Mr Cracknell Questioned On Implications Of Policy

Press, Volume CII, Issue 30287, 13 November 1963, Page 16

Mr Cracknell Questioned On Implications Of Policy

After addressing a meeting of about 75 employees at the Addington Railway Workshops yesterday, the leader of the Social Credit Political League (Mr V. F. Cracknell) was asked if he would answer questions. Mr Cracknell declined and said: “I have a policy of not answering questions as leader of the league while on tour. It is not fair to answer questions in one place and not another.” Before Mr Cracknell left Christchurch yesterday afternoon “The Press” therefore arranged to interview him and these questions were put to him.

You have said a Social Credit Government would have to recognise the status quo and could not change financial policies over-night State and local body loans from the public would presumably continue for some time so there would be no immediate saving on the debt. What extra State expenditure do you envisage would be needed in the first yean of a Social Credit government to met the additional benefits described in your policy? Treasury officials have calculated these to be worth an addiUonal £175 million a year.

I would very strongly challenge that figure. We have not actually costed it. We do not call it a cost but a saving for the people. It would depend on the conditions at the time and the extent to which we would extend the subsidies on flour, butter, and eggs. I am not greatly concerned about the amount involved because the scope for using the national credit depends on the expansion of the economy and the extent we can squeeze out debt. The people of this country are in debt to the tune of hundreds of millions of pounds because of the shortage of ready cash. Current loans would be honoured. Have you worked out the cost of, say, additional pensions? That could be quite exact?

We have not worked out the cost of pensions. It is not worth working out part without working out the whole of it. I think there could be economies in Government administration if they were investigated. The Social Credit manifesto claims the need for as much money and credit to be available as there are goods and services. What goods are at present unsold and what services are being offered in vain? It is not quite like that. What is needed is an incentive to produce goods. There is a loss of potential because the economy is fettered. The goods unsold are the stocks held by retailers and wholesalers and industrialists. They provide a cushion and shock absorber. Are they too big today? I would say they should be a great deal smaller. You have said we live hi a world of plenty.

Yes. But it is not just to the people who produce the goods. How would you calculate the value of services people want to give but for which there Is no present market? Services are an unknown factor. They could only be assessed if we got the economy on to an honest basis. The statistical records would have to be more effective. We would have to have a quarterly assessment of the national product. If 10W cinema seats were being offered by a theatre manager and remained unfilled, how would this service figure in the calculation to ensure that, as the manifesto says, people have enough money to buy what is available? In that event it might be a service offered, but not required.

But you would have to add up the total of services available to come to a credit figure? The statistics would have to be brought up to date. It is a question of people not having enough money . . . another example of the shortage of purchasing power. Is it Just a question of purchasing power, or also a matter of choice? People might prefer to buy a television set to going to the cinema? It could be an example of people not having a television set and still not being able to afford to go to the pictures. How would you distinguish real demand from matters of choice? Purely from the statistical records. What machinery would a Social Credit Government establish to ration credit to cover the goods and services available? What measure of State control would be needed to allocate credit? The body we have always referred to is the National Credit Authority whose job it would be to decide this. I would not think there would be any measure of State control. Loans to local bodies would make additional money available to people until it is repaid.

Is that money not already available as local bodies spend their money on projects? The amount lent to local bodies would be additional credit until repaid. If a Social Credit Government issued interest-free loans to local bodies, in what quarters, in what industries would you want to see people invest their money to earn the returns they now receive on local body loans? There is a great shortage of finance for primary and secondary industry. Many who now invest in local bodies would be directed to businesses. The small investor would be guaranteed in certain industrial undertakings. Some machinery would be necessary to examine and approve certain industries for investment.

WMM the Issue of credit to balance all goods and services offered encoarage inefficient iudusirtes and effort? Who would decide what the conaaasers should have enoagh money to bay? Under a normal free enterprise system, where competition is real, the normal operations of the private enterprise system would operate. If the industrial machine is capable of producing wealth and goods they should be produced to the full limit.

If banks were not permitted to charge what they consider the market price for loans and were required to observe a rate of interest fixed by a Social Credit Government, what interest rate weald they pay their depositors? What encouragement would Social Credit give to saving by way of interest? Would it pay any losses in carred by the banks? The banks render an invaluable service as the nation’s book-keepers. I think they should charge in accordance with the service rendered. You would get interest on a deposit If the banks got an equitable remuneration for their services, not necessarily interest on overdrafts, they would be able to pay interest to depositors. The cost of paying interest is part of their costs. They should recover their costs and make a fair profit. The bank customer who is paying for service on an overdraft would be paying sufficient to pay interest on deposits.

What are the views of Social Credit on the shortterm money market which makes money available to local bodies ever long terms by drawing on money which is available from businesses for short terms? This is a make-shift arrangement to help out local bodies under the existing debt and interest system. Social Credit would make money available to local bodies free of interest and at an administrative cost.

What happened to the A Plus B Theorem and the “gap.” They are what you might call academic Social Credit. We are trying to explain it in simple language. There is a large gap between real purchasing power and the prices of goods and services offering. It is being filled up by debt and hire purchase. The growth of hire purchase is a clear indication of the inadequacy of the present financial system. We would not encourage hire purchase, but we would not stop it.

Since voters in past elections have shown they are not prepared to accept a Social Credit Government, would the league be doing a greater service by supporting one of the present parties and by endeavouring tp adjust its policies? Which party would Social Credit back in this way? I don’t think I can give you an answer to that today. I am often asked that on the platform. If we had members in Parliament we would support the Government of the day to maintain stability of government up to the point where it proposed to borrow heavily or increase taxes heavily.

Would the league like to see preference voting at elections so that second choices of supporters of the lowest candidate were recorded in favour of another candidate? It is not part of our policy, but I regard it as a more democratic way of electing members of Parliament It would mean 100.000 people could be represented in Parliament I would not like to say how people would cast their second-choice votes or how many Social Credit candidates would be elected as a result.