LICENSING POLL

Evening Post, Volume CVI, Issue 55, 14 September 1928, Page 10

LICENSING POLL

BALLOT-PAPER ISSUES QUERY ABOUT PRINTING HR, HOLLAND'S CHARGE More was heard in the House of Representatives last night during the discussion on tho Licensing Amendment Bill of tho allegation made by the Leader of tho Opposition (Mr. H. E. Holland) that, although the Bill contained provision for a twoissue ballot paper, it was tho Prinio Minister's intention that there should be three issues. Mr. Holland asserted last night that 100,000 papers had already been printed containing the three issues, and indicated ho would not be surprised if all the papers had been printed in that way. Mr. Holland said that although the Bill contained a proposal for a twoissuo ballot' paper, he did not believe it was the intention of the Prime Minister to let the Bill go through in that form. In fact, the ballot papers had already boon printed containing the three issues. Tho Minister in Charge of the Electoral Department (the Hon. A. D. M'Leod): "No." Mr. Holland: "That is the position." The Prime Minister said he was going to provide. for a two-issue ballot paper when he was aware all the time that the ballot papers had been printed and that they contained three issues. Mr. M'Leod: "No." Mr. Holland: "What's tho use of the Minister saying no?" Mr. M'Leod: "Because you are not telling the truth." Mr. Holland: "Lot us sec what the truth is. The law provides for three issues, and it has not been changed yet. The Minister in Charge of the Department stated this afternoon that he did not know whether the papers which had been printed contained three or two issues." The Prime Minister (the Rt. Hon. J. G. Coates): "How does the hon. gentleman know?" Mr. Holland: "The Minister said not five per cent, had been printed, and then he said 100,000 had been printed, and 100,000 is more than ten per cent. Mr. Holland: "We have less than 700,000 on tho roll." The Prime .Minister: "There aro over a million printed." Mr. Holland: "There you are, Mr. Speaker. There are over a million printed. Tho Prime Minister just interjected and said so." Mr. Coates: "I said nothing of the kind." Mr. Holland: "I am surprised at the hon. gentleman. However, we will assume that the Minister in - Charge of the Electoral Department is correct. I don't think ho is correct, but I will assume for :tho purposes of the argument that he is. Now let the Ministor answer this. If 100,000 papers have been printed with the three issues on, how does he explain away the clause of this Bill which provides for two issues ?" Mr. Coates: "That's very smart." Mr. Holland: "Does the Prime Minister say there aro not three issues on the ballot papers that have been printed?" "HARD UP." Mr. Coates: "The hon. gentleman is hard up for something to say." Mr. Holland: "That's the only argument the Prime Minister can use." Mr. Coates: "What on earth is the hon. gentleman talking about?" Mr. Holland: "I can tell the Prime Minister the facts, but I can't make him understand them." Mr. D. Jones (Ellesmere): "And nobodjr else can understand them." Mr. Holland: "The Minister in Charge of the Eloctoral Department stated this afternoon that 100,000 papers had been printed. My personal opinion is that ail of them are printed." The Minister in Charge of the Government Printing Office (tho Hon. R. A. Wright): "They are not." Mr. Coates: "The Government knew nothing about it. The hon. gentleman knew more than the Government knew. He has got his information from somewhere." Mr. Speaker: "Order, order. I am afraid there is too much argument." Mr. Holland: "If the Government did not know what was done, that is a substantial reason for putting the Government out. It is the Government's business to know what has been done." Mr. Coates: "You are very childish." Mr. Holland: "It would bo an astounding thing if Ministers could come Into this House and when they are challenged say they don't know anything about the matter. That sort of thing ■won't go down with the people of this country, Mr. Speakor." Mr. Holland said it had been admitted that 100,000 ballot papers had been printed. What would be tho use of printing 100,000 papers with three isssues on them, and 900,000 papers ■with two issues on them? It would be n ridiculous waste of money to print 100,000 ballot papers if it was not intended to make use of them. Mr. W. D. Lysnar (Gisborne): "What ifloes it matter?" Mr. Holland: "Nothing would matter to the hou. member for Gisborne, but there aro members of this House who havo a more serious sense of their responsibilities than that." Mr. Holland said it was up to the Minister in Charge of tho Department to clear tho matter up. He suggested to Mr. M'Leod that he should arrange with the Government Printing Office to allow himself, the member for Oroua, the Leader of the National Party, and the Speaker to inspect tho books, dockets, and tho various documents in connection with the printing of the ballot papers. A report could then be brought before the House which would show the public whether or not the position was as Mr. M'Leod had stated. "FALSIFIED THEIR OATH." The Hon. A. D. M'Leod said that Mr. Holland had . made a speech containing innuendoes purely for party purposes. Up to midday yesterday he had been as ignorant as Mr. Holland as to what the Government Printing Office had had handed to it. Mr. Holland had obtained information from a source. Mr. Holland: "What source?" The Minister: "Some workers in that Department who havo falsified their oath in giving out information." Mr. Holland: "You aro quite wrong." Mr. Speaker asked Mr. M'Leod to withdraw his remark, and he. complied. He added that an oath of secrecy was demanded of workers in the Government Printing Office in the handling of public documents, and if Mr. Holland nad secured evidence from the office, then someone had done wrong. Mr. Holland: "You are quite wrong, I assure you." Mr. M'Leod remarked that Mr. Holland had said that ho was not prepared to accept the statement made by the speaker in tho afternoon that about 100,000 papers had been printed, and that ho believed it was a million. Mr. Holland: "I said I thought it was." Mr. M'Leod: "You said you wero not prepared to accept it." Mr. Holland: "Will you allow us to have access to the documents and dockets ?" The Minister did not reply to this, but said that that day, about lunch time, Mr. Elliott wont to him and

said he had heard a whisper that members of the Labour Party knew about ballot-papers being printed iv connection with the coming election. Mr. Eliott asked whether the speaker would object to a question being asked in the House about the matter. Mr. Holland: "Who did he hear tho whisper from?" Mr. M'Lood: "I don't know." Mr. M'Leod added that during the afternoon, about five minutes after he had answered the question in the House, he received information from the Chief Electoral Officer (Mr. Hodgkins) whicti bore out substantially what the speaker had said in the House. The letter from Mr. Hodgkins was as follows: With reference to the printing of licensing voting papers for tho forthcoming licensing poll, I have to advise that it has been the custom in the past to print the licensing voting papers in the Government Printing Office and the order has always been given early to give tho Printer plenty of .time to carry out the work. The contract is a big one and it takes the Printer some weeks to fulfil it. There aro 76 electoral districts, and approximately 16,000 voting papers for each district are required. Each lot of voting papers has to be arranged separately, showing the name of the licensing district. In addition to the ordinary voting papers, about 120,000 aro required for absent voters. These .voting papers are applicable in all licensing districts. They have been set up in accordance with the existing law and after conferring with tho Superintendent Overseer of the Government Printing Office, who informed me that the order to print the licensing papers for a licensing poll that might be held about the middle of November could not be delayed further than 9th August, as it would take a considerable time to completo the printing and have the voting papers counted and done up in parcels to be supplied to-each returning officer. Mr. Holland: "That does not say how many are printed." ' Mr. M'Leod: "About 120,000." Mr. Holland: "It says 120,000 were wanted for absent voters." Mr. M'Leod: "The papers for the absent voters alone have been printed." The Hon. E. A. Wright: "That is so." Mr. M'Leod said that after each election unused ballot papers were returned and held in stock until the ensuing election. Mr. Holland: "Thoso that aro printed have three issues on them." The Minister: "Yes. There was no authority under the law to print them otherwise. Tho honourable gentleman wont out of his way for party purposes to try to tell tho House that the Government had boon doing something surreptitious in this matter, and that tho Primo Minister in particular was aware of this. That I absolutely deny. The Prime Minister had no knowledge of the matter at all." A Labour member: "That is, nonsense."