WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 11. Tha Speaker took the chair at five o'clock,

Daily Southern Cross, Volume XXI, Issue 2582, 27 October 1865, Page 6

WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 11. Tha Speaker took the chair at five o'clock,

TAPERS. Major Atkinson Uid upon the t»ble correspondence relative to the 500,000 debentures handed over to the Home Govertimeut ; copy oE despatch from the Right Hon. Edward Cardwell to Sir G. Grey, on the subject of hon. members of the Executive retaining the title of honourable sfter vacating office; further return of the number of electors in the various electoral districts after the revision by the Revising Officer*, for the yean 1865-66. (Presented by command.) The papers were ordered to be printed.

SITORT ON FISHERIES. Mr. Stafford brought up the report of the Select Committee oil Fisheriei, and it wa» read by the Clerk. The committee recommended that no action should be taken for the protection of fi»h, with tlie exception of oysters. The committee had also had the question under consideration of the introduction of taltnon, but could not recommend under the present circumstances of the colony that any appropriation should be made for that purpose.

THI PANAMA CONTRACT. In reply to a question put by Mr. Brodik, Major Richardson laid the Government had full belief that it was the intention of the Government of New South Wales to carry on the engagement they had entered into with the New Zealand GoYornment in regard to the Panama contract.

PRTITION OF MAJOR JACKSON AND OTHERS, Mr. Cari-eton ftiked the Defence Minister, "What course the Governmeuc intended to take in the mater of the petition signed by William Jackson, a major in her Majesty's colonial forces, on behalf of the officers and mon of the original company of Forei k Rangers." Major Atkinson said the Government h»d given the matter their consideration, and bad come to the conclusion that a promise was made by the late Government; to the petitioners, and the preient Government would be therefore prepared to carry it out. (Hear, hew.)

LIAVJJ OF ABSf NCE. Major Atkinsok moved that leave of absence bo granted to Mr. Ormond for thr remainder of the seisiou, on public duty. — Agreed to. Mr. Brandon moved that leave of abienco be granted to Dr. Featherstone for the renmuder of the ■esiion. — Carried.

CONSTRUCTION OP DOCKS Mr. Macandrkw moved, " That, in tho opinion of this floii'-e, it ii expedient to promote the construction of dooki, patent «lip«r, or nhtp lifts capable of accommodating vcsiels of the largest class, in the principal port* of tho colony ; aud that in the event of sucli works being undertaken, either by public or private enterprise, it will bo the duty of the Govern* ment to recommend to the Imperial anthoritie* to grant loans in aid of such workH, in terms of tbo Colonial Docks Loan Act, 1865." Mr. Fitzubrbert tru»ted tho motion would be withdrawn, as he did not think that any case had been made out to lead the General Government to move the Home Government to grant such a loan, especially After the recent despatches which hud been receded from Mr, Cardwell, indicating the disinclination of the Imperial Government to guarantee any further loan. The motion was supported by Mr. Voqel and Mr. R«ynoi,ds, and opposed by Mr. Bjrodik and Mr. SkwUjL. Mr. Carmton thought it necessary that the General Government should bestir themselves in the matter of securing the erection of docks and P* 11 * 11 * "lips. Ho might tell the House that the Provincial Government of Auckland had already taken »omo steps with regard to the erection ol a patent slip on the North Shore, below highwater mark. The Provincial Government, wrote tometime ago to the General Government, asking that the land between two different point! below high-water mark, should be convoyed to the Superlutendent, and the General Government anawered that there were difficulties in tho way of making » Crown gra»t of land below high-water mark • but he uhustdo them tho justioe to say that th*T,threw no other obstacle in the way, and expressed , a desire to 00-operale with tho Superintendent of Auokland

in the ma v ter, either 1 by ginug a long leaie or otherwise. Upon the itrength of thatpromiie a patent ilip wai »t the present time being ereotod by Mr. Nioool, chip-builder. That gentleman had considered the letter received from the General Government quite mffioient, and that the Government would take some means or other to make the arrangement, and therefore ho (Mr. Carleton) would take this opportunity of requeuing that the Government would tnke meaturei to effect that objeot, Mr. Sewell said, before the Superintendent of Auckland left Wellington, the Government had informed him that they were deiiroui of completing the arrangement either through the Public Resarvei Act, or the beit meant which oould be discovered. Mr. Macundrxw said he would, with the permii•ion of the House, amend his motion by the addition of the wordi, "Provided alway* that no iuch accommodation ahall be held to involve pecuniary reiponsibility on the Government." The motion win amended and agreed to,

WRKOK OP THE * LOUD WORSLKY.' Mr. Cdrtis moved, " That, in the opinion of tliw House, the claims mado for lon of their effects by those persont who were wrecked in the * Lord Worsley,' as revised aud reported on by Mr. Commissioner Beokham, bo charged against and paid onfc of the Taranaki Compensation Fund, and that it be an instruction to the Government to pay the said claims out of the said fund forthwith." Mr. Sbwell moved, as an amendment, "That if, after satisfying the existing claim* upon the Taranaki Compensation Fund, there shall remain an available surplus out of suoh fund, suoh surplus will be properly applicable to the satisfaction of claims and losses sustained by persons wrecked in the 'Lord Worsley,' according to the amounts ascertained by Mr. Commissioner Beckham." Major Atkinson seconded the amendment, and stated that Government anticipated to be able to pay the claims by next week, as there w*s an available balance out of the fund. Mr. CortiB accepted the amendment. Mr. RussßLti could not understand why the individuals mentioned should be compensated at an earlier period than other claimants whose cases were inquired into at the same time, by Mr. Commissioner Beckham, unless it was that the steamer was wrecked on the coast of Taranaki As he avd, he could not understand why an exception should bo made, and why those persons whose claims had been inquired into at the same time should not be paid out of the fund. He had understood that the principle laid down was, that all claims for losses sustained during the war should be paid out of the proceeds of the side of confiscated land ; and, therefore, he thought that, if there a surplus remaiuiug, it should be handed over to the Government to meet ail olaims alike. Unless there was some light thrown upou the subject, ho would oppose the motion. Mr. Fitzhkrbert said tl»t it was nothing but right that the strangers who had been pasting on their way along the coast of New Zealand, and who had lost their Iwhole, should, iv generosity, be paid their compensation out of the surplus of the Taranaki fund. Mr. J. O'Nkill thought the House would scarcely agree to the special pleading which had been made use of by the Hon. the Colonial Treasurer. It mu*t bo apparent that, if it would be right to pay out of the Taranaki fund the sums mentioned by the Treasurer for losses sustained by the persons wrecked in the 'Lord Worsley, 1 it should have been done without waiting for a private member to move such a resolution in the House. If that were necessary to be done, then he contended that all persons who had suffered losses owing to the native rebellion should be placed on the same platform, because the losses sustained by wreck at sea of a steamer could not be more severe thin losses upon a farm — where a man with his wife and children were driven from their homesteads which they had been dwelling upon and improving for a series of years, aud in being driven away had lost their all. The settlers upon being driven xway had been obliged to lly to the towns for shelter, and had as fair a claim to immediate payment in debentures as those persons who whilst travelling past a certain portion of the coast in a vessel had been wrecked. He icarcely thought it was fair that tbo Government should take one case — the case of persons wrecked iv tho steamer — and leave the whole of the sufferers in the province of Auckland to depend solely upon the proceeds of sale of land for compen sation. At all events he was of opinion that if the Government y, ere disposed to hand over tho lands confiscated in the Waikato, on libotal terms, to the Provincial Government, the difficulty would bo somewhat removed, as the Provincial Government would be roady to pay over the amount awarded by Mr. Beckham to the settlors— £7o,ooo or £80,000: and he (Mr. O'Neill) ivould not, under those circumstances, have raited a single objection to the payment being made out of tho Taranaki fund. As, however, he was under the impression that the Government did not intend to act in that respect towards Auckland, he thought it only reasonable that the House should reject the proposal, in order to show that no difference should be mado iv the cases of thoso who had suffered from wreck on the coast or wreck of their homes. (Hear, hear.) Mr. Gledhill said there was another case ■which appeared to have been entirely overlooked, and which certainly ought to have been met out of the Taranaki fund. He referred to the case of Mr. Carrington. Mr. W. T. BacKLAND said it was very gratifying to find that there was any surplus at all, as he had really been afraid that there was nothing left. He was far from wishing to deprive the pertons wrecked in the ' Lord Worsley from receiving compensation, in accordance with the award of Mr. Beckham, for losses sustained on the coast of Taranaki. At the same time he must say he had drawn very different conclusions from those enunciated by the Colonial Treasurer, who appeared to suppose that their case was worte than tottlera who had been driven from their farms. He mint tell them that, looking at the question in the native aspect, it bad been a custom with the natives from time immemorial to seize upon wrecks occurring on the coast, and to appropriate property so obtained He therefore maintained that had the wreck taken place in times of peace the natives would equally have seized the goods" recovered. Hon. member* must be aware that in the case of a canoo being wrecked off the coast the canoe and all its contents belonged to thoso who recovered it. He must say further that the difference between the cases of people suffering loss from the wreck of tho ' Lord Worsley and those of persons driven from their homesteads was very- great. There was no possibility of a man insuring his houte and stock, as the insurance policies did not cover rebellion ; but in tho enso of the wreck under notice, the insurance would cover the loss. ("No, no* v ) He did not understand tho objection raised by the hon. number who had just spoken — that the insurance offices had refused to cover the policies on goods. (Major Atkinsok said the goods hud been landed, and then taken from the owners by the natives.) If any objection had been made to meeting the insurance he thought the question ought to be tried, and ho believed the oifices would be found to bo liable. It was clear, however, that in cases of ordinary insurance upon houses and stock the offices would not he liable for losses l>y rebellion, as clauses were always introduced excluding such responsibility. Thero was also another difference to bo noted in regard to the unfortunate people who were driven from their homes — to those who were wrecked. In one case the natives came to tho scttleri, killed them, burnt their stacks and slaughtered their stock ; but in the other case the persons wrecked went to the natives. In the first case tho natives travelled tome hundreds of miles for a special object— to kill and ruin the settiers—whilst in the other case tho Europeans weot to the natives- they turned up ns a stray waif and were plundered according to the Maori custom. He therefore said one case deserved prompt attention equally with the other ; that they ought not to make fish of one and flesh of another. (Hear, hear.) Before he sat down he would I ell them that there was a feeling springing up amongtt the Auckland people that the present Governmmt would do everything to injure them, and delay the gwntiae of compensation. The Taranaki people, it was well known, had suffered loises, but immediately awards had been made in their favour, nnd compensation granted, (Mr. Atkinson : "No*; immediately, not until four years had elapsed.") However that might be, ho trusted the Government would not suffer any delay to take place in compensation being granted to the settlers who had suffered such heavy Josses during th« rebellion. He knew that at the present time there were families residing in Auckland, who had been driven into the city from their farms aud homesteads, and were obliged to work as labourers. If, however, they received a little money at* the present time, they would be able to go back to thoir farms, and re-commence operations. The settlers had admittedly suffered very great hardships, and therefore he would impress upon the Government not to show any difference between the sufferers, but to treat them all alike. , Mr. C. Wilson, regretted that the member for Omata should have, introduced the, question of Mr. Carrlngton's claim, us til* committso beforV

whom hii case hadbeen iaveitig»ted did nob oonsidor he h»d any claim upon the Government for com* action, and ho believed »Uo the Governmetfc entertkined the iamo opinion. Mr. Ctmirs replied, and the amendment, on being i put, wai adopted.

COMMISSARIAT ADVANCES. Mr. Vooßti moved, " That a return bo laid on the table of the advances received from the Commissariat siuce the Ist of December lust, and tko reimburse* ments on accouut o{ tke same." Mr. Russet, moved an ameudmeut, to the effect that the return should include moneys paid by Commissariat on colonial account, and the value of rations and supplies issued by the Commissariat on account of the colony. The motion, as amended, was agreed to.

PETITION OP MB. OOOHBANB, Mr. KussiLL »»id he would not move the motion lUuding in hi* name, as he found the time had expired within which petition! could be referred to the Private Grievance Committee. The motion was to the effect :— "That the claim of Mr. D. B. Coohrane for compensation (stated in pnpert laid on the table of this House) be referred to the Private Grievance Committee."

PETITION OF MRB. HEWITT. Mr. Waking Taylor moved, "That the House go into committee on Friday next to con»ider the report of the Privato Grievance Committee on the petition of Ellen A. Hewitt."— Agreed to. PETITION OF EDWAKD OATCHPOOIh Mr. Colinso moved, "That the Home go into committee on Friday to comider the report of the Private Grievance Committee on the petition of Edward Ofttohpool."— Carried.

MCAVS Of AB3KNOB. Mr. Carlkton moved, " Tlmt lear« of abieuce for one fortnight bo granted to Mr. Robert draharo, on the grouud of his pre*enc« being required for the performance of public dutie« iv the province of Auckland." — Agreed to.

PETITION OF JAMBS CALLAQHAN AND OTHKM. Mr. John Williasi9on moved, " That the Home do resolve itself into committee of tbe whale Home on next sitting day to consider the recommendations of the Private Grievance Committee in the cases of Jamei Callaghan, John Bollon, Rhoda B. Hamlin, and Heury Decry." — Agreed to.

TUB WAIEATO CONFISCATED LANDS. Mr. Sewkix postponed moving his resolutions ofa this subject until Tuesday.

DISQUALIFICATION ACT AMENDMENT BILL. Mr, Stafford moved the second reading of thia bill, and stated the object of it, which be laid was to disqualify officers of the General Government from sitting in tho House, and so tecure tbe independence of Parliament, He was also in favour of disqualifying Provincial Government officers, excepting .Sti|)erinteudeuK The Attorney-General, in atatmg that the General Government required all the ability and talent it could obtaiu, opened up a much larger question, viz., whether New Zealand was ripe for a Constitution and representative institutions. lie thought it was, and »lso that those privileges should be guarded properly, and the independence and freedom of Parliament secured by some such bill as this. The hon. member concluded by moving the second reading of the bill Mr. Bbodie spoke in favour of the bill, but suggested an alteration 10 far ns regarded the employment of lawyen by Government to conduct special and important cases, Mr. Colinso said he hailed tbe bill with delight, but thought that it did not go far enough. The disqualification should also affect the other House. Mr. Brandon would vote for the second reading of the bill, but trusted one or two alterations would be made in it in comrriitpe. Mr. 0. Wilson would vote for the second reading of this bill, on tbe understanding that some alteration should bo made in committee. Mr. Carletojj said if the principle of the bill wns wished to be applied to the other branch of the Legislature, n clause to that effect might be inserted on its passage through the Upper House, but he altogether objected to the House inserting such a clause. He would vote for the second reading of the bill, in the hope that tome alteration would be made in it in committee. Mr Crosbir Wakd said he would vote for the measure, not because he thought it was very much required at the present time, but becnuse circumstances might render such a measure desirable hereafter, which, they should provide for. He thought the bill went perhaps n little further at tbe present time in some eases than was absolutely called for. I Mr. GiiEDitiLL supported tho lecoud reading of the bill. Mr. Sevtell said he mutt express his dissent to the bill ; and, although ho might; be opposed to the majority of tho House, would oppose the second leading. He believed tho bill was formed on a false basis, and was intended to nffect a case which might arise at some future session— in the event of tho House becoming crowded witli needy place-huaters. Mr. Voqelj could well understand the opposition which was shown to the bill by the Government, because it affectod one of their members— the Colonial Treasurer, and whose position in the House would therefore be imperilled were ho to continue to hold tho appointment. It would also affect, he believed, the position of the Postmaster-General, who had held a position as Superintendent of one of the provinces in the colouy at tho same time that he was a Minister of the Government. Mr. Stafford replied, and aaid he felt highly gratified to find that the bill had met with tuch a favourable reception from the House. There had been two objections taken to the bill by hen. members who had spoken on the one side that the bill went too far, and on the other side that it did not go far enough. Untlerordinary circumstances he therefore thought they would agree with him that the bill must be admitted to have approached the happy medium. With regard to the objeotiou raised by the lion, member for the Goldfiolds (Mr. Brodie) that a clause had not beeu introduced providing for the employment of lawyers by Government under special case* —ho must say that he did not hold any positive opinion in either direction, and would be quite prepared to adopt any suggestion proposedin committee. The Hon. tho Attorney-General had stated that the time might arrive when such an Act would be necessary ; but he (Mr. Stafford) contended that if the principle was a good one it could not be introduced too toon. The motion was then put and carried. The bill was read a second time, and ordered to bo committed to-morrow.

WILLIAMS COMPENSATION BILL. This bill was reported, aud ordeml to be read a third timo to-monow.

MILITIA BILL. Tbii bill \va* read a third time, and passed.

VOLUNTEER FOBCK BILL. This bill was read a third time and pisrecl.

HKI'IIKSKNT mON BILL. Major Atkinson proposed that the consideration of tins bill in committee be postponed until to morrow. Meisw. Yookl and Brodib opposed the motion. The House divided ;—Ayei, 22 ; noes, 15. The motion \vn» consequently canied.