the Colony had full power to make the North Island and South Island two Counties. The tendency at present was towards disintegration, by splitting up Counties, but he had no doubt that in a short time the tide would turn, and that under the Act at present in force. Counties would be amalgamated and become strong bodies. He denied that there was any power now exercised by the General Government which could with more advantage be exercised by local bodies; but if it could be shown that there was, he should be in favour of transferring it. No country in the world had more complete or sufficient local government than New Zealand. After a declaration that he should seek no other constituency than that of Egmont, he concluded by again impressing the necessity of economy in public affairs and the need for the Colonists to get rid of the false idea that gentility was confined to indoor employments. That was one of the first effects of the Education system, but it would not be lasting. The time would come when the dignity of labour would be recognised, and when it would be esteemed more honourable to be a good mechanic or farmer than a mere clerk. That change in public opinion could only be effected by each in his pwn sphere doing his best in that direction. If they only determined to live within their means and to he really economical, then they would have in the near future, as great prosperity as they ever had enjoyed, much sounder prosperity, perhaps, and be realising that which the best men were looking for with eager hearts: the condition of a happy, contented, and prosperous people. The usual vote of confidence was passed. HAWEEA, April 8.

Replying to questions last night. Major Atkinson said ha held that presently the Colony would revert to denominationalism in modified forms in the large centres of population. He did not think the country was yet ripe for the change, but he did not doubt that it would shortly come to it. As to the totalisator, he disapproved any public recognition of gambling. The matter had not yet been considered by the Cabinet, but enquiries would be made, and if Government found that the totalisator was the evil it was represented to be. Parliament must deal with the matter.

Major Atkinson was interviewed this morning ro trunk railway, but he only repeated what he had said in his speech the previous evening.