Sutch’s alleged Russian ‘contact’ fled from police, says witness

Press, Volume CXV, Issue 33773, 20 February 1975, Page 2

Sutch’s alleged Russian ‘contact’ fled from police, says witness

(New Zealand Press Association)

WELLINGTON, February 19.

A detective senior-sergeant said today that, minutes before encountering William Ball Sutch in Holloway Road, Wellington, on September 26, he had recognised and tried to talk with a member of the Russian Embassy staff. The Russian had run away.

Giving evidence in the Supreme Court trial of Sutch, who is charged with a breach of the Official Secrets Act, Detective Senior-Sergeant Colin Lines identified the Russian who fled as Mr Dmitri Razgovorov.

Mr Razgovorov and another embassy staff member, Mr Vitaly Pertsev, were the two diplomats who left New Zealand —in spite of a New Zealand Government request that they stay within the embassy — soon after Sutch’s arrest.

Senior-Sergeant Lines said be went to a lavatory in Aro Street on the evening of September 26. He was with Chief Inspector Bakei and a member of the Security Intelligence Service. Soon after 8.35 p.m. he left the lavatory in the company of the two persons. He walked toward the intersection of Aro Street and Holloway Road. He saw someone on a grassed area at the top of Aro Street. "As I approached this person another person stopped beside him.” Senior-Sergeant Lines said. *1 approached the first person I had seen, whom I recognised as Mr Razgovorov, the First Secretary of the U.S.S.R. Embassy. I stopped in front of him, and identified myself.

"He made no comment He stepped round me and walked quickly down the path toward Aro Street. As he approached the road he started running across the road and started running down Aro Street.*

Senior-Sergeant Lines then walked towards Holloway Road. He saw Sutch step out from under a tree in Holloway Road near a driveway. He approached Sutch, identified himself and asked Sutch what he was doing in the area. Sutch wanted to know what was going on. Sutch. aged 67, an economist, has denied that between April 18 and September 26, last year, for a purpose prejudicial to the safety of the State, he obtained information calculated to be, or that might be, or was intended to be, directly or indirectly useful to an enemy. The hearing — fn its third day — is before an all-male jury and Mr Justice Beattie. Sutch is represented by Mr Bungay and Mr I. A. Greig. The Solicitor-General (Mr C. Savage, Q.C.) and Mr D. P. Neazor are prosecuting. Sutch had told SeniorSergeant Lines he had a bad heart and was out for a walk because of his heart condition. He told Sutch he wanted to know why he was in that area. He told him a member of the Russian Embassy staff was also in the area and wanted to know where that person was. “Preposterous” Asked why he was walking down Holloway Road, Sutch had said it was a place of his. torical interest and he was interested in historical buildings and places. Senior-Sergeant Lines said that at about this time he was joined by Detective Chief Inspector Baker and a member of the Security Intelligence Service. Chief Inspector Baker introduced Sutch to a member of the

Security Services. Sutch objected to the presence of this person. While standing in Holloway Road, Mr Baker told Sutch it was alleged he had met a member of the Russian staff in several places in Wellington, Sutch claimed this was preposterous.

Sutch was searched and taken to the central police station. Senior-Sergeant Lines asked him about the area where it was alleged he had met Mr Razgovorov. “I asked him about Hopper Street He said he knew Hopper Street, but had not been in that area during 1974. I asked him about Glen Road. He said he knew Glen Road. He said his wife had relations at the top of Glen Road, but that he had not been to Glen Road during 1974.”

He had asked Sutch if he had recently been to Karori to the mall area. Sutch said he often went to Karori. He said he often went to Karori park and walked back towards town.

Sutch had said this walking could have been in July or August and could have been in June. He had said he had been walking in Karori. He had been looking for a place in Karori where he had been invited to speak. He had been misdirected by his wife. It was dark and he got lost. Senior-Sergeant Lines said he asked Sutch if he had ever met Mr Razgovorov. Sutch denied this. "I told him that on the night he was seen at the Karori mall Razgovorov had been seen in the area. He denied Razgovorov was there to meet him or that they had met I asked him if he knew this person. He said he didn’t” Photograph Sutch had said he had met some Russians socially. Witness arranged for a photograph of Razgovorov to be obtained. This was shown to Sutch. Senior-Sergeant Lines said Sutch had told him that he had gone up the driveway in Aro Street to urinate.

A photograph showing Sutch and witness—an exhibit—was discussed.

Witness agreed that the trees shown on the extreme right of the photograph could not be seen on another photograph, also an exhibit. I Asked by Mr Bungay who cut down the trees, Mr Lines said they were removed by the police. He agreed that trees shown in another photograph were also removed by the police. Asked by Mr Bungay "what was the idea of cutting down?” Mr Lines said the officer in charge of the search had Instructions to search for anything that might be of significance. “I guess he thought it was necessary to cut down the trees.”

Mr Bungay: The whole Of that area, the grass and shrubs was searched, was it not? Witness: It was.

Mr Bungay: Anything of significance found?—Nothing. During further crossexamination witness agreed that since Sutch’s arrest extensive inquiries had been conducted by himself and Mr Baker. Inquiries had been

conducted throughout New Zealand and abroad. Witness agreed that extensive inquiries had been made about Sutch and about the sort of Information he might possess, but no further evidence based on these inquiries would be introduced. Re-examined by Mr Savage, witness said he recalled Mr Bungay asking him in cross-examination about a discussion relating to questions put to Sutch about being "on the hook.” “Mr Baker suggested to him that he had been meeting with the Russians because he was on the hook with the Russians,” witness said. “The hook” “He explained to him what he meant by the hook: the Russians had some control over him. He was asked if that was the position then was the opportunity to tell us about it.” Witness said Sutch had denied he was ever on the hook with the Russians. Detective Chief Inspector Arthur Walker Baker said that at 835 p.m. on Thursday, September 26, he was in a lavatory in Aro Street with Senior-Sergeant Lines and a member of the Security Intelligence Service. He and the others left the lavatory and went into Aro Street. He noticed a man walking out of Aro Street up a path toward Entrance Street. Another man was walking down this path, and the two appeared to stop about opposite each other. "One of these men then proceeded to put on a parka,” Mr Baker said. “1 approached this man, informed him of my identity, and asked him to quickly identify himself. “He was able to do this after a short time, and then I retraced my steps and went round into Holloway Road where I observed Detective Senior-Sergeant Lines talking to a man. As I got closer I identified this man as Dr Sutdi.” - Home searched Mr Savage: When you said to Dr Sutch he had been observed meeting a Russian on the three occasions you specified did he give an answer?

Witness: The doctor said the whole thing was preposterous, and that he thought he should be represented. Mr Baker said he advised Sutch the police were in possession of search warrants under the provisions of the Official Secrets Act to search his office and home. Later in the evening Sutch telephoned his wife, who is a barrister and solicitor.

The police and security men accompanied Sutch to his home, which was searched, and then took Sutch to the central police station, where Sutch was charged. Mr Baker said that on October 24, by arrangement, he went to the office of Mr Bungay.

“I was in possession of a letter. I there met Dr Sutch and showed him the letter. He read it and acknowledged that the signature on the letter was his.”

Mr Baker then produced the letter, which was addressed to the AttorneyGeneral and had been read at the lower court hearing, as an exhibit

Earlier. Mr X, another of the Security Intelligence Service witnesses, said he had also been in the Aro Street area on September 26. At 8.34 p.m., a car which he knew was usually driven by Mr Razgovorov came along Raroa Road and into Entrance Street. The car did a U-turn, backed up, stopped and parked. The driver turned off the lights and engine and sat there. There was one person, in the driver’s seat. Three minutes later, Mr X said, he saw a man wearing a three-quarter length coat, umbrella, and trilby hat walk across the glade.

“I knew this man most definitely to be Razgovorov," witness said. He walked across Raroa Road to Entrance Street and to the passenger door of the car. He stayed there about 30 seconds

and appeared to be leaning into the vehicle.”

At that moment, witness heard of Sutch’s arrest on the two-way radio he was carrying. He walked towards the car, which drove off. He recognised Mr Vitaly Perisev, superintendent at the Russian Embassy, at the wheel. Others there As Mr X was walking towards the car, Mr Razgovorov was walking back in the direction from which he had come.

Mr Razgovorov moved back down the path before he got to the intersection. He was approached and spoken to by another man whom witness could not identify at the time but later knew to be Detective Senior-Sergeant Lines.

Witness said at that stage a number of people seemed to appear and then go away again.

Thg, car was seen twice again in the area in the following few minutes. Mr Bungay asked witness if he had ever seen Sutch and Mr Razgovorov meet Mr X said he had, in Hopper Street. Mr Y of the Security Intel-

ligence Service, was another witness.

Mr Y said that on August 28, he was on duty to see if Mr Razgovorov met Sutch.

He was stationed on the eastern side of Hopper Street facing Aro Street At 8 p.m., when it was dark, a Russian Embassy car went down Hopper Street, travelling north, stopped, and reversed into Aro Street The lights went out and the driver got out. It was Mr Razgovorov, and he walked down Hopper Street to the intersection of Hopper Street and Webb Street.

Mr Y said at approximately 8.30 p.m. Mr Razgovorov retraced his steps using precisely the same route and returned to his car parked in Aro Street. He got in the car, sat in it for about 30 seconds, then emerged once again. Mr Razgovorov walked down Hopper Street as before and he met with a man outside the telephone kiosk. The two men walked back up Hopper Street together. At this point witness recognised Mr Razgovorov*s companion as Sutch. The two went into the entrance way of a building.

They were both in witness’s sight. Sutch stood with his back to the lefthand side wall of the entrance way facing inwards. Mr Razgovorov was facing and looking out towards the street.

Witness said the lighting was particularly good because behind the two glass doors the interior of the building was fully , illuminated.

Sutch and Mr Razgovorov were together for a very short time. Witness saw a movement by Sutch only when he lifted his right leg and balanced his briefcase upon his right knee for about 30 seconds. Mr Y was not able to see. if Sutch did anything else; with his briefcase. After about two minutes together the two men left the entranceway. Mr Razgovorov walked to his car on Arlington Street briskly first and at a trot for the last few yards. He travelled off at “some speed.’’ Another security officer, Mr Z, gave evidence of meetings between Sutch and the Russians. He took several photographs. The case is proceeding.