SIR JAMES CARROLL.

Star (Christchurch), Issue 10197, 5 July 1911, Page 4

SIR JAMES CARROLL.

'/X-: SPEECH AT DUNEI)IN. [P*st Press Association.l DUNEDIN, July 4. ?. "Sir 3aines Carroll addressed a large gathering of citizens in the Garrison Hail this evening and received a most .attentive and enthusiastic hearing. Politics, he said, were at present in the dull order of things. Why., he asked.,- was there this apathy and indifference? It was because those mem- ' hers of the Opposition who had boon campaigning during the last six weeks . had failed utterly to submit to the intelligence of the people anything that gave them cause for reflection or concern. As to the Opposition, Mr Massey in his bucolic order was a line man, but his policy Mas destructive, not con- » He had so much respect for the Opposition that' he would not for * anything disturb them from their prer sent position. The statements made i by Mr Massey ami Mr Allen as to overtures being made to the Opposition by t the Government to join in with it j Could not. be substantiated, and he : , 4 - ead a cablegram from Sir Joseph * iWard, under date June 11, to the eff feet that they were absolutely without foundation. The meiuhers of the Govi " erhmentwere not timeservers. They were there at the will of the people, * .whose estate they were administering, and whose duty it was to elect trusT toes, and he was proud to say that the Government had enjoyed the con- ' fidenee of the people lor twenty-one years. Mr Herdman, speaking at • Wellington, had divided the people into three classes, those who were bribed, i those who were intimidated, and those :who were free. By saving this, he declared "two-thirds of the people of the country to be corrupt, "which was to say they were corrupt because they were in- . timidated and because they stood the j present Government. What a nice thing to say of them! It was what he , called political profanity. Why, he

jLsked.did the people stand it? It wa.s * < in, their hands to turn the Government / dotK ■'' He left the people to answer Messrs Massey, Allen and Herdma.n. Mr Massey had given an address at Hastings on the previous evening, in the course of which lie had said that "Sir James Carroll was wrong in stating tha4> 76' per cent of the public debt was interest-earning. a» only 03 per cent was returning interest, and theTesorfc was an increase in taxation." Thi3 represented only a difference of 13 per cent. Now, this was great homage for the leader of the Opposition to come within 13 per cent of his statement. and therefore the rest must be true. (Laughter.) The public debt to-day stood at 81 millions. What was selfsupporting? The amount expended on railways was £25.602.000. The railways belonged to the people, and did they begrudge this twenty-five millions? If they offered them in the public market an American syndicate would give fiftv million for them. Loans to Ipcal bodies accounted for £'4.882.000, and would anyone assert that provision was not a good one? Who would eay that the}' should not help their local bodies to secure money at a cheap rate of interest and thus provide for the settler ,and the backblocker? Telegraph and telephone lines represented £1.431.000. Was that wrong? "Was it not the people's service? They talked about Socialism and held up their hands in horror at the' mention of it. This was true State Socialism, and it was paying'its way.' Their reserve fund securities represented £BOO,OOO. They had that amount in London, and they were gilt-edged .securities. Thus they had feelf-supporting concerns representing a total of £32,715,000. Then there were profit-earning concerns. First, they fiad Advances to Settlors and Workers, £7,939,700, which represented one of the most beneficent pieces of legislation ever passed in any country in the, world. Then they had land for settlements, represented by £6.303.485. There had been no land' for the small settler in the south, and the Government had to buy up large estates to bring about closer settlement. All over the dominion the State had come ,to. the- rescue of the small settler in this manner. It was a. State responsibility. The State had undertaken to jilace people on estates that belonged to the nation. It was only through . the Land for Settlements Act that the Government could accomplish this. QPhen they had an amount of half a imillion represented by Bank of New •Zealand shares. They would remem- ', fcer the time when the Bank of New : Zealand was on the verge of insolvency, when a pail was hanging over j the country. The mind could hardly ! measure the terribie consequences that would have followed had the Govern- i nient not come to the rescue. Thus l they had £14.743.185 earning profit. | Than they had a total of £.15.034,835 indirectly bearing interest. Of this the •mount expended on roads and bridges construction was £6.871.251. How could they do without these? The sum expended on , public buildings was : £5,240,251. How could they do with- j out their public buildings? Purchase of Native lands avus represented by ! £2,461,167. AH these purchases had j •become Crown lands for settlement of i the people of this country. Finally, j New Zealand. Consols represented I £462,166. To indirectly interest-bear- ! . ing loans might reasonably be added I those raised for immigration £2.463,000 i . and for improving tourist and health j

' resorts £131.507. But even without j these the loans which were not felt by the taxpayer amounted to £62,493.020, or 76 per cent of the total. The non-interest-hearing portion was represented by immigration £2.463,000, Maori war loans £2.357,000. old defence loans £2,783,000, harbour and lighthouses £573.000, development of goldfields and coal mines £987.000. tourist and health resorts £131.507, and scenery preservation £40.000! This was an explanation of the total gross debt that stood ! against their names. Mr Massey, in one of bis speeches, spoke,of the lingo borrowing of last year. He said that the present Government had borrowed six and a half million in one year. He (Sir I James) frankly admitted that, and he j would show them what it was for, ' and ask them if there were any ; items they could do without. llt comprised railway construction £1,600,000, additional rolling stock £700,000, land settlement and goldholds development £1.000.000, purchase of Native lands £IOO.OOO, advances to settlers £1.07-5,000. advances Ito workers. £325.000, other public i works £200,000, and Dreadnought £1,250,000. total £6,850,000. The Opposition would have it that members of the Government were putting all this money in their pockets. Innuendo and insinuation were the blackest crimes in the category of political warfare. The Opposition knew of these j figures, and why had it not told the people of thorn? Mr Massey had also i referred to Native land lying idle, and I he had now admitted that the data ! used Ijv the Native Minister might he \ correct after all. He first said there j ■neix- six million acres of Native land j lying idle, and then in two weeks he i had dropped down to four million; ! hut that*was nothing for tho leader of I the Opposition. " And these he your \ gods, 0 Israel!'' said Sir James amid j laughter. Then Mr Massey had said that the Acting-Prime Minister had materially assisted him in calling attention to one of the greatest evils of the country, namely, .Maori landlordism. Why was that phrase " Maori landlordism '"' used? It was to stir up prejudices in the minds of the white i people against their brothers. What j was the .difference between Maori landlordism and pakeha landlordism ? (A Voice: "None.'') There should not < be. There were 10,000 Maoris in this country, choir kith and kin. and if they divided up the whole of tho land left to them it would not cover thirty acres per head. There were some politicians who had tenantry. '■Mr James Allen, he believed, was a landlord. If they did not want a Maori landlord, let them do away with the pakeha landlord. Let them make landlordism a crime, so that there should be no landlords, and he was with them. (Applause.) He challenged Mr Massey to point out two, three or four Maoris owning property that would bring them under the graduated tax. What was the position;' There wore 133 Europeans who owned thirteen million acres. (Cries of " Sharne!") Was that right? Why didn't they turn the hose on them? (Laughter.) And in -the face of this they talked about Maori landlordism. Continuing, j Sir James dealt with Native land legislation. They did not want their Maoris dependent upon the charitable institutions of the country. Let them point him -out ono instance where a Maoii was in a charitable institution, or did they over ,seo a Maori seeking maintenance through the Magistrate's Court? They did not want the balance of the Maori laud for a few speculators. Mr Ma.sscy knew nothing whatever about the ''gospel of taihoa." Hewent storming round the country about a. matter "tie knew nothing about. Though the Opposition charged the Government with a blundering policy of borrowing, it never voted against a loan, and it then went to the people and said the country was on the edge of ruin, and now they had Mr Massey saying that, they must he moderate in borrowing? Why did lie not say what he thought? Instead of that he left it open, .so that he could answer as it j suited him at some later date. It was j a most extraordinary thing that when ! the Government came along with j its little plate the Oliver Twist ! Opposition was there first, and. ! its demands for roads, bridges, j ■and so on genera lly exceeded! the amount of the whole loan. (Laugh- ! t-er.) He referred to tho Public Debt | Extinction Act conceived by the Government. The Opposition' had an apprehension, but no argument against it. Mr Massey forgot to tell the people that provision was made in this Act that all the money so retained was paid into the State Guarantees Department and from there loaned out on interest to farmers and workers for a period of thirty-six years. Sir James Carroll concluded by referring to the legislative enactments of the Government and the position of the Opposition, cap in hand, going to the people and asking them to give them a chance. They traversed the whole gamut of political ipiestions. resorted to .-louse, and then wound up by saying the Government had been in office tweiiiy-one years and it was time the Opposition had a chance. Had the Opposition suggested anything in regard to hnauce, land (.bar their cry of the freehold), or any humane or social measures or anything for the beneht of the workers? They wanted to take away the national endowments set apart for education, old age pensions, and so forth.

Sir James .said lie Lad benefited vory much by liis visit to the south, and had the pleasure of viewing huge plains stretching away beyond the lino oi ono's vision. The people had been most hospitable, irrespective or politics, and had received him with open arms. The hospitality ho had received from the white people of the south had reminded him of the old patriarchs of the past, who were the living embodiment of hospitality. Tiie Hon A. T. Xgata, in the course ol a brief though most interesting address, said the fact of a half-caste occupying the position of Acting-Prime Minister of this great country was the greatest compliment that the white people could pay to anyone who belonged to the coloured rr.ee. He dealt with two aspects of the Native land problem. The. ideal of the white man was individualisation of Native land titles. How long was it going to take the Go»rnm<>nt to accomplish it? Jt would., with all the resources at the back of the State, ta.ko thirty years. A mistake had boon made in defining the -Maori title in accordance with Native customs. That wa-s a wrong they could never put right. 'lt was a hopeless job to individualise titles, but between, settlement and individualisation they were making the most of the situation. The nest side of policy was to put the Maori on exactly the same footing as the white man. The larger section of the Maori people were spendthrifts, and .storekeepers would give a Maori credit with a view to in the end. acquiring his estate. No Maori who had mortgaged his land in the north had been aide' to redeem it, and so long as the Maori was more 0.0.en. to the temptation el'

hard cash, so roust there he restrictions to protect him against the more persevering and more intelligent -white man. Tempted by the sight of the cheque-book of the Gnvenrment land purchaser, he gave up his patrimony, and one of the finest things placed on the Statute Book was that no Maori should sell his land at less than Government valuation. He hoped the day would quickly come when, as members of the Young Maori Party, they could on their merits say to the white people. '• Now come along," but for the present he would ask that they should extend to the Maori their protection in order to ensure his preservation.