HOME RULE.

Press, Volume LIII, Issue 15860, 27 March 1917, Page 6

HOME RULE.

SCENE IN COUNCIL CHAMBER.

COUNCILLORS "WALK OUT.

CHARGES OF ELECTIONEERING,

Hitter fooling -was shown in the City Council Chamber last evening, consequent upon a Home Rule motion by C?. J. McCombs, which the Mayor (31r H. Holland) ruled out of order. A vote taken by the Council upset tho Mayor's decision, aud as a result five Councillors, headed by Cr. Otley, strode out of the chamber, and did not again return. One of the other members of the Council, Cr. Taylor, later in the evening, characterised tho motion as an electioneering dodge, a motion which ho submitted was quite out of the scopc of the Council to pass. E\ entually a. modified motion by Cr. Scott was substituted for Cr. McCombs s motion, and passed by the members of the Council, who remained, on the voices, Cr. Taylor recording his dis-

scrU - -vr Pursuant to notice of motion, Lr. -ucCombs moved"Thai at this time when England is pouring out blood and treasure in defence of tho rigiits ot small nationalities to govern themselves, it would be a gracious act and in the interests of unity and furtherance of tho cause of the Allies to urge on the Imperial Government the justice and expediency of granting to Ireland the same measure of self-government which is enjoyed by the people of this Dominion, and tho other tree se i-go-verning colonies. Unit Jus Excellency the Governor be asked to transmit the above .resolution to the Imperial Government." . u i The Mayor said that personally ho thought it was a matter. tho Council should not deal with, as .it was quite out of the Council's functions, relating as it did to the domestic affairs of another part of the Empire. Cr. Jameson requested the Mayor to o-ive a ruling on the matter. Ho contended that tho Council was only entitled to discuss local affairs Cr McCombs contended that as the question related to tho unity of the Empire, it was entitled to be discussed by every community or group of citizens in the Empire. He, however, took it that the Mayor had practically given his ruling tho other evening when he accepted the notice of motion. The Mayor: I give my ruling now— that unless you can adduce arguments against it, I cannot accept this motion. Cr. McCombs moved that tho Council disagree with his Worship's ruling. Cr. Hunter seconded tho motion. Cr. Hayward appealed to the Mayor to rcconslder his ruling. His Worship: I bow to tho ruling of tho Council. I hold that the Irish question docs not affect us here. The motion was then put to tho 'Council and declared lost on the voices.

Cr. McCombs pressed for a division. The division was then taken, with the result that Cr. McCombs's motion dissenting from the Mayor's ruling was carried by 8 votes to 7. At the time the division was taken Cr. Cooper was absent from the Council Chamber.

The division list was fls follows:— Ayes: Hay ward,, Herbert; Sullivan, McCombs, 'McCullough, Hunter, Burgoyne, Scott. Noes: Reynolds, Peak, Taylor, Beanland, Williams, Jameson, Otley. Crs. Otley, Beanland, Jameson, Williams, and Reynolds -then rose from their seats and left the Council Chamber. They failed to put man appearance during the remainder of the evening. > Cr. McCombs then spoke on his motion. Ho merely wished, .he said, to affirm a general principle. One of the newspapers, in discussing the matter, said Ireland was in the peculiar position of having to be subsidised by j England. That might have been the case up till last vear, but the latest figures showed that Ireland had a. surplus of five millions odd sterling for Imperial purposes after providing for local He would like to point out that of 'the Ulster members of' Parliament, sixteen were Unionists, whilst seventeen were Home Rulers. He hoped the Council would carry his motion or a similar one.

Cr. Sullivan regretted the position that had arisen that evening. He seconded tho motion because it oxpressed a sentiment that was very dear to him indeed. He felt' that nothing would strengthen the Empire so much as the .granting of Homo Rule to the people 'of Ireland. The carrying of a resolution bv a representative body like the Citv'Council would show the Imperial Government and people that the sentiments expressed by Sir Joseph Ward the other day were not only tho sentiments of himself but of the people he represented. > Cr. Scott said ho regretted the incidents that had happened that evening. Ho moved, a« an amendment: "That the Christchnrch Citv Council views with pleasure the resolution of the Imperial Government to make another effort to set-tie the Irish problem ;and remove the difficulties in the way pf conceding full self-government to Ireland. "We believe that at this time, nnd when the Allies are pouring out blood and treasure in defence of the rights of small nationalities, that winning the confidence of the Irish people is of supreme importance to the causo of Grct Britain and her Allies."

Cr. Taylor gnvo noti°" to move the following amendment: '"That this Council i s of opinion that the present, time is not opportune for the discussion of the ] v ish question, and that the debate bp adjourned for six months."

Cr. Herbert paid be was sorry that tl-n events of evening had happened. Especially was be sorry for the M'^vor.

Tho Mayor: Don't he sorry for mo. I am subject to the ruling of the Council.

Cr. Herbert, said that thengb he was purely En dish, he felt that. Ireland wno from ivronors. Hb seconded C>. Pott's amendment, and urged Cv to withdraw his.

_Cr. McCullnugh whilst exnrcssing his regrets, stated that durinti the whol" t'nio he had been a member of the Cmrieil he never snnn bnfr, rc w''at had happened that nijrhti—Councillors retiring ln-cause a motion hurt their feclinars. H>o feelings had been "hurt on many occasions, hut he had not. thoiicrTit of retiring from the Council Chamber. He preferred Cr. Scott's amendment to Cr. 'V'-Oombs's motion. A vote for or against the motion would have been more creditable to the Councillors leaving the Chamber.

Cr. McCombs agreed to accept Cr Scott's amendment.

Cr. Hayward said he regretted very much that evening's happenings. "I cannot* -understand," he said, "that men who consider themselves patriotic, and so they arc, could do this. I regret that these councillors' opinion on this matter should have led them to withdraw from the Chamber in the manner they have. I regret I have had to disagree with the Mayor's ruling. Cr. McCombs: We all do.

Cr. Havward maintained that the Question was a fit and proper one to discuss in the interests of the Empire. He ha<l often sat on the Council when matters were dismissed which he did not consider were in the interests of the Emnire, but ho had been man enoutrh to st.iv at that tnblo and not run away. He regretted to seo that

such bigotry existed in the City ol Christchurch. Cr. McCombs: They ran away Iroin their posts. . Cr. Hunter: Like whipped curs. Cr. Hay ward stated that Sir Joseph Ward had truly said tluit the Irish question was a' sore in tho heart of the Empire. The British and Front-n Governments were looking round for soldiers, and hero at the very door, onco tho Irish question was settled, was material suflicicnt for their needs which would provide soldiers second to ncmel in tho "world. Cr. Hay ward characterised it as disrespect to the Irish soldiers who had fought and died the manner iu which councillors had acted that evening. Ho would rather not be a member of the Council at all than seo councillors do such a tiling as had been done that evening.

Cr. Hunter said ho and other Labour members had taken a beating in tho Council on many occasions, but they had always been prepared to take their benting liko men, and ho congratulated those members of the Council who had remained behind to discuss the proposal. He hoped those who had gone would feel humiliated. He did not know, such a feeling of intolerance existed in Christchurch. It hau been proposed that Mr Massey and Sir Joseph Ward should bo invited to discuss tho Irish problem, and an expression of public oninion from New Zealand would aid tiiero.

Cr. Taylor, at this stage, moved his motion. "Personally." he said, "I hare always been a confirmed Home ltuler, and as a colonial, I could ncvet understand how, up to tho present, the statesmen at Homo could find no solution of this question. But, .1 wish to emphasise this fact: I believe the present time is not opportune to discuss the question, for tho Council to take a motion on tho subjeet, for wc j all know that tho loss embarrassment j tho Home Government- receives on this j question the more likely chance there , is of securing a settlement. With xue j war on, I don't see any good in the J Council raising this controversial ques- j tion, and furthermore, I cannot sec it J is one of our functions to interfere, I j can quite understand tho Australian j Senate passing a motion. I can quite ( understand our own Parliament express- j ing an opinion on tho question in very j guarded terms, but I cannot see any j reason for a municipality passing a f motion on it at all. If any inunioi- "t pality deals with, an issue affecting thof lives of its own citizens, it has donof its duty. L say the functions of aS municipality lie with tho citizens in?, its borders, in fact the Legislature doeff< not give us more powers than that/ Prom that point of view wc therefor*#/" are quite out of order in discussing thin question. Another point is that w* have the municipal elections pending? and though I don't like to say it, ij does to my mind savour of electioneer ing purposes. The Irish question tJ day is nearer solution than ever before a solution ■which will come about if nq interfered with. Now, I ask, why w$ this question not brought up last yea}, when tho trouble in Ireland was tc|, much more acute. If a body like tip should send forth such a resolution p ;hat proponed, then was the time to fc it. It savours of electioneering, it is unwise at the present time, and it|s grossly unfair to divide tho Council pu. a political question like this, becautf, when I vote against it. I lay roysWf open to certain constructions which jfe against. own opinions. 1 Cr. Sullivan denied that the motiri wa? an electioneering one. 1 There was.no seconder to Or. Taylcfs amendment, and Cr. Scott's motiou wg then put to the meeting and deilaed carried on the voices, Cr. Tayljr Recording his vote against it. .« Upon the motion of Cr. McCoiribs, it was decided that a ooDy of the:rosqlution should be forwarded to hil Excellency the Governor for transmssioii to the Imperial anffiorrßes. i i