DEFENCE QUESTIONS.

Auckland Star, Volume XLIV, Issue 225, 20 September 1913, Page 11

DEFENCE QUESTIONS.

UXNISTER BOMBARDED. • S3USINESS METHODS CRmciSED. AN (By Telegraph.—Parliamentary Reporter.) WELLINGTON, Friday. the House went into committee on the Estimates this afternoon the class-, opened up on for the day was defence a brisk succession of question- and comments bemg directed at the Minister in ChaTge (Hon. Mr. Allen) on various defence subjects. Attention was called by Mr. Witty to an increase of £4,000 in the vote of £33,125 far payment of SS officers of beadquajiei-' and d's-trict stalls. Tnere were eight additional officers whose pay averaged £530 each. Were they imported or raised from the rank-. The Minister of Defence replied that Erin* lieutenants* were promoted from __m-commi__ioned rank. Mr. McCallum raised a protest against the high salaries paid to the leading officers, comparing € them with the teachers in primary schools. He complained of the way in which Territorialhad been forced into winter camps. Many ■youths had had to be sent into hospital with pneumonia through having to camp on damp ground. Tie Minister, in reference to bad cooking in the Territorial camps, admitted that the cooking in the camps was not all it should be. and it would not be till the Department had trained and paid cooks; but it was hoped to obtain a staff of trained cooks, which should remedy the trouble. A CLUB INCIDENT. Mr. Robertson declai-ed that the feel- | _ng was abroad that there was far too aznuch class distinction shown by officers -sof the Defence force. He made parti- ! cular reference to the example of exclusiven_ss illustrated recently by the .Mack-ailing of an officer at tbeWelling■ton Garrison Officers' Club. It wae quite true, replied'the Minister ?s_f Defence, that the Wellington Garrison ' Officers' Club excluded an officer who had 'come into'conflict with some of his colileagues, but he had laid down the rule "that an officers' club is open to eFery J officer wearing the King's uniform. The -club occupied rooms in the Defence ".Buildings, and- had .been informed that it Smust either recognise that rule or vacate 4he premises. He understood that the *-_r_b had accepted the latter alternative. RED-HOT MILITARISM. Another demurrer was raised on the 'Territorial camp question by Mr. Anderson, who complained of insufficient elasticity in the regulations regarding attending camps at stipulated times, independent of whether it would be convenient to the Territorials or not. The system, be urged, must be made to fit in with the needs of the peoph?. and especially of the country people,, otherwise it would become endangered. "We don't ' -want any red-hot iron-bounid militarism, 'hut commonsense, or tliere will be irouble," declared the member, who "quoted cases where young am had been lauled before magistrates far failing to , travel impossible distances to parades :• and drills. '"COST"AND LANGUAGE. Ts there any chance of eir&iing down tlie cost of defence? asked Mr. Okey, adding, *$t is pretty clear that the country is not prepared to spend half a million every year." (Labour members: Hear, hear.) The member for Taranaki proceeded to comment on what he contended was the unbusinees-like way of doing many things in tbe Depau-tment when information was required. All torts of delays and referring on took ■place, everyone apparently finding at his ■business to pa=s on the inquiry to someone else. It was time, he argued, when this unbnsiness-like way should be brought before the Minister. "There is another thing."' went on Mr. Okey: *"'great complaint exists about the language allowed in these training cajups. especially after lights out at night. The officers' quarters should be in the main camp, to keep watch over the boys, -vhose mothers. I am informed on very authority, have good reason for -*o-_ph-rning about the language their iboys hear in these camps. This sort of ■ -thing is a reflection on the system and ixm the Department," declared the ' -•mi ember. Mr Payne likened the average military i -L___tn to a mere schoolboy in business mat=J_ers, to- be treated as such. "It stands to they know nothing about business ■3-ethods. They are just ""State hitchers/' Grey Lynn. A CLOTHING BLUNDER. \ Mr Dickson, referring to the last Tercamp at Morrinsville, said tbat--*a serious blunder occurred then in the -anatter of clothing. Even after i-pres- . z_ent_±ion had been made to General God-S-ey, only one of several companies was -Supplied with overcoats, while only 50 •or 60 per cent of the men were supplied .Svith waterproof sheets. Fortunately, he •a-dded. tlie weather remained fine, but that sort of thing was not the way to •popularise the system with young men. The member for Parneil also informed ffche Minister that he had heard serious tomplainis about bad language in the Palmerston North camp. The evil might be minimised if the officers slept at the camps instead of in hotels, as they did at Palmerston. What was good enough for the __m-_orj_missioned officers should be good enough for the commissioned officers. Mr Payne: They want wrapping up in Cotton wool. Mr Bollard, unlike other members, had nothing but good to s;iy of the Territorial camps. There was no complaint about supplies for the camp in his district, as these were obtained by tender in the neighbourhood. The men were a credit to the Territorials, and everyone was sorry when they left. GREY LYNN REBUKED. Mr Isitt protested against the type of criticism which had. come from the meniber for Grey Lynn. It lowered the tone A)f parliament and cut the throat of legitimate criticism. He had brought before the attention of the Minister of _3fe£e__e the ease of an officer drilling a company and using languages so bad that Jhe could not repeat it. No doubt it w-ia a trick of the tongue. These men thought nothing of it, but they must be told that jseople in New Zealand would not stand language of the sort. Mr Isitt again brought up the plaint -that oertain lads bad been proceeded ~_3P_n_t again and again, white others Hwsre allowed to go- scot free. Nothing ksavoarxng of -par-opal animus-on.- the part Ljrf any official shb-ld. -be-alloTS-d to imthe effectireness \ot the Territorial BB___s_D_-E«

-5,000 SAVED ON SCPP]__E&T" ~ The Minister of Defence replied: that the department tried to run the camps as eco_*miica_ly as it could, and it w_s its duty to get supplies where they were cheapest. fl. did not agree that military men were not business men. Having had experience of their work, he was able to- say that, owing to the business «*pa_ity of the officer who was responsible for the camp suppEes, a saving of fo,ooo was effected. This was partly due to the fact that he obtained supplies in the cheapest market, transporting from North to South, or vice versa, if necessary. There must be difficulties in the initiation of the scheme, and this was one of the troubles over neglect tosend notice of postponed drills. Tbe iumber of drill sergeants was insafficient-and it had been suggested that a longer time in camp was better than the periodical drilling. "But," continued the Minister, "we cannot demand a greater sacrifice than the present from our young men." As for the fining of a, man for absenting himself from one drill when he had been a regular attendant, he could not understand it. unless the parade was compulsory. He bad had an idea that a permanent camp would be a good thing, hut when it came to organisation and the movement of men in tlie field, the permanent barrack system,! allowing men to train as units instead of battalions, was not in 'aecoTd with modern views of training. He admitted ■that waste must be checked, but he wished members to give the scheme time. Last years expenditure included £100,000 of a non-recurring nature, and this year £50,000 or £60,000 was for similar purposes. Last year the nonrecurring expenditure was upon ISpounder guns, all the equipment, and a mountain battery and mules. Mr. Payne: They will be out of date in a year. The Minister: They will become obso-, lete in time, but not for a great many j years. IS IT TOO COSTLY"? "We are paying more per head for land defence in New Zealand than they do in Australia, and I want to put my j protest on record against the growing expenditure on defence," said Mr. Hanan. "If the country gets up in arms against this expense the system will have to go. —Jid therefore we must keep a strong hand on it. Those responsible to the Minister and Parliament must be made to realise that expenditure has to be kept down,'' he added. The Minister repned that he would be only too glad to accept suggestions as to the way of effecting a saving. As to the present expenditure, the annual recurring expenditure was £400,000 or £450,000, and the non-recurring about £1-00,000. He explained that Lord Kitchener's scheme failed to deal with a number of very necessary matters, including senior cadets and rifle clubs. Next year, howeveT, the non-recurring expenditure could be wiped off, and then on the annual appropriation they should be able to equip tbe whole force within eight or ten years. EFFORTS TO CHECK LANGUAGE. On the subject of bad language in camps, Mr. Alien voiced his anxiety *o cheek ft, as the consumption of liquor had been stopped, but than, members knew how impossible it was when a large number of men got together to stop bad language altogether. Every effort was being made to stop it, the General being as keen about it as he was himself. Mr. Allen explained that every encouragement was given for ministers of religion to visit the camps, while the V.M.C.A. bad started determined work towards the check of "bad language in the camps. If an officer used such language it was the duty of the Commandant to see he was punished. ADMINISTRATION MATTERS. In reply to a question trom Mr. Payne, he admitted some mistakes had been made at first regarding uniforms, but they were not very costly mistakes, and had -been pat right as soon as possible. Respecting Mr. Dickson's remarks about tbe failure to supply overcoats, tbe Minister told members that he had been informed that co-is were only supplied upon application, and no applications-tad been made. As to the complaint of country members about camps at inconvenient times, if the -men were willing -to go into camp three weeks a year, and be done with it, the Department would be quite ready to meet them. The Minister assured Mr. Isitt that he did not approve of individual men being continually summoned, and others allowed to go scot free. (Hear, hear.) He was perfectly well aware that men were being summoned over and over again, but be was opposed to persecution, and was determined to stop anything of the kind brought to ibis notice. EXPEDITIONARY FORCE. Replying to Mr. Forbes, the Minister ' of Drfence said there was no litem on the J__timates in regard to the expeditionary io-ree, f orthe reason that it would consist of tbe Territorials with the present equipment, plus the transport arrangements which would harve to be provided in due connse. No expense would be incurred over -he .matter. As for importing officers, if New Zealand could train a sufficient number no more would be brought from England. The vote, totalling £505,047, was passed without alteration.