CAVERSHAM GASWORKS

Otago Daily Times, Issue 13983, 16 August 1907, Page 2

CAVERSHAM GASWORKS

FURTHER INTERESTING EVIDENCE.

(From Our Own Corbespondent.) WELLINGTON, August 15. Tho committee that is considering tho Dunedin Suburban Gas Company's Bill resumed the taking of evidence this morning. All tho members of tho oommittco were present, Mr W. Frasor acting as chairman. ■, Mr Scott said he wished to oorreet a mistake in his ovidonco givon yesterday. Ho had said that there had lxxm a largo number of new councillors appointed. What he meant to say was that there had been a largo number of now committteomou elcctcd on the Gas Committee. In answer to Mr Bell, ho said tliat Mr Courtis's valuation of the works was £16,152. Mr Bell: What was his valuation in his first report. Witness: I do not remember his stating a valuation.

Mr Bell: Was it £27,W0. Witness: It may have been; I cannot say from memory. Mr Bell: Is it corroot that in 1903 his valuation was between £27,000 and £28,000. Witness: I cannot say from memory. Witness, in answer to other questions, eaid that Mr Walker had boon chairman of the Gas Committee for over two years. Mr Loudon, tho Mayor, 3a<a been in the council throughout tho negotiations; yet neither of theso gentlemen was ooining up to givo evidence. Mr Bell: Why not?

Witness: Well, that was decided,in committee of tho council, and I would hardly bo at liberty to st&to it. ' < Mr Boll: I do hot aslc you to stato that. Why are they not coming as witnesses?

Witness: It was tho wish of tho council that thoy should not come.

Mr Bell: Then the head of the council Mayor of the corporation and tho chairman who have been there during tho whole of the negotiations, are not coming to give evidence. Why is this oommittco not to have tho benefit ,of tho evidence of the and the chairman of the Gas Committee, of the Gas Committee?

"Witness: That is a matter entirely for tho council themselves. Thoy dccided that only one should represent thorn—viz., myself, and that the other two gentlemen should not attend. Mr Bell; Why? "Witness: Well, I hardly like to make a statement'. It becomcs a porsonal matter. Further pressed, witness said that in regard to ono of tJiese men the reason was because ho was very intimate with a prominent man of the Caversham gaswor)<s. That was <mo of the reasons.

Mr Boil: What about tho other gentleman?

Witness: 'lhe other gentloman is chief oxcoutivc officer of tho City Council, and as such his position is to be upheld. Therefore I would prefer not to say. Mr Bell: Very well, I will not unduly the witness. Tho council first appointed its Mayor and the chairman of the Gas Committee to come.

Tho Chairman: Along with Mr' Scott Mr Bell: Yes, with Mr Scott. Witness: On tho casting vote of the chair. Mr Boll: And subsequently thoy rescinded that motion? Witness: Yes. .

Mr Bell: And sont yon and the Town Clerk?

Witness: Yes, on the motion of the same gentlertian. who proposed the first motion, and by a iarge majority. Mr Boll: Tho council had reason to fear that the ovidencc of these gentlomen would not be as forcible as yours? Witness: I cannot say that. None of these gentlemen was conversant with tho earlier stages of the negotiations. I voted for the motion tho first . time, and tho 6econd time I retired and did not vote at all. Mr Bell: Why? Witness: Becauso it was a porsonal matter with myself. I don't think it righi that a councillor should vote on anything he is interested in. I mean simply m Tegard to the motion as to who should give evidence. The nutter was loft in the hands of the Citv Solicitor.

Mr Bell: Then the city solicitor does not call the Mayor nor the chairman of the Gas Committee.

Mr Gray asked if it was a fact that tho loan for now works was necessary because of tho starving of the works in the past. Tho witness said that had been simply an election cry. ■ •■• Mr Gray:. Bo you. think it was sound finance to transfer large sums to the general account and 1 not to inr vvc the works?

Witness said ho thought it was sound, because there was a sinking fund which would more than cover the bringing of the works up to da to. Mr Gray: But that will leave yon still with a liability of £100,000. Witness: Yes, but that is only half what the works are worth. ' The Chairman: I understand it was left to the council's solicitor to decide who should bo selected to come here. Witness: Entirely. The Chairman: There was no resolution unt.il your solicitor had selected who should come? , , Witness: That is so.

The Chairman: Supposing the Caversham Company was wiped" out. of existence, do you anticipate that the city would make a profit out of the new consumers? Witness Not for two years; but eventually it would. The reduction of tho prices by the city would donar its braking a profit for some time.

Mr Davcy: If the Caversham Company docs not operate thero will bo a tendency to, drive the other boroughs lo the city? "Witness: Yes,. In answer to questions by Mr Buddo, | Witness said that owing to the previous notion of the Waipori Company the city, through having, to buy its works, would have to suffer a loss for the next five years. Mr MacGrcgor: .Yon are aware that the engineer of t-lie company litis not been brought to Wellington? Witness: Yds. Mr MaeGregor: You know that Mr Brown, who is an attorney with Mr Hosking, was present during the first day of the inquiry. Yet he was-not caUcd. -Witness: Yes. Mr MacGrcgor: You don't suggest that the evidence of these gentlemen has been deliberately kept back?' Witness; No, I lake it they have Rot all the evidence they want without, thorn. Witness, in answer .to. further questions by Mr MacGrcgor, said lie was the only one of the councillors who was acquainted with the whole of the negotiations from the outset. The other mombers wnra pot acquainted with what led up to tho negotiations. ' He had been approached in 1904 by Mornington and TCoelyn in regard to agas supply from the city, because they worn not satisfied' with the Caversham supply. : They also stated that if they had gas from the city it would lead to amalgamation with the city. If this bill went through il would boa iecidcfl hindrance to the amalgamation. The Mayor had had at least' one conference with Mr Hosking that was not authorised. Witness suggested as a basis for arbitration the question of tho' actual value of tho mains and reticulation that could be used by the city not'subject to any goodwill. That would be the only basis the city could agree to in regard to Oaversham. It would not apply to (lie other boroughs. To the Chairman: Witness thought the boroughs were still dissntisfuxl with" tho present cha-rges, but not with the proposed charges in the bill. Witness did not know their opinion just now. Mr R. W. Richards, Town Clerk and Citv Engineer of Dunedin, gave evidence regarding tlie interview of the company's representatives with the ex-Mayor (Mr Lawrence). The latter asked what the company wanted, and asked them .to state a. price ' iii their letter, subsequently sent ill. r The; represents.! ivos of the company did not, ' howovcr, do so, More becoming City Engineer lie became familiar with'the position and prospects. of the city gasworks, of which he recoinmomled a reorganisation, •with the ,-esnlt thijt Mr Courtis'retired. ■ Plans wero prepared for an extension of the works. Mr Courtis's recommendation to buy the Caversham works was because they would give increased storage, and Mr Suggate's was because they would an increased output and cheaper produofcion. Witness detailed- the operations that led to " an improvement, in regard to tho output. The city gasworks wero now in a position lo produce the extra supply that the Caver.sham works were producing. The watergas- plant would bo - needed ill connection with this supply. Tho present storage, however, would not bo sufficient to admit of that supply heini? delivered unless evorv- ; thing went 011 in a perfectly safe manner. The council, however, hud decided to borrow £50,000 to improve its works in anticipation of having to supply tho extra quantity. When the proposed extensions wero coiuploted tho city gasworks would be on a workable and satisfactory basis. The council was committed to the new works, and they would bo completed in from 12 to 18 months. Tho new works would be in full swing by 1909, when the Caversham Company's concession terminated. The object of" the new works was mainly to increase tho storage capacity,. If the bill passed and 'there was no■ increased outlet I the proposed expenditure of £50,000 would

over-capitalise the concern. The present Caversham mains, wero in some places on tlio Flat in a, doubtful condition, and in others in a thoroughly 60iind -condition. One sample of pipes lie had seen was qnito perished. The larger pipes wore sound. As the condition of the pipes on the Flat was, doubtful the city should not buy them at. a fixed price. Witness knew that Mr MacGregor had been instructed by the. Mayor p'ersonally lo see M,r Hosking with tho objeot of hie submitting proposals for the_ purchase on valuation of.the C veraham. reticulation. The correspondence was uot entered into without authority. Tho Mornington Borough Council had decided to get clectrio lighting: ..from the city ...before tho recent change in the personnel of the council, but the decision had never been formally carried out.

To Mr Findlay: The consumption of gas had increased in Dunedin sinco the installation of oleetric lighting. That was always tho case. The. ono marched with the other. He did not know that tho Mornington Council had now decided to take gas instead of electric light. Ho did not know tho condition of the city's own reticulations. The bad pipes in Caversham wore only 011 the flat, low-lying ground that was subject to flooding. There was a good deal of the Caversham reticulation not 011 tho . flat. Witness had found the storage capacity of tho City Gasworks insufficient-. Anything going wrong would plunge the city in darkness. Wkm tho now works wore completed the storage would be largely increased! Theiengineer's estimate for;,tho expenditure oii now .works would have been considerably reduced if tho extra supply for Caversham, do,, had not been considered.

Mr Findlay: The engineer's estimate was made in view of supplying the outside boroughs. How much of tho estimate related to the new borough? Witness: No sum lias teen allotted. Mr Findlay: Arc yon prepared to allot it? Witness: No.

Mr Findlay: The expenditure incurred has not brought tho works up to present requirements?

Witness: Some of the gas-making plant is worn out,

Mr Findlay: For all purposes? Witness: Yes. Tou might call some sections of it dead.

_ Witness added, in answer to other questions, that the first thing that led to the oounoil's contemplating an extension of the works was the probable supply to the boroughs. Tho counoil was already committed to about, £31,000 out of the £50,000. No arrangement had yet been made with these boroughs—Mornington, Roslyn,, and St. Kilda. Even if the bill did not pass there would be nothing to prevent these boroughs going in for their own gas-making. The past profits of the city, works wero largely due to the starvation of the works. Mr Courtis was not able to properly carbonise tho eoal owing to tho deficiency in his plant. Witness did not know that the Wellington Gas Company was extending its works so as to have another storage plant in a different part of the district. It was sometimes wise to distribute the holding capacity. It would depend upon the territory. To Mr MaoGrcgor: Tho perishing of the pipes on the flat at Caversham was due to the action of the soil there. Mr Barber proceeded to ask questions with a view of showing that the council would be making a very good bargain in buying the reticulation for £8000, seeing that the interest would be only £<00 per annum, whereas the resulting profits would lx> very much larger. At this stage the committee decided 1 upon tho usual adjournment.: ■Mr MacGrcgor intimated that the gas engineer was too ill to come up and give evidence.