OCEAN MAILS.

Auckland Star, Volume XXXIV, Issue 272, 14 November 1903, Page 6

OCEAN MAILS.

TRISGO SERVICE RENEWED

FOX SHU—£ YEABS.

VANCOUVER PROPOSALS

APPROVED.

(By Parliamentary Reporter.;

WELLINGTON, Friday.

The long expected debate on the San Francisco mail service took place this afternoon, when the Postmaster-General, Sir Joseph Ward, moved the resolutionsgiven notice of on Tuesday, renewing the 'Frisco service contract for three years, and giving authority for the establishment of a Vancouver" line. He reminded members that tbe Oceanic Steamship Company had entered into a ten years' contract with the United States Government, and as a result of this contract and the United States navigation law, the Union Company were driven .out of the service. Though there were troubles at first when the new steamers were put on, things had worked very satisfactorily. A delay of a few hours on tbe return trip might result in several days delay in the mails reaching London, but in no instance had recipients in London been unable to answer correspondence by the return mail. The amount paid to the Company last year was about £161,125, the total cost being £28.071, including transit and charges. The average time outwards was 30.94 days, and inward 30.b I days. He might be reminded that .he had opposed the service in 1888, but every man of common sense changed his mind as circumstances demanded. The whole position since 1888 had changed, the quantity of mail matter carried had increased by over 250 per cent., and the direct mail line bad been abolished. The cast of the mail services in 18S8 was £69,544, while last year we paid £16,1-5 for the whole of tbe matter. He asked those who objected to tbe proposals to give an alternative. It had been suggested that we join in the federal service. Well, that would cost £48,000 under existing circumstances, and on a population basis, £ 40,000, and we would be subsidising lines which carried Lascar crews, as against vessels which carried white crews and paid the highest rates of wages. Touching on the Vancouver line, Sir Joseph Ward said that until the Queensland contract expired in 1905 it would not be possible to use that route. He had received some correspondence from a firm in Canada which suggested ?the establishment of a line between New Zealand and Canada, and in the event of that coming to anything, tbe subsidy of £20,000 for the Vancouver line would be availed on In point of time the 'Frisco mail was far ahead of the federal line, "which from New Zealand would take 37 or 38 days. A federal service could not be less than fortnightly, and that would cost £48,791 a year, an impossible figure, while it would be absurd to give up a fast service costing £17,000 for a slower one costing £49,000, while to pro.vide connecting steamers would, the Union Company averred, interfere with coastal and inter-colonial trade, Members might say that with the cable service it Avas not a matter of importance to have a fast mail service, but without a subsidy, regularity, a matter of great importance to our business community, could not be assured, and while we had a telegraph system throughout New Zealand we entered' into large numbers of mail contract in various parts of the colony. In reply to the criticism that the steamers strangled certain local industries, Sir Joseph pointed put that their stoppage would result the other way, because if they did not ran, sailing vessels with much lower freights would take up the running.' He .was entirely, opposed to the American shipping laws as jfar as they affected us Ixrtween Honolulu and Trisco, but at the same time he thought those laws wextf good for the country itself, and pointed put that we were doing the same thing. This route was cheapest, fastest and best obtainable. He took exception to the cry that we were helping an alien flag. The Americans were of our owr race and blood. To pass a resolution offering postal union rates which would amount to about £4800 would be waste of time. No company in the world would run to a time-table for so small a sum. He concluded by reading a resolution passed by the council of the Australasian Federated Seamen's Union, now sitting, in favour of tbe service, on the grounds that it employed white men as against Lascars,«and paid the highest wages. Sir Joseph urged" that the service was the best we could possibly get, and very much better than its only alternative, the Federal route.

Mr. J. A. Millar moved, to amend Sir Joseph's resolution to read that it be an instruction to the that no subsidy be paid to any American company for the carriage of mails. Sir Joseph had said the edit of a Federal service would be £48,000 a year, which was more than the colony could afford •nd yet he asked the House to vote over £50,000. Sir Joseph: That is including the [Vancouver line. Mr. Millar went on to say that the jonly argument against the Federal service was that Lascar labour was employed. We could not discriminate against any part of the Empire, and no part had done more to assist its progress than liad India. The average miniper of saloon passengers to New Zealand I»y the 'Frisco mail steamers was 32, and steerage G. It was, therefore, patent that from a tourist point of view ,the service was not a very successful tone, for mose of these passengers were returning New Zealanders. Had the Government desired the Vancouver service, they could have secured the Queensland contract on accepting the liability of that State. He questioned the statement that the San Francisco steamerexpended £750 a trip in Auckland Whilst in 1892 the balance of trade in our favour was £140,000, it was now largely in favour of America. Whethei the subsidy was renewed or not the boats would have to come here in accordance with their American contract.

Sir Joseph Ward: They have only to, call on the outward trip. I Mr, Millar continued that the receipts from New Zealand, including passengers and cargo, together with the American subsidy, totalled £191,000 and besides this they bad the whole of the Sydney and Honolulu trade. On these terms the service would still pay handsomely .without the subsidy, and there was no fear of its cessation. A 36-day weekly service by the Federal line could be secured for very little more than was proposed under the resolutions If the three year minimum were agreed to the colony Avould be uable to enter into the Federal and Vancouver services, which the Commonwealth was entering into in 1895. . . Sir Joseph Ward: tte can go in at '"sir 9 Wm. Russell said Mr Millar wanted the House to throw away_ a solid advantage for what? He defied anybody to show how the colony could elsewhere get the same advantages in a mail service as they get from the 'Frisco service. As an evidence of the utility of the service, he noted that nobody ever beard of a busiuess man m New Zealand being engrossed in correspondence for the Federal sen-ice as all business men were every three Aveeks for the San Francisco service. As to the patriotic argument, he held that it was unpatriotic in the last degree to prefer the service via Brindisi, which took ten days longer of delivery than the San Francisco service. He ridiculed the idea of a payment of about £1000 to an American* company having any influence whatever on the question of Imperial free trade. Tbe papers laid before the House showed unmistakably that but for the advantage of the United States subsidy we. could not get our mails half as reasonably, and the same papers showed that the Union Steamship Company asked for £17,000 a year for a three-weekly aervice, actually more money for crossing the Tasman Sea than is paid for the San Francisco service. Air John Dutbie said _ weekly service was demanded by it he business requirements of the colony. A weekly connection with the Federal service could easily be arranged. The Americans bad crushed tbe New Zealand vessels out of the trade. Was that a cause to kiss? The regularity of tbe service depended on whether Parliament was sitting or not. He advocated the colony entering into tbe Federal service. Four or live days' faster delivery would be of no advantage wh_n the receiver had to wait two or three weeks before replying. How, be asked, could the Federal service cost us £49,000, when the total Australian subsidy was only £70,000? Tbe Auckland people had enjoyed the advantage of. the Service, and should assist the South to obtain a service. They should show some reciprocity. Mr Harding: What nbout the Soutri African service? I

Mr Massey thought that the opponents of tbe service had made out a very poor case against it. Their speeches contained more sentiment than solit'. argument. He quoted from a newspaper interview with Mr Duthie two years ago, in whch tbe member for Wellington said that the 'Frisco service was the best the colony bad ever known. (Members: "That's not saying much") Mr Duthie went on to say that until®better arrangements had been made we should not be so parsimonious as ;to drive the Oceanic Co. out of tbe running. That opinion would, said Mr Massey, be endorsed by every business man in the colony. Mr Massey admitted that the American laws operated harshly, but said it would be childish to throw away a solid advantage because we disagreed with those laws. He was quite prepared to accept any other service which was as advantageous as the '_Visco service, but could not be obtained. He was quite willing to support a Vancouver service, whatever the port of call, but for at least two years it was impossible to secure that line. Mr Massey quoted figures to shovv that the service was at least a week faster than tbe Federal. The cost by the latter service from New Zealand would be 10/G per lb., as against 10/6 by the 'Frisco route. In 18 months the Company had expended £44,160 in New Zealand. If only Postal Union rates were paid we would have no control over the vessels, and they need not carry tbe mails unless they chose. He pointed out that there was no (-subsidy to the service, but simply poundage with a guaranteed minimum. He quoted tbe opinion of the president of the Dunedin Chamber of Commerce, who expressed tbe. hope that the House would not allow sentimental reasons to interfere with the renewal of the contract.

Mr T. E. Taylor said that the essential matters in a mail service were not speed, but regularity and frequency, but this was not secured by the 'Frisco Line. The Oceanic Company was playing a game of bluif with the colony. First they wanted a seven years' contract, then five, and would now take three. Then they wanted £25,000 a year, but .would now accept £15,000. As an alternative route the Vancouver route might be developed till it became faster than the present line. No attempt had been made to secure or retain that service, but for- the purpose of keeping the Auckland members sweet the 'Frisco service had been deliberately nursed. This service took from the Union Company £ 10,000 a year in passenger traffic between Auckland and Sydney. The Premier looked upon the matter as one of business, and pointed out that no member had attempted to demonstrate that they could give an equal service at anything like an equal cost. The Vancouver service had thrown New Zealand over without warning, preferring to go to Queensland on account of the sugar trade. The Government had, however, endeavoured to re-establish that service, and there was a possibility of a fortnightly sailing being secured at a cost of about £40,000 instead of £50,000 by the Federal. Recently the 'Frisco service had been punctual and regular. Nothing could be got to equal it at any-r thing like the cost, and he did not care what it cost, they could not improve on the 'Frisco service as far as speed was concerned. In answer to the statement that nothing had been done in the last two years to secure the Vancouver service, the Premier read a series of cables, which showed that the Government had endeavoured to carry out their promise. The £20,000 proposal was not a bogus one, as some members seemed to imagine. It was a peculiar thing that a labour leader should advocate the mailbeing carried in vessels manned by Lascars and coolies. The tourist traffic was growing with the steamers. It was rfot true that Auckland looked upon the question parochially. The members'were

united, but so they, would be in any. part of the colony. It looked as if the Southern members objected simply because they came from the South Island. There had been some delay at times in tbe delivery of the mails, but when tbe Main Trunk line Avas completed, and he reckoned it would be before the contract ran out, members Avould hud out tbe value of the service, and there would be no more trouble about the reneAval of the contract.

Mr. A. L. D. Fraser continued the debate. He denied ths_t*there was any feeling against Auckland in the matter. Mr. Witheford contended that the service was a good business investment. As to Mr. Duthie's suggestion that there should be reciprocity between Auckland and tbe rest of the colony, Mr. Witheford pointed out that the South had miles and miles more railway than the North, and Auckland members still voted for Southern appropriations. He referred to the value of the 'Frisco service from a tourist point of view, and said that there was a great deal of affection in America for the colonies. He did not believe in binding ourselves hand and foot to the. Commonwealth in regard to the Federal service, when a better and cheaper service was available at our own terms..

Mr. James Allen supported the renewal of the subsidy for one year, and then proceeded to make a strong speech in opposition to the service, and in support of the Vancouver line. Sir 3. Ward quoted figures in reply to Mr. Dutbie, to show that the cost of the Federal service Avould be £48,000 annually on poundage, and £38,000 on a population baais. The amendment then Avent to a division, when it Avas -defeated by 42 votesto 31,» i the result being received with considerable applause. The division list Avas as folloAvs:

Against the amendment (42): Messrs Alison. .1. Allen, Baume, Bollard, Buchanan, Carroll, Duncan, Field, Flatmau, Fowlds, Graham, Hall, Hall-Jones, Harding, Hardy, Hekc, lierries, Hogg, Houston, Jennings, Kaihau, Kidd. Kirkbride, Lang, Lawry, Lethbridge, Major, Mander, Massey, McGowan, Mills, Moss, O'Meara Pere, Reid, Russell, Seddon, Smith, J. W. Thomson (Cltha), Vile, Witheford. For the amendment (31): Messrs Aitken, E. G. Allen, Arnold, Barber, Bedford, Buddo, Colvin, Davey, Duthie, Fisher, A. h. D. Fraser, W. Fraser, Herdman. Laureuson, LeAvis, R. McKenzie, T. Mackenzie, McNab. Millar. Parata, Remington, Rhodes, Sidey, Steward, Symes. Tanner. Taylor, J. C. Thomson, Wilford, Witty, Ward. In Committee, Mr Jas. Allen moved to strike out "three years" 'and insert "one year" as the length of the term of the contract. Mr Buchanan seconded, considering that the country did not want tbe service to become permanent. He would not have voted for the service if another could have been immediately obtained. Mr T. Mackenzie supported the original proposal, saying that as the House had decided to grant a contract it should be a decent one. A yearly contract Avas of no use to anybody. Sir Joseph Ward said that three year 9 was a reasonable thing. The amendment was defeated by 41 to 32. Another division was called on the question that the resolution be affirmed, this being agreed to by 40 to 31. In the Vancouver service resolution the words "three weekly" were struck out, there being a possibility of securing a fortnightly service. Mr Symes asked if the lavo services Avould be run together, and Avas informed that the boats would run alternately. The resolution was then adopted on the A'oicesThe resolutions Avere then reported to the House and agreed to.