BOARD DEFENDED

Evening Post, Volume CXII, Issue 7, 8 July 1931, Page 5

BOARD DEFENDED

UNEMPLOYMENT BILL

FEIENDLY CRITICS

SECOND READING

One of the most important stages —die second/reading—of the Unern- • ployment Amendment Bill was successfully negotiated in'lhe House, of Representatives a few minutes after ■.midnight.: The "criticism directed at ; the Bill cwas mainly friendly, but ; indications were given' that attempts 'will be made"-to amend it in the . Committee stages. ']'. The Hon,--W.■ Downie ' Stbwart' (Uoform, Dunedin West) said that tho should give somo indication of policy with referone'e to unemployment. It would be of great help "to the/ House if members know what was going to be done with the money -' which was being raised .under, the Bill. ,It was true that> certain ainoiint waa already being done.'by.-, the Lands Department, by. the.,-Public }Vorks De- ;• partment, and, ', tho'4 -Unemployment Board,' but; tho net; result of .that had been that' tho 'public was not satisfied it waagetting'varueforats money. An ■ announcement from the Government as to its future policy'Would'reassure the • public very materially. Itlwould also -be interesting to kriow.Vhbw the Government intended to raise the money 'to subsidise payments"under the Act. 7 Proceeding, Mr.: Stewart said it had 1 been a mattor;,of ; grave- concern to many''that the .^proposed' personnel of • the. Unemployment Board' had not been • indicated, and he felt that the House would be greatly reassured if they ''knew1 who was going tbhavo the control and administration ;of ■ the moneys provided for in the BiU. .He hoped the Minister'would be able to furnish .'the House with vadequate. and sufficient •reasons for maintaining" the fiat levy, a'principle which was causing a great deal of irritation. If women were to be taxed under the Bill, they might "reasonably ask the Government how it ■was proposed to assist-them. If somo form of relief was to .'bo given to the .'women it might be claimed that that i, relief-should be confined to the women .who had paid contributions.- Therc^ • were: soveral difficulties that arose in •1 connection' with the Bill,- and he ' thought the Prs*ie Minister might -be '•wise to agree to.send the measure to a "Committee of the House. Many, of the ' problems'"coußT be dealt" With ' much !-more expeditiously by a small cpmmit- , 'tee thairby the Committee of the whole ■ : House.- ---• NO.. POLICY. , Mr. M. J. Savage (Labour, Auckland West) said that the Bill increased the burden on the men on relief works. That was certainly not hooking one's ,■ wagon to a star, and he wondered.what part the Leader pf.tjvs .Opposition had : played ml framing tho proposals now r. before the House. It looked as if the : women were to bo levied in order to ■ provide work for the men. The* board. ' was going to be saddled witlr the ro- ' sponsibUity, because tho Government •-.did not have a policy. It was time '. that the Government got put if it could .not supply a policy for itself. The • Government had refused to pay susten- • «nce,'but the hospital boards, dared not, ■ 'because otherwise', the. people would starve. .. ,' . . • ■ The Minister of Labour? (the Hon.

S. G.Smith): "Doesn't tho honourable gentleman see that tho object of gotting more money is to provido relief workors with' permanent work?" Mr. Savage: "I haven't been able to see it yet; and I will bo" glad if tho Minister will show mo anything to indicate that." Mr. J. S. Fletcher. (Independent, Grey Lynn) said that tUey wanted something more eomprohensivo than was provided in tho present Bill, which was a re-hash of., the Bill of last year. The whole trouble was that the basis of the . Government's schemo, was relief instead ..of development. Thero should, be a Mihistor to deal with employment and not unemployment. During tho last few months great orders f fir coal had been sent across to Australia, but had there been carbonisation plants on tho West Coast or in Southland these orders need not havo been sent, and jnuch employment could, have, bocn^ found. There was no need to send abroad for hardwood for- telegraph poles, as thesq could,bo made r frpni. ereosoted pines ,or qoncreto. It was true that the Government' reaped .a harvest from its afforestation areas in the pumice land. A pulping industry could bo started there for the manufac; turc of paper. More could bo done to develop tho boot and textile industries, anu ho surged a vigorous construction policy. Ho hoped the Auckland Harboaf Bridge Bill would bo put through, as it would give employment for _ a largo number of men. The construction of the National Museum could be- pushed ahead, and. thoro were many public buildings in other: parts of the country which were in need of replacement or renovation. This work would give profitable" employment for skilled tradesmen who were not suitable for pick and shovel work. Mine develop^ ment would also be an avenue of,employment. He deplored tho fact that Onekaka had been closed down. Twelve hundred men could'be put into the railway workshops to repair tho rolling •stock and 1600 could be used in improving the'pormaiiont'wayi A' NATION OF NAVVIES. Mr.' W. J. Jordan (labour, Manukau) criticised the class of work that - had been put in hand by tho board. Wero we a nation of navvies, he asked. Examinations of New Zealand's manhood during the war showed that the majority we're not physically fit. It was plain that something else but road work should be found for relief workers —something interesting which wouldbo J suitable for those who were not n't for nayvying. He,advocated the encouragement of work of economic value in connection with poultry raising, honey producing, the citrus fruit industry, etc.! The time was coming when the House itself would have to undertake. the responsibility for administering the un-1 employment legislation, instead of delegating the duty to a board of superannuated Piiblic Servants.. Up to the present the 'Government had shown no indication of a. definite "unemployment policy. '■ ■- :•'■■■-, Mr. W. Nash (Labour, Hutt) said never before had they had to meet such "a"'difficulty'"as, the present. " Faulty distribution of. the produce of the world was at the root of their troubles, i>"fl until a change was brought about unemployment would become-worse. If the Government wanted to improve matters, it would have to start at fundamental principles; the. Government would have to control external trade, and the only'way' to db~~that was to control the exchange. Mr. Nash said tho ;Unemployment Board had used its .best endeavours to carry- out the tusk for which it was appointed, but the trouble had been that the Government had thrown'the whole of tho responsi-, bility. for the unemployment difficulty on to the board. . ' : WAGE TAX NOT JUSTIFIED. Mr. F. Langstone (Labour, Waimaiino) said that the people tolerated the No. 5 scheme because, they were ,

waiting for something better to take its. place. No wage tax could be justified. Mr. C. A. Wilkinson (Independent, Egmont): "What about New South Wales?"" • . Mr. Langstoue: "Never mind about Now South Wales. We have our own problem to deal with,. and they have thoirs." He did not see a solution of tho problem solely in land development, but they would have to oponup other industries as woll. He referred to the Unemployment Committee's report, which had advocated the fostering of the pig and poultry industries. The 10 per "cent, cut had reduced the consumors' capital,' and had inflicted widespread: hardship. The Government had refused to tackle the monetary problem. Mr. G. C. Black (Independent, Motueka) said it was regrettable that tho Minister of Labour had not told tho-Houso how the various suggestions made by the Unemployment Committee had been dealt with. He suggested that before the board-went out of office on 31st July next, it should present to Parliament a report setting out its activities since its: inception. Mr. Black asked if the present Commissioner of Unemployment was going to remain in. his position, and, if so, what salary \o was to receive. Ho spoke of the importance of encouraging gold prospecting, and regretted that the Unemployment Board had insisted that parties of prospectors should include married men. There were many married men who could not go prospecting, and they should .bo provided with work closer to the towns, leaving the prospecting to singlo men. A definite sum from th& amount which was to be raised under the Bill should be allocated to prospecting. THE PEOPLE'S RIGHT. Mr. E. Semple (Labour, Wellington East) entered a protest gainst the tax being imposed on relief workers. Every citizen' of New> Zealand was entitled to food, clothing, and sl'olter, but no one could say that the workers were receiving , their fair share ,of food, clothing and shelter to-day. England was staggering beneath a load of debt, and she had a large army, of unemployed. , Thus New Zealand' could not afford to wait and see whether England recovered or not, but instead, the Dominion, under a lead from the Government," should develop her own wealth, and he -gave instances ,of industries which could be profitably fostered. The flax industry was perishing because we were treating it in the same way to-day as we did forty years ag0.... Mr. Semple detailed, the results of the investigations made'by a Dunedin chemist, and claimed the products he had manufactured,. such as sacking, were, superior to the,-, imported article and just as cheap.

Mr. J. A. Nash (Keform/Palmerston). said it was impossible for the man on relief works to pay1 the levy. Thero would be no difficulty in tracing the men, and he thought the Government should stretch a point and exempt relief, workers. The flax industry in New Zealand was dying, and the Unemployment Board would hay been well advised to have encouraged the industry. There, were othtsr industries which could be assisted with advantage, not only to the industries concerned, but to the Dominion as a whole. Every possible avenue -of employment should be explored. . '

Mr. W. E. Barnard (Labour, Napier) said members on all sides of the House had shown a-.willingness-, to assist the Government and ■ the Unemployment Board, but h.e.thought the Government would have been wise if it had presented a general unemployment policy to tho House for approval. That policy could then -have b*en forwarded to the Unemployment Board, with an- instruction, to carry it out. He agreed that land settlement was one. solution of the'present difficulty, and if the Government made a fow acres available

to tlio unemployed it would be heli>ing to solve tho unemployment problem. He could not help thinking that tho Unemployment Board's policy was too centralised. Tho local unemployment committees did not roeeivo sufficient encouragemdut. Single Dion with widowed mothers to support should be treated in the sarnc way as married men. Ho objected to tho flat rate of payment provided for in the Bill. LESSER OF TWO EVILS. Captain H. ,M. Ruslnvorth (CountryParty, Bay of Islands) described the Bill as the lesser of two evils. It provided for essential palliatives, but it was not enough to leave-it at that. Theabsence of serious criticism should not be interpreted as genoral acquiescence with the proposals. Ho suggested that some exemption might be granted to relief workers. At least he.might be relieved of obligation to pay the levy for tho first fortnight or month after he was placed. He suggested also that the granting of exemptions should be decentralised so as to. make the procedure simpler. The money to be provided should be made to go as far as possible. A national objective and a definite policy shpuld bo laid, down for dealing with.. unemployment,. ,A long vision was required. MINISTER'S REPLY. Replying to the debate, the Minister of Labour said tho Billjhad received a very sympathetic reception. The objections had-been mainly against the proposal- ti) tax'-''the] wage's ,of relief workers and seasonal workers, but if they started exempting one class they would reach the stage when: they would have -to increase.the levy. .- Mr.'Barnard: '■'Why not tax the wealthy?" :'.'.■. Mr. Smith, said/the very fe\v wealthy people in the country..were- doing their full share. New Zealand wasf passing through a national crisis and a national effort was needed in order that provision might be made; for those who were unfortunate enough' to be out of work. The Minister denied the charge that thousands of men'had been dismissed from the ' Public service,. and quoted figures showing tho large number of men engaged on Public works and relief works, !apart altogether from the relief works instituted under the Unemployment Board's schemes. l Defending the Unemployment Board, the Minister said that the board-had exceeded its income in order to cope j with the difficulty, and the best it could do was to provide men with 'work on two or three days a week. It was hoped that it would be possible to "do even bettor than that iv the.future. The board had been- blamed for not carrying out the recomendations of the Unemployment Committee and other experts, but the answer was that the board had not had. time to put the various schemes into operation. The board had had to face the position of providing immediate work. It had been suggested that every relief -worker should be given £.4 a week for every week of the year, but. that would cost the taxpayers of the Dominions £9,000,----000 a year. Was tho House prepared to find that amount? ■••• ' The Leader of the Labour Party. (Mr. H. E. Holland): "If they were on productive works they would earn it.M The Minisser said tho object- of the flat levy was to keep in contact with all who,were, entitled, to. register. .An .efort was made in tho Bill to discriminate between the man on £4 a week arid the man on £10 a week. The board at present had power to provide for everybody who was unemployed—men, women, boys, and girls—and money .had already been expended on the finding of work i'or women and girls. Ono of the first duties of the new board would be to set up a committee to deal with the problem ofc' .unemployed women, and that committee's report would probably reveal what would have to bo done; Mr. W. P., Endean (Koform, Par-

ncll): "Does that mean tho'dole?" The Minister: "Not so far as this Government is concerned:" The position in regard to unemployed women was not so serious as had been suggested in some quarters. Tho reconstitution of tho board was the result of tho oxporience which tho Government had already gained. ..■..-.: The Minister said that: there appeared to bo an idea th# land settlement was tho,sure cure of the unmploymont difficulty, but land settlement was of necessity a slow process and thousands of men could not be suddenly placed on tho land. It was also difficult to take large numbers of men out of the cities on to country jobs owing to tho heavy overhead cost of transport and accommodation. The Bill was read a second time.