AMERICAN IMPRESSIONS

Press, Volume LI, Issue 15208, 20 February 1915, Page 7

AMERICAN IMPRESSIONS

KITERVIEW WITH PRESIDENT " :: wiLSOx.

/jjjQiliT WRITTEN* FOR "THE PRESS.")

fßr Ernest A. Belcher, 31.A.]

NEW YORK, December 18. A telephone message from tho Hon. .J. F. Tumulty, to the effect that the President would sco mo at 11.30 tho following morning, was tho rather laconic reply I got to ray application for an interview. A friend in the Treasury who had arranged matters for mc warned mc I must not talk about the War, Japan, Mexico, the American Navy, Prohibition, Democrat prospects at the next election, tho Panama Canal, the Monroe doctrine, Women's .'Suffrage, and several other things. That teemed to leave the weather and :■ the result of the New Zealand elections as the only safe topics of conversation. The former lacked originality, and tho .latter, if it did not verge perilously on » Prohibition, was at all evenis "raev thing that neither of us knew anything about. . Fortunately, as I was entering the "White House, I remembered that Preeident Wilson was an ex-College Don, aud that ho had stepped straight from - the Presidential Chair of Princeton University to tho Governorship of New York en route to Washington. At Princeton ho had the reputation of • raiJber a fiera reformer who wanted his ownway, and generally got it. That, in a modified sense, gave us something in common, and I to have hopes 1 might fill out my allotted time without drying up conversationally. As a matter of fact, I exceeded my time by (some fifteen minutes, much to the annoyance, probably, of the next man on flic rotn. r Presidential visitors enter the White House by a side door, and have to pass inspection from a uniformed janitor. I think the janitor is an Irishman; I am sure he ought to be a diplomat, for' he remembered both my name and face, ; though he had only seen mc" for a moment the previous day. He greeted mc with a cheery smile, ticked mc off on a niece of paper, and iishered mc into the ante-room with the remark: "We aro well up to time this morning, sir- The President will be able to see ybu'in.A few minutes, as yon are next on the list." . , * He was'right. Barely five minutes elapsed before an inner door was opened and my name was called, A' moment'lnter, and I stood in* the presence of the, uncrowned King of America. Tho room was quite circular, with an

oxtraordijiary number of doors. 1 ■found niyself ■'wondering -whether each door concealed a Secret Service agent ready to dash, into the room and protect tho President from a wandering Anarchist. A solitary French clock with a suggestively large -dial, : {occupied tho mantelpiece. A 6ingle portrait hung on tho walls. I expect • it was Ceorgo Washington, but I .did not get near enough to bo certain. The President was writing at his desk, but y lose as 1 entered. I got the immediate impression of a. man above the medium height, clean shaven, a wellknit framo,. and tho head of a scholar. There was a squareness about the chin which marked determination. People who accuse President Wilson of a vacil- " lating policy in Mexico do not know the man. He knows'better than the fireeating American what the Mexican - problem means, and possesses the high.ost form of courage—a resolution to do ■what he thinks" is best for the country however unpopular it may be. iHo asked mc much about NeV Zealand and displayed the keenest interest ■in my travels through the Far East. I,told- him what I thought, of the work ' boing done in the Philippines, but -we were, getting on to dangerous ground, so we switched to university education. In answer to his enquiries. I explained the .university tystom of Now Zealand. I hope I did it justice, though my ex- - planation was obviously coloured by my. _, own impressions-. I sketched the rise of tho four university colleges, and . their consolidation for examination purl>os0 1 ; iu'to- one Dominion University. ' '■QncM.ious of distance and to some extent local -prejudice," I said,. "hamper the -growth of our gTeat University, "which is all tho present size of New JZe&land would warrant. • It has been urged that each college should specialise -' ia-oMs particular faculty, so that, for example, Dunedin should become the 'medical school. Auckland mining. Can-' ' ■ terhiiry College engineering, and so forth. In practice, however, this does not.work, because tho -very arguments o| distance, wliich justify separate col■iog'es. may be used with equal force to jostify the re-duplication oP faculties. If it is necessary for Auckland to have ■ - a separate University College, why . should students from the Auckland . province have to go to Dunedin to •study medicine, or to Christchurch to study engineering? The tendency is, - therefore, towards decentralisation and ,'a consequent multiplication of professorships and equipment." ■ I. ventured to add that this was only open to criticism when tho efficiency of a .University Cqllego was hampered from lack of finals. Apart from that, which is in itself a very., serious problem, tie'■■questions' which press most in New Zealand for solution aro first of how to deal with students so that yonr universities may bo somethiug .more than teaching or examining bodies; may, in short, reproduce in a - young and vigorous community something of the real university lifo which we associate with the Old Country: In America the inner university life has been affected profoundly by the fraterriites. . There -_ fro associations of students, founded chxsply on the model''of Catholic brotherhoods with' chapters at various • Universities.

'"Do you consider," I asked the President, "that the influence of fraternities has; been beneScial to Anieri- - can uaivesity ■ life? llight th«y bo -_ imitated in New Zealand?" "If you . mean," was the reply, "how they made . University life more interesting and . more popular, I should answer anhesiV iatingly yes; if, however, you ask i^. ". ■ ■• ■ •

whether they have advanced th© cause of education, I should answer quite emphatically no. The young American graduate looks back with great affection and interest to his fraternity, repoices in its athletic and social memories, and occasionally, but in a much less degree, in its academic distinction. But for him very certainly the college exists tor tiie »ako of the fraternity, and not tho fraternity for the sako of the college. In lact," added the President with a smile, '"to put it quite vulgarly, in American university iiio the side >'iows have swallowed the circus." The picturesque phrase stuck in my mind, but I hastened to ask: "How .far would the same criticism apply to Oxford and Cambridge?"

"I know Oxford very little," said Mr Wilson, "but I do not think it would apply at all. It is true that the social and athletic side, or" Oxford life looms very large, but there is a great distinction between an American fraternity and an Oxford college: the former is a self-governing community composed e.i tirely of students; in the Jatter professors and students live togetnei and profoundly affect each othtr's lives. ' Hero the President leant forward .md spoke very earnestly. '"Iziat is the true secret of education: tho association of young minds with older minds. All the education I ever got was from association with my father. By attending lectures I got information, but not education."

"Then the solution is the residential college?"

"Certainly, that or the dormitorysystem, provided the professors snare in student life. , '

"But how," I asked,''arc you going to get your residential colleges where Government assistance and private philanthropy in New Zealand does not yet rise to tho level of an American State? Do you believe in religious effort, residential colleges founded and maintained by different • religious organisations?" . Conditions in New Zealand." was tho reply, "may b 0 different. In America it would not do at all; it would simply invite sectarian strife."

"But you have some religious lif© in your colleges, I suppose. If so, is it of any value, and how is it supplied?" "Certainly it is of valuo. AtjPrir.ceton we had a college chapel. Attendant© w-as compulsory, with certain exemptions, but the service wag 'broadly Christian, certainly not sectarian. Clergy and ministers of various denominations worn invited to take the services. But probably the greatest agency for good in the religious life of our American universities is the V.M.C.A. Branches of the Association exist in every university, and our most prominent undergraduates, academically and athletically^.are its leaders." '•And now, sir," I said, "may I pass to the second problem of New "Zealand university life. Do you believe in external examiners- or shoxild university professors examine their own students? You have got rid of the examination fetish in your schools, but I suppose it is inevitable in university

"The closer you can bring examiner and student together the bettor. AJ r a do not have external examiners in American universities, and I do not believe in them. Of course the smallncss of your New Zealand colleges, as you point out, complicates .matters, but even then, by- layinj; down a very definite syllabus in each faculty, it ought to be possible to standardise your papers so that they might bo set with some uniformity by your own professors, In the schools we have practically abandoned, all formal examinations. They have a certain advantage in what I might call co-ordinating knowledge, but the disadvantages outweigh-this." "I suppose," I eaid, "in this as in every other phase of education, the whole thing depends upon the teacher?" "Exactly. I have always had a profound distrust of pedngogicmethod. As a teacher I liavo had to submit - to it, but I hayo always contended that methods were invented for people who could not teach.'"

The clock was already pointing after 12, and I knew "there was a Rod Indian chief outside who had ridden three thousand miles to ask the President to proclaim October 12th as an Indian national holiday. I also knew thero was a string of senators, place-hunters, and deputatiohs to see tho President before lunch, so I rose to go. Whilo I was selecting a door for my exit, I thanked him for giving mc so much of his time, and expressed the hope I had not prevented him from getting his afternoon game of golf. "Not at all." was the smiling reply. "I'm very triad we have had this discussion, and if anything I have said is of help, I am sure you are very welcome.''

American Presidents probably vary. Mr Woodrow Wilson is the first I have met. But'whatever may be said ior or against his administration, I carried away with mc the memory of a very human personality whose kindliness and scholarship adorn the Presidential chair of a great Republic.