COUNCIL REFORM

Evening Post, Volume LXXXVIII, Issue 25, 29 July 1914, Page 2

COUNCIL REFORM

BILL IN COMMITTEE TEST DIVISION ON MAIN PRINCIPLE. The discussion of the Legislative Council Bill was continued in Committee in the Upper House yesterday afternoon. After a number of personal explanations in reply to the Leader's statement, published in yesterday's Post, the Hon. Mr. Barr moved an amendment to enlarge the number of electorates for the Council from four to eight, thus testing the feeling of the Council on the main principle of the Bill. The original clause was adopted by 14 votes to 10, and progress was re- * ported. The Hon. Mr. Wigram, speaking after the Leader, explained the position as it was when the Bill of 1912 was before the Council. He was not so sure about pro portional representation going to be a success. The Hon. Mr. S. T. George said there was no provision for the payment of lionourablo members. ] The Leader : It can't be donfe in this House, but an appropriate euneudment will be carried in another place. _ The Hon. Mr. S. T. George prophesied there would be afi enormous number of candidates for the Upper House, and come penalty should be placed on thoso not obtaining a certain quota of votes. The Hon. Captain Baillie said that the moral code of the Reform Party was not what ho had been accustomed to. The Hon. Mr. T. Mac Gibbon repudiated any suggestion that the new members were mere nominees of the Government, without ideas of their own. He had supported the reform of the Council for ten years. The Hon. Mr. Jones said he had not intended any slur on the new members, who he agreed hftd been appointed quite properly by the side which was at present dominant. • ' The Hon. Mr. Louisson attributed the misunderstanding on the part 'of the Leader as to his position to the fact that he had not listened to a speech he (Mr. Louisson) had made at the time the Bill of 1912 was before the Council. The Bill was then committeed. The Leader of the Council carefully explained the provisions in the Bill dealing with joint sittings with the Lower House. Clauses Ito 10 were passed. Oh clause 11) dealing with four large elec toratea for the Dominion and the propo*tional system of election, the Hon. Mi. Barr proposed an amendment striking out the word "four" and inserting thd word "eight." He considered the electorates should be of such a. size that voters might have the opportunity to ccc their candidates and know them. The Hon. Mr. Bell opposed the Amendment a-s striking at the root policy of the Bill. The reason for the large elet, torates was that the issue should not be determined by personal matters, but that the members elected should be men who were widely known, men who would represent a large body of their fellow-citi-zens They wanted to constitute a truly representative Senate. If the electora+ee were small, it would not give every section a chance. The Hon. Mr. Earnshaw said that as * poor man he would prefer to contest *• large electorate rather than a small one under proportional system The Hon. Mr. Louisson contended, on J the other hand, that nobody not backod by" a~ strong organisation would have a. chance in the electorates provided for in the Bill. The Hon. Mr. Maginnity said it might possibly be found that the districts were too large, but experience would tell, and it would not be a costly experience. The Hon. Mr Duthie protested against haggling over an essential clause of the Bill which the Minister had a right, after the vote on the second reading, to expect to be conceded by members. The Council divided on ' the clause, which was carried by 14 to 10. Following is the list :— , Ayes (14).— Bell, Duthie, Mac Gibbon, Earnshaw, Moore, M'Lean, Collins, Fisher, Hall-JoneE, Morgan, Hardy, 1 Maginnity, Wigram. Simpson. Noes (lOJ.—Bailhe, George, Barr, Louisson, Jones, Beehan, Baldey, Harris, Thompson. Progress was then reported, and the Council adjourned until to-morrow afternoon.