DR HOCKEN'S TREASURES.

Evening Star, Issue 12872, 23 July 1906, Page 4

DR HOCKEN'S TREASURES.

Representatives of the Early Settlers' Association and Art Gallery Trustees conferred, this morning with citizens who desire to see Dr Hocken's offer taken advantage of. The meeting was convened by the Mayor (Mr Lawrence), and held in his room. The Mayor presided, supported by the Town Clerk (Mr Richards), •and those who attended in response to the circular were Mrs George M'Lean, Mr Donald Reid, Mr G. Joachim, Mr John Duthie, Mr A. Bathgate, Mr G. C. Proudfoot, Mr T. Brown, Mr M. Cohen, Mr J. A. Bunaside, Mr C. B. Smith, Dr Scott, and Dr Hocken. His Worship said that he had called the meeting with a view of bringing together representatives of bodies who were interested in acquiring for the City Dr Hocken's library ancf collection of early' history records. It was thought that possibly an arrangement could be made, by agreement as Jjetween the Art Gallery Trustees and The Early Settlers' Association, for providing housing for the collection on the site jointly held by the Trustees and the Association. Mr Bathgate said that so far as the Art Gallery Trustees were concerned their primary object was to get the Art Gallery completed.- The first plan prepared showed room for extension at the rear and at one side, but that plan was taken exception to by the Early Settlers' Association, and the architect (Mr Burnside) had been requested to remodel his sketch. The effect of that was to give the extra accommodation the Early Settlers' Association required, but this meant that tho Art Gallery building would be further to the south, and deprived of extension behind. Notwithstanding that drawback, the new plans would no doubt be accepted by the Trustees. But the only ground left for extending tho Art Gallery would be to the south. So that the Trustees could not, he thought, accept any further modification. -The Aft Gallery and the Early Settlers' Association would have one building in so far that their pemises would join, but in that way only. The two places would be separated by a party walk and it was quite possible that the Art Gallery would be up and occupjed before the Early Settlers' building was begun, or vice versa. The Trustees had every sympathy with the movement to provide for Dr Hocken's collection, and did not wish to throw any obstacles in the way, but the position was as he had put it. Even supposing the site suggested was suitable, there were practical difficulties in the way. One was the question of maintenance. Granted that tho money came to hand for the building, the promoters would havo to face the cost of maintenance, tho salary of a. custodian, the expense of printing a catalogue, etc., and with insurance he should think that from £350 to £4OO a year would be a very low estimate of the annual expenditure. How was that to bo provided ? If by endowment it would require a fund of about £IO,OOO. Possibly the City Corporation might undertake the maintenance, but it was an aspect of the question that shotdd not bo lost sight of. Mr D. Reid suggested that it might be as well, before going into these questions, to ask Dr Hocken to state whether he offered his collection and upon what conditions. Thev seemed to be assmninsr all that. " b

Mt Batfigate «ud that <hat struck bim too. They aid not laiow exactly what Dr Hocken's views were, and the first step should be to get a specific offer from Dr Hocken. What be (Mr Bathgate) wus going on to say when Mr lleid rose was that as it appeared to him the most practical solution of the difficulty would be to apply to the Government to complete the Museum and honso the collection there. Tho Museum being in charge of an educated man as curator> the question of custody would be ended. This claim could reasonably be made, since the gift, though nominally to Dunedin, would be really a gift to the colony, available to students from everywhere. But tho Art Gallery Trustees would, lie thought, fall in with any reasonable schemo so long as the interests of the Art Gallery wero not sacrificed.

Tbe Mayor said he was under the impression that Dr Hockon had offered his collection, but perhaps tho doctor would bo kind enough to state the conditions. Dr Hockon said it was his intense desire thai, the collection should remain in Dtraedin. where lie bad spent most of his lifetime, but he felt very positive about this: that it must be thoroughly looked after and thoroughly housed in, every way. When be first made tlio offer, about seven years ago, tbe citizens who then knew of it showed him two rooms in which thoy thought tho collection could be stowed—yes, "stowed" was the word—in the Colonial Bank Building. His heart fell within him when Ik> heard this, because be recognised that the gentlemen who mentioned it did not understand tho gift. Mr Bathgate's suggestion did not go much further when be proposed the Museum and the curator. That sit© was a good one, but tbe suggestion to put the collection in the hands of the curator would not do. The curator had too much to attend to now, and he could not possibly give sufficient care to the collection. Several persons had asked what be considered the value of the library and the collection. Well, he naturally did not like to speak of monetarv matters when offering a gift, but it was perhaps right that ho should give some indication to prevent misunderstanding. He had never put a money value on his collection—it was to bin beyond a money value.; but some fifteen or" sixteen years ago Sir Walter Buller inspected it and asked what he (Dr Hockon) thought its value was. He answered that he did not know, whereupon Sir Walter Bullor said it was worth at the least £IO,OOO. Since then the collection had been added to immensely, and if worth £IO.OOO when Sir Walter Buller saw it-well, he did not care to appraise it, but ho slwnld say it was now worth many more thousands of pounds. As regarded housing, in his first letter on the subject to Mr Cohen he suggested that the representatives of the Art Gallery, the Early Settlers, and the Free Library might put their heads together and make a common, purse, and thus get a handsome building which would serve' tho threefold purpose. The three things seemed to link themselves together in some ways. There was, for instance, a great deal of real art in bis collection. It included 400 or 500 interesting and valuable pictures—4ie did not mean paintings in tho ordinary sense of the phrase but things thai were worth displaying to show the early history of the colony. Tiie oldest map, for ©sample, dated back to 1825 ; then there were plans diawn for tho New Zealand Company, got up in beautiful stvle; al?o about 150 framed pictures. These sort of things would take a deal of room. He still thought that this original suggestion of Ins was a good one; and ho would urge that a few competent gentlemen should be selected to see the collection, and say whether ib was worth much or not. He might be making a white swan of a gcose, and it would be assuring to get an independent opinum. Local gentlemen could no doubt be got to act, bat they also might be a Sittle pMjudiced in favor of the collection, so he agreed with Mr Cohen that it would b3 better to get outsiders. He stfll thought that though the Free Library building had been commenced his idea could be carried out. As regarded the Art Gallery Trustees, this scheme was proposed months ago, tod he said ho was quite willing to accept it, his only concern being that the collection should be properly housed; but he had never heard & word froan the Trustees, thia showing, ag it appeared to him, tiie comparatively little wtenest that was taken in the project. He was exceedingly anxious that Dunedui should have the gift if it was deemed "worth while, and he thought thai tie fchieo bodies should join and pot up a handsome btifldmg of two storeys. He thought two storeys preferable. Someone had objected that the stairs would be too Hatch for old people, Vat old people fowned only d portion of those vhoni he hoped would value the collection and use it He still held that the three bodies should unite for tho purpose, that a Government grant should bo given, seeing that this was really a colonial matter, and that a building should be erected either on the joint site or on the Museum ate. Mr Bathgate remarked tihafc no proposal had ever been made bV Dr Hoeken or any-

tees in regard tp housing this collection. Ifc was mentioned incidentally at one of the Trustees' meetings, but m such a way that he never bought there was a duty to communicate with Dr Hocken or anybody else. The Trustees were not slighting Dt Hocken. Perhaps it would help if Dr Hocken could give an idea of the space required and the cost. Dt Hocken replied that Mr Burnside might be able to say. Dr Scott: Cannot you give some idea by the size of the Choral or some other tedl? Dr Hocken said the collection would fill' a place quite the size of the Choral Hall. Dr Scott: That would be 45ft x 60ft. The Mayor remarked that if the rough plan prepared was to scale there was plenty of space for a room 80ft x 60ft. If the three parties joined to put up one building . it could be done for comparatively little extra cost. Then if the Government would come in and have the Tourist Bureau in the same block this would be a handy arrangement. The Government might be asked for a £ for £ subsidy, this being a national scheme, and also to take over the collection and manage it with the Tourist Bureau. Mr D. Reid asked what the three bodies were whom the mayor referred to. Tiie Mayor replied that he meant the Art Gallery Trustees, the Early Settlers' Association, and those who were acting in the interests of Dr Hocken's gift. Mr Reid: I thought you meant to include the Free Public Library. The Mayor: No, that cannot be one of them. Mr Bathgate said that by the terms of Mr Carnegie's gift that could not be dona. Mr Cohen endorsed this. Mr D. Beid said lie thought he could undertake to say, on behalf of his Associxition, that they would fiud room for Df Hocken's collection without encroaching on the Art Gallery spaoe. Mr Brown said that the Art Gallery Trustees were fully in sympathy with the movement, but they held for a specific purpowe money that had been given by tha people and tho Corporation and the Government, and it could not be spent otherwise than for the purpose for which it was given. Mr Reid repeated that there was ampk room on the site for Dr Hocken's collection; in fact-, each party seemed to be at present spreading its wings as much aa possible in order to go down another floor when funds were available. He would like to see a stately building erected worthy of the three objects and worthy of the City. As to the Museum site, it was to be recollected thai this collection was not to be for the people of Dunedin alone, "but for the people of Otago and of New Zealand ai large, and the place where the collection was housed should meet the eye as one alighted from a train instead of having to be searched for in the wilderness.

Mrs M'Lean said the position of the Art Gallery Trustees was that they had not yet enough money to complete £heir own buildingj and it was quite impossible to help this or any other movement, but the housing of Dr Hocken's collection was a scheme that had their hearty good-will. Mr Reid remarked that 100 ft in depth by 60ft in width could be spared at the present site, and if they had Dr Hocken's assurance that that space would do the best thing would be to ask the Premier to apply to Parliament for a vote.

Mr Bathgate endorsed what had been said by Mr Brown and Mrs M'Lesn that the trustees simply had no money to spend on purposes outside their own function. Ho thought tho businesslike step would be to-; convene a, meeting of those interested, apart from tho Art Gallery and Early Settlers, and appoint a small committoo to ascortain the exact nature of the offer and get an estimate as to tho cost of building and all details. Mr Cohen observed that nearly all who had -written in favor of the Hocken scheme wcro prepared to subscribe, and if Dr Hocken would be satisfied with, a com-. modions room properly lighted bat not architecturally ornamented, such a piaca could bo fonnd between the Art G*Ueni and the Early Settlers' building. He waj satisfied that the money could bo got ii asked for in a business way. Mr 0. R. Smith mentioned that the subject had never been formally boforo tho trustees of the Art Gallery. It seemed to him that one of the first steps should be the formation of a responsible body to undertake the work in connection -with Br Hocken's collection.

Mr J. A. Burnside (architect) stated thai the space which Mr Donald Reid spoke of as available would give room for tho collection.

After further discussion it was resolved, on tho motion of Mr D. Reid, seconded bt Mr Cohen, that the Mayor and Messrs \f Cohen, T. Brown, J. Duthie, D. Reid, a! Bathgate, and Dr Hoeken, with tho members of Parliament representing the City, and Crs Loudon, Walker, Arkle, Crust, and Burnett bo a committee of citizens to interview the Premier upon his arrival in Dunedin.