THE OTAGO CENTRAL RAILWAY.

Evening Star, Issue 9417, 12 June 1894, Page 2

THE OTAGO CENTRAL RAILWAY.

A conference between members of Parliament and the Executive of the Otago Central Kailway League was held last night in the rooms of the Chamber of Commerce. There were present : Ulembers of the House Messrs I>. 1 iukerton, W. Earnshaw, W. Hutchison, A. Morrison, J. A. Millar, and W. Eraser; members of the Executive—Messrs W. B.uron (chairman), C. K. Chapman, J. Rattray, T. Brown, O. L. Denniston, A. Bathgate, C. S. Reeves, L. M. Shaw, and J. Gore. Mr John Stronacli, chairman of the Vincent County Council, was also present. Apologies were read for the absenca of Mr Fish, Mr A. Burt, Mr Sligo, Mr Carncross, M.H.R., and Mr J. Green, M.H.R. The lastnamed member wrote: "I will have much pleasure in assisting the other Otago members to get the railway pushed on to Eweburn as quickly as possible."

Mr Barron said that the Executive had established the custom of asking members of Parliament to meet them just before the session, because they thought it a good tiling to keep the railway ia front, not altogether in a spi; it of faultfinding, but rather in a spirit of vigilance. The line had been opened to Hyde, and the Executive thought that if the)' could get members to interest themselves in having the tunnel pierced and the line opened to some two or three miles beyond that point, it would be something gained, in that wheel traffic would be saved

from the hill. There should be no difficulty in getting that done during the present year. In fact the Government promised to do it nine months ago. although practically nothing had been done yet. Then beyond the tunnel a bridge was necessary across the Taieri, and experience taught them that the sooner this was set about the better—there was so much delay in getting material for bridges. Further, the League thought that members might see that as large a vote as possible was made available during the ensuing year, and above all that the vote should be spent within the financial year. Should the Government make a strong case out of the fact that they were constructing railways out of revenue, and doing as much as possible under the circumstances, members might for answer look up the Bill of 1889, which had in view the setting aside of revenues from lands for the payment of interest on money borrowed from the department?. Much more progress might be made in that way than by getting a small annual vote, and it would be a far better way of constructing the line than by relying on small annual doles. In answer to Mr Hutchison, Mr Bathgate said that the railway would be of no use for heavy traffic till the tunnel referred to had been made. The heavy tiaffic which came to Dunback would continue to go there until the railway was opened beyond the tunnel. Mr Barron answered another question by saving that the cost of the tunnel would, he understood, be £6,0.00 or £7,000. Mr John Stbonacii said that the question of whether the line should be carried another three or four or even twenty miles was a mere bagatelle. If the Otsgo Central was going to stop there it would be practically useless, and might as well have ended at Middlemarch. Unless they brought all the pres-ure they could to bear Central Otago would, be wiped out, having no market for her grain and her fruit, and no outlet of any sort. Every Otago member who neglected the Otago Central was false to his constituents.

Mr Rkkves was of opinion that the League were all wrong and the Government were all wrong' in their ideas on this subject. It was acknowledged that the' North Island Trunk Railway was absolutely necessary, and it was agreed that the Otago Central was also necessary, and yet for the sake of borrowing a few millions in order to complete these lines the colony was languishing. Let them face the matter boldly. We had the laiiway now as far as Hyde. If £45,000 a year were spent on it for the next ten years we should probably see the line to Clyde. That would tap the Upper Clutha Valley, but the pace was too slow. He wanted to see the line past Cromwell. When it did that it would open up to Otago an altogether new province. Was this slow rate of progress they were now making a proper thing for a progressive country ? The idea was monstrous. The League were only pottering With the line, and the Government were doing the same.

Mr Barron said it was not their duty to take up the question of ways and means—that was more properly the business of their representatives in Parliament—but to see that the line was pushed on as quickly as possible, and in his opinion one thing that would help it would be to have specific allocations, as he had mentioned, of one ; third of the revenue from the land, which would mean provision for interest on say £400,000, an amount sufficient almost to complete the line at once. Mr Stkonacii : The land fund cannot afford it, That will never come to pass. Mr Dennjston remarked that in passing through America recently the train in which he travelled had stopped for a fow minutes at a town called Kansas, which owed its existence entirely to the fact that a main line of railway ran through it. Ho did not think the people of New Zealand could know until they tried whxt an immense difference a trunk line of railway would mean to an inland district.

The Chairman said he would like to make a remark or two in answer to what Mr Stronacli had said, and went on to quote from a speech by Sir Harry Atkinson in 1889, after his visit of inspection to the country, remarks by Mr Ballance, then in opposition, and a speech made by the Hon. J. M'lCenzie. These gentlemen then agreed that this allocation now referred to was the best scheme for the line. That was when pommon sense was brought to bear on the question ; but when wretched party feelings arose it was found impossible to give effect to the scheme. Now, however, that things were a bit calmer in the political world, probably manywould agree that a measure of this kind would be really in the interests of the line.

Mr Stronach said he knew all tlat of which the chairman had been speaking, but at the same time nothing had been done. The feeling of the country was that unless they had a loan tho railway would never be constructed. "The, Chairman : The League would not object to the loan as a' league, nor advocate it as a league, tye have always found it to be a bone jjf contention, and have thought better to avoid it.

Mr Rattray thought that the Otaso Central would make no progress worth speaking of in this generation without borrowing, and his advico to their representatives would be to get a two million loin passed through this year. That was a very dangerous game for them to play (Mr Earnshaw: "That is a very mqdest sum.")—because they had to allocate it fairly between the various provinces and between the public works in the various districts, but it could be done if th'ey honestly ,g,nd determinedly Bet about % ■'■■'{

Mr Earnshaw quite agreed with the chairman's remark that the question of ways awl means more properly devolved upon the members than upon the League, and he was very sure that the members did not take up the position as a body to say whether money should be borrowed or not. Ho was strongly of opinion that, as had been said, Dunulin would burst unless this railway was made. She had alrta-iy lost a large amount of her distributing trad*-, and unless she took care to develop her provincial district she would have to be satisfied to become a second-rate city. He was not going to help to bring about that undesirable state of things. Mr Reeves believed that the only thing for them was to go in for borrowing a few millions, aud Mr Kattray had put it down at the modest sum of two millions. Ihe speaker counselled those interested to look the question squarely in the face. There was the Midland Kailway ; they would remember the resolution that was forced through the House with regard to that matter, and they knew the weight of the Canterbury vote respecting that question. Two millions would not give Otago any money at all for the Central. It would take six or seven millions to Go the North Island lines alone, and the North Island members were joined for that purpose. Moreover, Canterbury had made up its mind to go through with the Midland or burst. If the North Island members took up the position that they must have moneys to complete their lines, and insisted on a loan for that purpose, he would say let it rest on them to do so, aud then, in that case, Otago would get as much as if took the loan on her back. As to the scheme for mortgaging, the rents of the pastoral lands in Central Otago, and therebj' getting £15,000 or £16,000 a year, as the chairman had suggested, he would remark that as a matter of fact we had already spent £15,000 a year oil the line, and if moneys were raised in this way Otago would not get another shilling out of votes.—(Several persons present remarked that Mr Earnshaw misunderstood what had been said, the idea being to apply the moneys raised from pastoral rents to the purpose of paying interest on moneys borrowed from the departments.) In that case, Mr Earnshaw said, it would be simply a provincial instead of a national loan; ami did they think the Northern members were going to see Otago get a loan for their line without any loan being raised for the North Island lines? The North Island members would demand a loan as surely as the South Island members did, and that brought them back to the question which he had propounded at first: were they going to force a loan for New Zealand ? He would tell them candidly that while he would force the Government to give a substantial vote for the Otago Central, he for one would not support a loan under present circumstances. For one reason, the announcement of such a thing would bring over 20,000 people from the other side. Mr Stronach : There will be work for them. Mr Earnshaw said that might be, but there would be no work for our own men who were here. He was of opinion that if the Government really wanted to push the line along they would get to Ryan's Crossing next year, and if that weie done he thought the Otago Central people should be sati-fied without thinking about a loan. If the colony did resolve to go in for a loan, he would make one to see that Otago got her fair share; but for many reasons, which it would be perhaps unnecessary to state at that time, he would not go in for a loan at present. He thought that what the members should do was to ask the Government for a vote that would be reasonable, on the understanding that it would be spent, and if the Otago members showed a united front to the Government he had no doubt that substantial votes wou':d be placed on the Estimates. When the Northern members wanted anything they went together to the Government and let them know that if it was not granted the Government would go otf the benches. If the Otago members took up a position of that iort tbe railway would be carried to Kyeu's Crossing in two years' time or less. Mr Stronach : Very slow progress! Mr Earnshaw : You'll not get more. Mr Stbonach : Then we'll do without the railway in our part of the world. Mr Eraser suggested that some expression should be got from members present as to whether they were prepared to work together in order to push on the line as rapidly as possible. l'oor Otago ! She never did pull together, and the result was that came off second best. He for one would do his \ try best to get this line pushed on. The b;st thing the members could do, it seemed to him, after they got to Wellington, was to fo.m themselves into a s'anding committee and agree upon some course of action. They might not agree in. all things, but whatever they did they should all pull together. The question of finance was one that th«y would have to settle i-.i "Wellington. It was no use for those interested to commence talking for and against a loan, one advocating and the other opposing it. That was simply throwing down the apple of discord.

Mr Reeves thought it a pity there was not more political life in Dunedin. There should have been a public meeting in order to tell members whether the people were or were not in favor of a lean for the purpose of finishing necessary railways. No country could expect to progress ■with money so scarce as it here. The Government had no money to lend at less than 6 per cent., whereas in Victoria farmers, could get it at 4 per cent. ; and the banks here asked 8 per cent, for discounts. To say that money was plentiful hce was absurd. The colony should go in for a loan of three millions, and spend £500,000 a year for six years in prosecuting main trunk lines. Till we adopted such a policy the country would never rise from its depression. Mr O. K. Chapman thought the meeting should not discuss the question of borrowing at all. They should ask the Government to allocate a fixed sum for the work this 3'ear, and another sum next year, which would complete the work. He was entirely opposed to borroA'ing. The object of the League should be to get the line pushed on to Ewe'ourn as speedily as possible. Mr Buown was sorry that the League had discussed the question of borrowing at all. Ho was pleased at the able manner in which Mr Earnshaw had grasped the po.-ition. What they wanted was unanimity among the member.-!.

Mr Morrison said that although he was not altogether in love with the Central he was prepared to support the League up to a certain point. He thought it was a mistake carrying the railway in that particular direction, and it would be a number of years before it would pay for axle grease. He had been over the country and had used his eyes; and he believed that after leaving Hyde there was another little garden wall to be stepped over, while a gentleman who had been over the Maniototo Plains told him that that part of the country would require irrigati'-n. He was, however, prepared to sink his own personal opinion and help Ihe Otago members to push on the Central with all the money at their disposal, and ho would make one to bring pressure to bear to get as much for that purpose as possible, without embarrassing the Government. He would not go as far as Mr Earnshaw and follow the Northern members in telling the Government that they would go out if they did not do this and do that. Mr Earnshaw was rather inconsistent. To-day ho pro, osed to say Jo the Government; "If you do not grant us what we want you go off the benches." Lufc two years ago the Government did not tpend all that they had to spend, and Mr Earnshaw did not then tell them that they would have to go. He (Mr Morrison) liked to see a little consistency. He was prepared, as he had said, to assist Otago members to bring pressure to bear on the Government to get as large a vote as possible for the Central, but he would not embarrass the Government. He would be no party to binding himself down to support a loan or to get any amount for the work that the League thought should bo got. The League might leave that to the members. It showed that they had little faith in the members when they wanted to bind them down by a cast-iron resolution, and ho for one refused to bo bound by any resolution of the sort. Mr Hutchison did not think (hey would do any good by proceeding farther with the discussion. He was prepared to say that he would do all he could to further the interests of the Central, and he thought there should be no difficulty in commencing this tunnel within the next few weeks.

Mr Eaknshav.' : I should just like to say a word or two with regard to what has fallen from Mr Morrison. I supported the vote of £30,000 three years ago, considering it was a fair vote under the circumstances. But that vote was not spent. That is what I object to ; that hj what I have objected to right through ; it is what I object to now. Mr Morrison said that that was the first time he had heard that Mr Earnshaw raised any objection on the point. If they searched ' Hansard ' they would find nothing as to his having done so.

Mr Pinkekton said that the whole of the Otago members were as honest as members of the League in their desire to see the Central get its fair share of expenditure, whatever that might be. They had been told that there was a want of unanimity amongst the Otago representatives, but in reality there was a want of unanimity amongst the members of the League themselves. Tliey met together periodically, and each wanted to have his own way. That being so, he asked Where was the unanimity ? He would like to say that ju his opinion one thing that had delayed the line was that its supporters went in too much for engineering. If they were simply to tell the Government that they wanted the line pushed on with all the money that was its fair share they would probably get what they asked. But by saying "we want this bridge gone on with and this tunnel done," and so on, they simply threw obstacles in the way of the Government, who would be guided by sho advice of their engineers in matters of that

sort. That was what any Government would do. This engineering business was the means of delaying the- construction of the line from Middlemarch to Hyde. The League had in the first place misled the Government by saying that no bridges were required, but merely culverts; and then it was discovered that bridges wore wanted after all. He took it that the promoters were not working on right lines. He was perfectly certain that if Otago agreed as to what was wanted they could have a fair share of the available money. All the talk about unanimity went for very little so long as they were not united. He believed, however, that each member was honestly anxious to have the line constructed. As one of them he would do his very best to get as full an amount as the line was entitled to; but in taking that course he should follow it with reason, and would not beone to place obstacles in the way merely for the sak« of putting out one party and bringing in another. We had one party in office for about twenty years, and thirty or forty miles of the line was built; wo had had another party, and in three years they had made about sixteen miles. He did not think there was much to grumble at.

Mr Barron thanked the members for attending and taking part in the discussion. There might be a little want of unanimity as to the way in which things should be done, but all were thoroughly unanimous as to- the need for constructing the line as speedily as possible. He did not quite agree with Mr Pinkerton in his remarks about engineering. The League had formerly found out that bridges which were required were being overlooked by the Government, and but for what had been done in the way of a reminder the line would not now be open to Hyde. The Government would not order material for bridges simply at the suggestion of the League, but on the advice of their own officers, and if the Government did not make the discovery that these bridges were wanted the Government should thank the League for bringing the fact under notice. But there was no need to introduce any. note of discord. They had always found members willing to meet the League, and, although there might be differences of opinion occasionally as to how a thing should be done, it was all the better to meet and talk the matter over, and then leave members to judge as to what was the best to do.